Relic+2 Bonuses and Augments Thread

[Masamune]

I'm wondering what is the true effect of "Enhances Reward III" on Monster Jackcoat +2...

I discovered it doesnot even remove blind or slow...

Is it broken or is it enhancing something else?

[Byrthnoth]

Falkirk showed the opposite result in the Alla BST testing thread. He could remove everything with it, but he could also remove everything with the NQ relic and AF1 bodies. They may have messed it up and temporarily disabled it.

Here is his testing.

[Ophannus]

Probably boosts the regen effect?

[dasva]

Supposedly that's what feet do. Also it's augments reward. Weird never knew it told you in chat log it worked lol. I guess I'll look tomrorow

[Kirschy]

Tested the AF2+2 helm. Dark Seal /w 5/5 merits didn't increase duration on Drain II HP Bonus. It still lasted 60 seconds. However Dark Seal + Dread Spikes did last ~90 seconds. I only did one cast of each real quick, but it looks Drain II HP Bonus is separate from Dread Spikes/Absorb.

Lv99 Mythic looks to be +50% bonus to absorb spells as expected~

I'll do better testing later.

[Raelia]

Tested the AF2+2 helm. Dark Seal /w 5/5 merits didn't increase duration on Drain II HP Bonus. It still lasted 60 seconds. However Dark Seal + Dread Spikes did last ~90 seconds. I only did one cast of each real quick, but it looks Drain II HP Bonus is separate from Dread Spikes/Absorb.

Yeah I was kinda 'eeeh' on it affecting Drain II since it's sort of a secondary effect of the spell and conditional to exceeding your max HP with it, but that's great news for Dread Spikes.

What about Bio II duration then? And just to be silly and complete, /SCH Klimaform which is apparently DMS?

Also, can you just pop DS with +2aug on and switch to a DMS head, or do you have to precast in the +2aug too (which you should be anyway for the black magic -casttime), or is it horrifying and you have to fully cast in +2aug?

[Masamune]

Probably boosts the regen effect?

How to test this ? i didnot see anything about it on the allak link Byrth gave :s

[Byrthnoth]

The Alla guys test regen effect using two people in Ballista. One is BLU, the other is BST. You use Reward on your pet and then Voracious Trunk the regen effect onto the BLU.

[Raelia]

The Alla guys test regen effect using two people in Ballista. One is BLU, the other is BST. You use Reward on your pet and then Voracious Trunk the regen effect onto the BLU.

Absorb-Attri would work nicely too if you can't find a BLU with voracious trunk.

[dasva]

Or a thf with aura steal

[Ophannus]

So slightly unrelated but how about that book that was released in Japan that details all the hidden effects and properties of various equipment included AF3 stuff? Would love to know what Lancer's Cuissots+2 and SCH body+2 do to their respective abilities. Did anyone translate it yet?

[cdgreg]

So slightly unrelated but how about that book that was released in Japan that details all the hidden effects and properties of various equipment included AF3 stuff? Would love to know what Lancer's Cuissots+2 and SCH body+2 do to their respective abilities. Did anyone translate it yet?

Is this the book that's like $32 and all in JP? If we have someone who will dedicate themselves to translating the book into English I will seriously consider buying it, or BG can buy it with some of their fundraisings!

[Ophannus]

When the first version came out, ElmerThePointy translated a lot of it and we found some cool hidden effects on items never before noticed as well as the deciphering of equipment with various ambiguous "Enhances X effect" that wasn't known before like Drachen Greaves giving +10% Attack to Jump or Z Scythe having Dark Affinity on it.

[Kirschy]

Re-tested to verify, but augment on helm does indeed extend Dread Spikes to 90 seconds. I still find it close to useless, but I'm sure some others want it~

http://img855.imageshack.us/img855/1121/augmentss1.png

http://img848.imageshack.us/img848/8664/augmentss2.png

Best I could manage since I don't use Windower on Test Server

[Motenten]

Counterstance test (encompasses JA, Melee Gaiters/+1, and Melee Gaiters +2)

99 mnk/dnc with 5 Counter merits.

Vere//Thew
Ocel+1/Wiglen/Brutal/Aesir
Temple/Melee+2/Dark6%/Pagu
Atheling/Black/Tantra+2/Creek

Target: Orapodium
Kept between 1 and 4 mandies hitting me; never allowed attacks from sides or back.

Atma: Apoc, Mounted Champion, Perfect Attendance
Cruor buffs: HP only (after first two fights)

Test 1: No Melee Gaiters used for Counterstance
Note: 14 hits landed when Counterstance dropped and I didn't notice.

Melee Damage Taken
Player             Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
Motenten               32318   94.32 %   481/1187      26/92    66.91      3    96/121  111.00    0.62 %

Passive Defenses
Player             Evasion  Evasion %   Parry  Parry %   Counter  Counter %   Intimidate  Intimidate %
Motenten               694    41.14 %       0   0.00 %       497    50.82 %            0        0.00 %

Corrected values: 497 counters out of (497 + 481 - 14) = 964 non-evaded attacks, 51.56%
Confidence interval: 48.40% - 54.70%

Given that we know that accuracy affects counter rate, we can be fairly sure that this is not simply a 50% counter rate. Accounting for accuracy, this is most like a 55% counter rate * 95% = 52.25% effective counter rate.

Given 5 Counter merits, it appears that Counterstance provides a 50% counter rate on its own, and thus 55% with the merits. (Assuming that Counter merits add directly to the Counterstance counter rate; not tested.)


Test 2: Melee Gaiters +1 macro'd in only for JA use. If there's an increase in counter rate, don't need to test wearing them fulltime.

4 hits got through without Counterstance up

Melee Damage Taken
Player             Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
Motenten               27482   93.19 %   408/1374      13/88    67.07      3   101/110  106.67    0.74 %

Passive Defenses
Player             Evasion  Evasion %   Parry  Parry %   Counter  Counter %   Intimidate  Intimidate %
Motenten               779    43.23 %       0   0.00 %       601    59.56 %            0        0.00 %

Corrected values: 601 counters out of (601 + 408 - 4) = 1005 non-evaded attacks, 59.80%
Confidence interval: 56.74% - 62.79%


Conclusion 1: Gaiters do not have to be worn fulltime to gain the counter bonus. The high end of the confidence range without using the feet is below the low end of the range while using the feet, so it's clear that the bonus was applied.


Factoring accuracy out of the confidence interval range, the raw counter rate should be between 59.73% and 66.09%, which means both 60% (+5%) and 65% (+10%) are possible as the bonus on Melee Gaiters. Another 1000 samples should narrow the confidence interval enough to identify which is the actual value.


Test 2b: Continuing the above parse for another 1000 samples.

Additional corrections:
12 (+4 from first set) hits and 4 counters when counterstance dropped
25 hits when lost target and disengaged (took time to reengage, so a fair number of hits got through; happened twice)
3 counters from accidental PC activation

Melee Damage Taken
Player             Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
Motenten               58038   94.27 %   875/2896      13/88    65.99      8    88/114  103.63    0.91 %

Passive Defenses
Player             Evasion  Evasion %   Parry  Parry %   Counter  Counter %   Intimidate  Intimidate %
Motenten              1705    44.74 %       0   0.00 %      1204    57.91 %            0        0.00 %

Counters: 1204 - 4 - 3 = 1197
Hits: 875 - 41 = 834

Counter rate: 1197 / (1197+834) = 58.94%
Confidence interval: 56.78% - 61.06%
Factor out 95% acc:
Confidence interval: 59.77% - 64.27%


From this we can exclude +10%. +5% is still possible, but it's at the very edge of the confidence interval range. Best guess is that it's actually +7% or +8%. The observed rate divided by 95% accuracy gives 62.04% as the nominal total counter rate, which would be +7% compared to not using Melee Gaiters. The first 1000 hits gave a value that would result in 62.95% nominal counter rate, or +8%.




Upgraded Melee Gaiters to +2 for third test.


18 hits without counterstance
8 hits disengaged

Melee Damage Taken
Player             Melee Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss   M.Low/Hi    M.Avg  #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C.Avg     Crit%
Motenten               48867   89.71 %   733/2777      29/89    66.38      6    89/111  101.50    0.82 %

Passive Defenses
Player             Evasion  Evasion %   Parry  Parry %   Counter  Counter %   Intimidate  Intimidate %
Motenten              1494    42.19 %       0   0.00 %      1288    63.73 %            0        0.00 %

Hits: 733 - 26 = 707
Counters: 1288
Counter rate: 64.56%
CI: 62.44% - 66.63%
CI/95%: 65.73% - 70.14%

There's definitely an increase. The upper bound of the confidence interval for the +1 test is below the lower bound for this test.

Am guessing the nominal counter rate is between 67% and 69%. Given that the +1 test indicated a value that was likely between 61% and 63%, it could be an additional 4% to 6% (and possibly up to 8%, but that seems quite unlikely).

It's rather difficult to pin down with this sample size (and I'm not up for the massive test that would be necessary to really nail the values), but given the patterns seen in other relic+2 gear I'm going to guess that the Melee Gaiters/Melee Gaiters +1 have an 8% enhancement, and that the Melee Gaiters +2 have a 12% enhancement.



Minor implications:

Counterstance w/Melee Gaiters +2, 5 Merits and level 99 Spharai would reach the counter rate cap of 80%.

[Ophannus]

Would love to see some testing on Spikes with RDM AF2+2 legs to see:

1) If unlike the base NQ AF2, do we need to keep the legs on to maintain the bonus.

2) Is the specific bonus to each spike spell enhanced?)Blade=damage/Ice=more potent para/Shock=higher% at stun proc.

[pancakesandsex]

Do the AF2+2 thf pants have to be equipped for the JA use AND the initial hit, or just the JA for the feint bonus to work?

[Kincard]

Oh right, Assassin's Culottes +2. BGWiki says they might have Steal+6 on them, but they don't. Whoever made that edit must've been looking at the Enmity+6, which is present on the English version of the item. Don't know about the Feint augment- either way the pants really arn't worth getting.

[pancakesandsex]

Oh right, Assassin's Culottes +2. BGWiki says they might have Steal+6 on them, but they don't. Whoever made that edit must've been looking at the Enmity+6, which is present on the English version of the item. Don't know about the Feint augment- either way the pants really arn't worth getting.

Well it's too late for that, it's already done and upgraded. I'm not super sure how I'd go about testing that though.

[Kincard]

Eh, wasn't trying to say you shouldn't have gotten them, I just think it's not worth the trouble myself (XPing in Dynamis is the worst). I guess they're okay Mercy Stroke legs if you don't have Whirlwind Dirs or Thaumas, dunno what else you'd use them for though.

I imagine the easiest way to test them is to find something that would still con high evasion near the beginning of the feint effect (Or maybe towards the end? Would have to time it), and then drop to low/neutral evasion if you have the augment in effect. -50 more evasion should be enough so that you don't have to be really precise with the timing. I'm not sure that's actually possible though, I recall someone using level 0 staff on a 90 monster and having it drop to low evasion from high evasion before.