Legion - info and strategies

[MeldityofGilgamesh]

can someone please verify the difference between entering with 18 or 36 people? the page says the fight scales up with more people but i don't exactly understand how the fuck were supposed to clear these 4 halls with 18 people with the difficulty we been having (most of the melee had about 40-50% accuracy including one with gungnir)

[Churchill]

That guys sucks then, I parsed fine for accuracy with Amano on the first wave of 3 in Kings/Dvergr chamber.

[MeldityofGilgamesh]

That guys sucks then, I parsed fine for accuracy with Amano on the first wave of 3 in Kings/Dvergr chamber.

if a drg with +35 acc job traits and a +40 acc relic and 40 acc in gear relic sucks then i don't know what exactly is pro.

it feels like its forced evasion upon mobs. like certain particular mobs are getting 50% evasion no matter what.

[Slycer]

can someone please verify the difference between entering with 18 or 36 people?

I don't think anyone can. It's the same amount of mobs either way (three in the first wave, three in the second, and presumably a third wave with the last mob as the boss, though no one has gotten that far). I'd like to think that going in with 18 would change.. something.. but I don't see it. Frankly I think the only difference is whether the guy gives you one or two legion passes. The only possible difference would be that the mobs have less HP or slightly reduced stats or whatever. This would be a good question for the SE community team, though, I feel like this is something simple enough they might actually be able to get a straightforward answer to. It would be greatly shortsighted for the event to not scale as they haven't added anything that's required anywhere near 36 people since Einherjar and the player base is clearly quite a bit smaller now.

[MeldityofGilgamesh]

That guys sucks then, I parsed fine for accuracy with Amano on the first wave of 3 in Kings/Dvergr chamber.

seems like certain mobs get forced evasion, but maybe the parse is screwed, i'm just going by what the ls member parse says.

[Slycer]

It's possible that all the mobs have the same drop sets in each hall, with the drop rate improving somewhat as you kill them (i.e. nothing exclusive to any mob in particular). That would effectively be the scaling right there because you can get the area clear trophy just from killing the first three mobs which is doable (not easily doable, but doable) with around 18. Now that I think about it, this is actually pretty likely (meaning the mobs themselves probably don't scale at all). That being said, it's going to be tough to find groups of 18 who are willing to throw 360,000 gil into a black hole over and over for a low chance of getting one, maybe two drops, that have a good chance of being fairly useless anyway.

[Alarial]

My interpretation thus far is that the mobs do not scale, but rather "clearing the chamber" just means getting the initial trophy, which a solid 18 man alliance should achieve. Having 36 people allows you to farm the chamber further (2nd wave and final boss). We're attempting again tonight with a solid 36 group, to see if we can at least take a shot at the final boss for one of the chambers. Planning a solid run with dual embravas, optimal melee/mage setup, and everyone 2 houring should give us a shot. The timing and hp/stats of these mobs really does make it a challenge (for now at least).

[Ophannus]

With 18 elite players with top notch 99 relics and empyreans using all sorts of shennanigans it took us a little over 17 minutes to clear the first wave. 5-6 BLMs and a PUP and RDM nuke the shit out of the turtle while pinning it around the pillar(PUP's BLM pet was actually doing a solid 2.7-3.4k nukes on it and as a RDM I was able to easily land 1.8-2.3k blizzards). Aegis PLD holds the wyrm in the corner with a RNG DoTing it down and another Aegis PLD holding Behemoth in another corner, DDs are running in to skillchain turtle when it stops to cast. When turtle dies everyone moves to wyrm and it dies super fast too. Behemoth actually takes the longest since it isnt particularly squishy to magic or physical damage.

Super buffed up Torcleaver/Resolutions barely breaking 1.2-1.4k and nukes doing for about 1500-2k. Meteor really hurts and destroys melee, behemoth is unstunable so melees NEED MDT sets. I don't know what people were saying about them having high acc. Apoc DRK,Vere MNK and OAT lance drg parsing capped acc with RCB+1's and marches.

Second wave made short work of us. The turtle is still squishy to magic, taking like 2.5k-3k nukes from BLMs, his movement speed is still slow but now he casts really painful earth magic (Stoneja) and seems to favor Breakga more than the first wave's turtle did. The Elysmoth(dark behemoth) has regain and loves using Ecliptic Meteor(As painful as meteor but since it's a TP move there's no time to swap gear or run away) and it has Accursed Spikes which inflicts DDs with a HEAVY curse effect(brings you down to like 10% HP almost). The Zilant(Yilgeban clone) casts meteor and loves using Soul Douse which is basically Doom Breath and Dark Star which is AoE extreme damage with like fucking 30-40' range. Tetsudo Tremor stomp thing is really fucking painful and inflicts a long ass stun and ridiculously potent gravity that might as well be bind.



Overall notes about Hall of An:

Tortoise
-Uses Breakga/Sleepga/Addle and Silencga.
-Tortoise Song will take 3-4 buffs including food.
-Takes increased damage to magic, nuke with Ice; resists everything else.
-Melee are pointless on this(hit for 20-30 damage) except for SCing when it stops to cast.
-Low movement speed but hits like a truck(hit my 50% PDT RDM for 780ish and killed me with 1 double attack)
-Pinnable with poor pathing around the pillars, BLMs with gaiters can pingpong it.
-Remove addle on the BLMs, it's pretty potent and noticeably increases resists.

Wyrm
-An Aegis PLD should hold this till the BLMs are done. A RDM or SCH or basically anything with native heals can keep the PLD alive indefinitely don't necessarily NEED a WHM.
-Casts Blizzaja and stuff on the ground,no problem with Aegis. Gregale Wing does 600ish and moderately strong Paralyze. Sleet Blast does like 600-700ish as well.
-Flies around 70% but RNG and BLM takes it down quick. This mob is the least of your worries. He's squishy to physical and magic damage but doesn't take bonus damage like turtle does.

Behemoth
-You wanna leave this dude last because you'll need everyone on it. Meteor is unstunnable and casts in 1.5-2 seconds just long enough to throw on MDT stuff. Melees will probably die cuz it likes to Thunderbolt>Meteor. Has moderate defense(won't see any ridiculously high 2k+ WS on this mostly 1-1.5k at most it seems). Has resistance to magic slightly, nukes doing less than usual, nuke with thunder. Takes the longest to kill just because it's defenses are high and has high damaging TP moves/spells.

-Overall notes/tips
-Turtle and Wyrm are highly susceptible to Aspir/Drains.
-As a RDM I was easily able to land Paralyze II/Slow II/Blind II/Poison II/Addle. Immune to Sleep/Gravity/Bind/Break I suspect but didn't do further tests.
-BLM's MP management is important, should have a RDM and or BRD or COR for refresh, remember this isn't VW or Abyssea so no temp items really(except rarely from Elementals that spawn and only to the person who yields the killing strike)
-DDs absolutely must bring Reraise, no excuse.
-Echo drops echo drops echo drops and more fucking echo drops.
-Poison Potions for mages fighting Turtle.
-DDs don't bother with /NIN.
-I suspect skillchains will make a comeback for this, it's hard to TP burn this since these things have high defense and HP.

Going to try this again tonight with 18 BST/SMN/PUP and see how we do. I'm willing to wager that like Walk of Echos, BST pets will rape these mobs.We didn't have the survivability to take on wave 2 with a balanced setup and people with kraken clubs/relics/mythics/empyreans all 99.After wave 1 we had like 3-4 people weakened, mages under 200MP and a lot of melee in orange/yellow HP with almost all abilities spent. Wave 2 comes in 30 seconds after the last Wave1 mob dies and by then we were basically already spent. This is exceedingly hard even with 18 people.

[Slycer]

Going to try this again tonight with 18 BST/SMN/PUP and see how we do. I'm willing to wager that like Walk of Echos, BST pets will rape these mobs.We didn't have the survivability to take on wave 2 with a balanced setup and people with kraken clubs/relics/mythics/empyreans all 99.After wave 1 we had like 3-4 people weakened, mages under 200MP and a lot of melee in orange/yellow HP with almost all abilities spent. Wave 2 comes in 30 seconds after the last Wave1 mob dies and by then we were basically already spent. This is exceedingly hard even with 18 people.

Thanks for the detailed account. Your post basically supports my idea that the event itself does not scale. The scalability is only in the amount of mobs you can successfully tackle with groups of different sizes, since you can consider having "cleared" the area after killing just the first wave and getting a trophy (I'd assume you'd get another trophy for clearing the second wave, and possibly a third for clearing the boss). The edge, then, would be given to larger groups if they are capable of progressing further, as the drop rate (in theory) and Legion points increase with each kill. Assuming all drops within a particular hall can be from any of the waves, then it is indeed "scaled." If there are certain drops which are only from wave 2, or worse, only from the boss, then it is definitively not scaled. I suppose that remains to be seen. I don't think anyone has even killed anything from wave 2 yet, let alone gotten to the "boss."

All that being said, the difficulty is currently set to arcade machine "quarter eater" difficulty, and needs to be toned down a bit in the future to make this event successful/viable.

[Mahoro]

We actually had success doing Behemoth --> Adamantoise --> Wyrm. We found Behe to go down pretty quickly (albeit we had 36 people). We tried doing Behe after for the first run, but encountered some kiting issues in the relatively small arena. We just felt it was safer to clear the Behe first. The PUGs I went with before our LS run also did Behe --> Adaman --> Wyrm. As you said, the Wyrm is a cinch to hold with one healer and PLD.

[Fwahm]

Ophannus, are you sure Resolution wasn't missing any hits? I was doing a solid 2000-2500 per Resolution on that behemoth when I tried it.

[Churchill]

1~1.5 super buffed DD party (Embrava, 2xCOR, 2xBRD) could probably killed Behemoth in 2-3m, 6xBLM+COR(s)+SAMx2 can fight the Turtle (this will take the longest) and begin their kite/nuke after Behemoth goes down, 0.5DD party+6xBLM can fight Wyrm at the same time, make it fly, 2xRNG do Light, make it land, by this time Behemoth is dead and the pro DD party kills Wyrm in >1m, finish off Turtle. Anyone not on those previous jobs comes on BLM, COR, BRD, WHM and perhaps SMN. Melee is overrated for this chamber and what melee you do need can be performed by good ones with more support and taking less overall slots for the chamber. 2nd wave would probably be better to Ochain hold the Behemoth, start working the Turtle, and kill Yilbegan model first.

The exact opposite I think for the Dvergr chamber, instead of BLM's, bring PD and Embrava. People reported high -MDT on some of those mobs, while melee wise they were getting raped hard (minus not having the support to heal us). Have a super buffed DD party mow through Dvergr > Vampyr > Corpse, same order each time. PD for Dvergr, bring Holy waters as DD to remove necropurge if you are hit, and mow them down.

I didn't really get hurt by the spells at all, the hardest I got hit was by the 2nd wave Vampyr, Decollation for 14xx or so. Honestly the more pro DD's you have, and ability to buff and support them, the faster you could clear this chamber. First wave mobs I was having no accuracy problems and WS were hitting pretty hard, didn't get much of a chance to parse the 2nd wave but they do seem a bit stronger (though, I attacked them with no buffs mostly)

[Fodder]

Did Beh/Toitle/Isbegand wing last night. Cleared wave 1, timed out on wave 2.

This needs further testing, but it seems like Behemoth can be nearly "locked" into trying to keep flame armor on itself (or at least toned down a bit). It seemed like it would cast/TP back to back without stopping with flame armor on, but if we dispelled it over and over as soon as it put it up it would do almost nothing but spam flame armor. Can anyone corroborate this?

[Diomer]

That guys sucks then, I parsed fine for accuracy with Amano on the first wave of 3 in Kings/Dvergr chamber.

He was talking about wave 2 only of Hall of An that had the relic melee around 40~50% acc.

[Churchill]

I can see that for Wave2, they are probably T6/T2 strength in terms of stats and you don't have bravers and stalwarts.

[Kaisha]

Random rant, but these things have way too much fucking HP. Would have been a hell lot more fun if it was a gauntlet of deadly, but manageable lower-HP mobs so you can at least kill more than 5 in a single run.

[Slycer]

Well, they've said in the past that they purposefully lean towards making things too difficult at the start to see the reception, and then tweak the difficulty as necessary. Einherjar was really awful when it was first introduced, and then they changed the Odin conditions and drastically reduced the mobs' HP across the board, and it made the event much more approachable. I'd expect a similar response to this event at some point if the popularity wanes. I realize it's only one account, but like I said, there was no one in Legion at all when I was checking various times through the night (NA east coast primetime) the day after the update.

[Byrthnoth]

It took them (more than?) a year to nerf Einherjar to the point that most groups would do it. It took them months to nerf all-family linking even.

Maybe we'll be doing Legion in a year. More people are starting to do WoE now, and that has been out at least a year.

[Slycer]

It's too expensive to be tossing 360,000 gil at this event over and over again for a shot at one of a bazillion drops when people don't care about probably 75% of the bazillion drops, especially considering you only get 3 drop chances (if you're do "well") with a full alliance. I'm sure the drops are more specific than that, to hall, or wave, or mob, or whatever, but people are never going to figure it out with the event setup the way it is anyway.

Edit: The points accumulation rate also leaves a lot to be desired, and those rings are generally worthless anyway.

[Scrooge]

@Ophannus: Might I ask what buffs you were using besides rcb+1? Embrava or BRD? How many rolls?