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  1. #141
    Black Guy from Predator.
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    The Immortal Bill Duke

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    damnit kohan, you are my favorite nigga ever

  2. #142
    Old Merits
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    COLD AS ICE!

    I was being generous though

  3. #143
    King Bitcher of Bitchington
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    I'm for the legalization of it and just tax it like everything else. But I personally don't like to be around it and I will just do what I currently do, not socialize with it's users. Some of my friends are users and more power to em. I just limit my interaction with them. Same as I do with heavy drinkers.

    I'm a little on the fence with it's use at work. I feel my view on that topic is a little biased so I'm not sure I could give a really good opinion. I guess as long as they're not a detriment, it should be fine. The few times I smoked, even just a little, I got crazy paranoid so, I definitely don't think I should go into work with those types of feelings lol I'd need more information on weeds affect in the workplace to give a better opinion.

  4. #144
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jefe View Post
    Then it would be in their best interests to find another drug that doesn't have the adverse effects of marijuana. If you want to smoke some weed in the privacy of your own home, hey enjoy. However, it's a bad idea to have an individual using drugs with hallucinogenic properties before, during, and after work even if it's for 'medical reasons.'
    I am pretty sure that marijuana has never been considered a hallucinogenic drug nor does it have hallucinogenic properties. Interestingly enough in doing some quick research before posting this, the wiki says that uncured tobacco is considered hallucinogenic due to the extreme amounts of nicotine in it.

    Do you have any evidence or medical documentation proving that marijuana is a hallucinogen? Or any of the compounds that it has in it?

  5. #145
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    Unless you count this movie as scientific documentation, I don't think anyone believe marijuana is a hallucinogen.

  6. #146
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    I've been smoking for roughly 8 years now and I can safely say I've never ever had any kind of hallucinations when high from smoking or from edibles. However, the term hallucinogen is kind of broad. MJ is technically a hallucinogen because it changes your perception and can have an effect on your short term memory when intoxicated, but again it's not a hallucinogen in the general sense of seeing things/colors/ect.

  7. #147
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackice View Post
    I've been smoking for roughly 8 years now and I can safely say I've never ever had any kind of hallucinations when high from smoking or from edibles. However, the term hallucinogen is kind of broad. MJ is technically a hallucinogen because it changes your perception and can have an effect on your short term memory when intoxicated, but again it's not a hallucinogen in the general sense of seeing things/colors/ect.
    I could see how you might think that but I couldn't find a single website or documentation anywhere that lists marijuana as a hallucinogen, that is including all of the other medically accepted definitions of hallucinogen. Alcohol is also not considered a hallucinogen but oddly nicotine in extremely high doses is considered a hallucinogen of the sub group delirium.

  8. #148

    Quote Originally Posted by zoobernut View Post
    I am pretty sure that marijuana has never been considered a hallucinogenic drug nor does it have hallucinogenic properties. Interestingly enough in doing some quick research before posting this, the wiki says that uncured tobacco is considered hallucinogenic due to the extreme amounts of nicotine in it.

    Do you have any evidence or medical documentation proving that marijuana is a hallucinogen? Or any of the compounds that it has in it?
    My understanding of marijuana is that it has 2 primary compounds - THC and CBD. THC is the one that gets you "high," a psychoactive effect. Most people confuse "high" with "hallucinating." CBD just makes you feel good. Medical marijuana is supposed to have high amounts of CBD and relatively low in THC. Different strains of marijuana can be drastically different in the amount of either chemical it contains, which is why sometimes people experience drastically different effects, even if they have smoked for a long time.

    I reserve the right to have these two chemicals completely backwards, it's been a while since I really cared about the science of pot.

  9. #149
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blubbartron View Post
    My understanding of marijuana is that it has 2 primary compounds - THC and CBD. THC is the one that gets you "high," a psychoactive effect. Most people confuse "high" with "hallucinating." CBD just makes you feel good. Medical marijuana is supposed to have high amounts of CBD and relatively low in THC. Different strains of marijuana can be drastically different in the amount of either chemical it contains, which is why sometimes people experience drastically different effects, even if they have smoked for a long time.

    I reserve the right to have these two chemicals completely backwards, it's been a while since I really cared about the science of pot.
    I didn't want to stray too far from the point of this thread but I am referring to the technical/medical use of the term hallucinogen not what people "feel" or "think" about the drug. I was just trying to point out that referring to marijuana in any terms other than what it actually is just clouds the issue and is disingenuous. And that is one of the tools that was used to get marijuana to be illegal in the first place by exaggerating its effects and connecting it with other drugs by using false terms to describe it. (see propaganda films like Reefer Madness)

  10. #150
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoobernut View Post
    I am pretty sure that marijuana has never been considered a hallucinogenic drug nor does it have hallucinogenic properties. Interestingly enough in doing some quick research before posting this, the wiki says that uncured tobacco is considered hallucinogenic due to the extreme amounts of nicotine in it.

    Do you have any evidence or medical documentation proving that marijuana is a hallucinogen? Or any of the compounds that it has in it?
    Hallucinogenic properties, don't be confused, don't twist, don't misunderstand. Regarding research, sure. Go to the American Psychological Association and search 'marijuana,' also keep an eye for Tetrahydrocannabinol (THC).

  11. #151
    Blackice
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoobernut View Post
    I could see how you might think that but I couldn't find a single website or documentation anywhere that lists marijuana as a hallucinogen, that is including all of the other medically accepted definitions of hallucinogen. Alcohol is also not considered a hallucinogen but oddly nicotine in extremely high doses is considered a hallucinogen of the sub group delirium.
    http://www.acde.org/common/Marijana.htm

  12. #152
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackice View Post
    Thanks.

  13. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by zoobernut View Post
    Thanks.
    Unfortunately, that link is not what you're looking for. It depends upon the current federal classification of marijuana, which dishonestly labels it a true hallucinogen. When the substance was classified as illegal, it was not because the government's funded research proved as much; quite the contrary. Nixon commissioned the research with the intention of using it to reinforce the Controlled Substances Act, which was hastily signed two years earlier, and mostly due to racist, anti-Mexican motivations. Instead of fabricating something that served Nixon's needs, the scientists did their jobs, and produced something else; in response, he did not publicize the results.

    This is the closing statement from that report, which is from 1972, and is a part of the public record:

    In this Chapter, we have carefully considered the spectrum of social and legal policy alternatives. On the basis of our findings, discussed in previous Chapters, we have concluded that society should seek to discourage use, while concentrating its attention on the prevention and treatment of heavy and very heavy use. The Commission feels that the criminalization of possession of marihuana for personal is socially self-defeating as a means of achieving this objective. We have attempted to balance individual freedom on one hand and the obligation of the state to consider the wider social good on the other. We believe our recommended scheme will permit society to exercise its control and influence in ways most useful and efficient, meanwhile reserving to the individual American his sense of privacy, his sense of individuality, and, within the context of an interacting and interdependent society, his options to select his own life style, values, goals and opportunities.

    The Commission sincerely hopes that the tone of cautious restraint sounded in this Report will be perpetuated in the debate which will follow it. For those who feel we have not proceeded far enough, we are reminded of Thomas Jefferson's advice to George Washington that "Delay is preferable to error." For those who argue we have gone too far, we note Roscoe Pound's statement, "The law must be stable, but it must not stand still."

    We have carefully analyzed the interrelationship between marihuana the drug, marihuana use as a behavior, and marihuana as a social problem. Recognizing the extensive degree of misinformation about marihuana as a drug, we have tried to demythologize it. Viewing the use of marihuana in its wider social context, we have tried to desymbolize it.

    Considering the range of social concerns in contemporary America, marihuana does not, in our considered judgment, rank very high. We would deemphasize marihuana as a problem.

    The existing social and legal policy is out of proportion to the individual and social harm engendered by the use of the drug. To replace it, we have attempted to design a suitable social policy, which we believe is fair, cautious and attuned to the social realities of our time.
    http://www.iowamedicalmarijuana.org/.../nc1ch5.aspx#4

    Considering, ACDE does not rely upon valid research in relation to marijuana, as that website is founded on the idea that everything which isn't legal is an addictive substance, and extremely harmful. This is also what D.A.R.E. does.

    Every person today who firmly believes that it's right for marijuana to be illegal has been sorely misled. I am most disappointed when otherwise liberal individuals hold the substance's illegality in high regard, as they're upholding a decision that Nixon largely based on his racist standpoints.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nixon
    "We're going to [put] more of these little Negro bastards on the welfare rolls at $2,400 a family--let people like [New York Sen.] Pat Moynihan ... believe in all that crap. But I don't believe in it. Work, work--throw 'em off the rolls. That's the key ... I have the greatest affection for [blacks], but I know they're not going to make it for 500 years. They aren't. You know it, too. The Mexicans are a different cup of tea. They have a heritage. At the present time they steal, they're dishonest, but they do have some concept of family life. They don't live like a bunch of dogs, which the Negroes do live like."

    "You see: homosexuality, dope, immorality in general--these are the enemies of strong societies. That's why the communists and the left-wingers are pushing the stuff; they're trying to destroy us."

    "You know, it's a funny thing, every one of the bastards that are out for legalizing marijuana is Jewish. What the Christ is the matter with the Jews, Bob? What is the matter with them? I suppose it is because most of them are psychiatrists."
    http://www.thedailybeast.com/newswee...xon-years.html

    To every individual who fully believes that marijuana should remain illegal, I present to you the above reasoning that led to its current status. There is no valid research that successfully demonizes it; it was just a racist old man who held a lot of power at the time. Do you really feel comfortable standing with that?

    Getting back to the original question: the reason you didn't find documentation elsewhere is because it isn't a true hallucinogen. Oftentimes, marijuana users who experience hallucinations have also taken LSD, salvia, or psilocybin mushrooms; if they haven't, the most that marijuana will do in relation to your perception is strengthen colors, scents, and sounds. It never causes actual hallucination. Therefore, the most that it can be classified as is a "mild hallucinogen," if anything; however, as mentioned before, lumping it in with true hallucinogens is dishonest.

    Geez, just look at this. You guys are making me post detailed information regarding marijuana's legitimacy as if it were 2009 all over again!

  14. #154

  15. #155
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackice View Post
    Always.

  16. #156

    Apparently I'm racist now, too. My evil deeds grow!

  17. #157
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    Quote Originally Posted by arus2001 View Post
    Apparently I'm racist now, too. My evil deeds grow!
    No, but you do proudly hold company with a man who based such a decision strictly on ignorant and racist views, rather than valid scientific reasoning. If you feel comfortable with that, that is your choice.

  18. #158

    Quote Originally Posted by arus2001 View Post
    Apparently I'm racist now, too. My evil deeds grow!
    didn't you say you were going to hide in the corner? please do so.

  19. #159

    If you haven't noticed yet, I'm worried more about social consequences. The easily memed "Think of the children!" Stupid things I've seen people do to get their fixes. Whatever, none of that matters to you because it can't be whipped up as a lab result, yet still happens. But let's say Colorado gets their ducks in a row here and things are being sold. At what percentage of drug-related crime increases (theft of, theft of other items to sell and buy, injuries/murders during theft, traffic accidents, cases of neglect) would you step back and say, "Well, maybe this wasn't such a good idea..."? None of which are exclusive to gender or race. Or is this where we fall back to the hardass stance and just proclaim Darwinism? My utter dislike of mind altering substance consumption for recreational purpose is one thing, but they're also negatively linked to other things I don't want to see happening to anyone. Evil paved with good intentions? I'm not inclined to believe so given the vast majority's lack of need for the stuff.

    didn't you say you were going to hide in the corner? please do so.
    If she wants to be a fuckwit and imply all naysayers are all racist curmudgeons, that's her right. They're not. Just as I know not all pot smokers are lazy do-nothing hippies. There are bad people on both sides.

  20. #160
    Ridill
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    cannabanoids are their own "section" of hallucinogens

    i.e.
    pshychadelics - lsd etc.
    deleriants- moonpod seeds
    dissociatives - pcp, salvia, nitrous

    etc.

    cannabanoids- thc, marinol, the nasty shit they sprayed on herbs

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