Summoner's Pigaches +2 (enahnced avatar attack testing)

[calinz]

Neither wikis, nor FFXIAH seem to have info on exactly what the enhanced avatar attack stat on this piece of gear does:

http://cdn.bluegartr.com/wiki/thumb/...escription.png

So, I decided to conduct a few parses of my own. Haven't finished the parse yet, but if anyone has any suggestion on how to correctly, or more accurately conduct this test please speak up! I've never parsed anything before, so I'm probably doing it wrong, but here's what I'm currently targeting:

Enemy: Fire Elemental (due to their melee dmg resistance so I can get more hits per mob done)
Area: Ve'Lugannon Palace
Avatar: Leviathan
Program: KParser
Methodology: 1000 melee avatar hits with the Pigaches, and then the same without

[Byrthnoth]

Fire Elementals have a level range (and thus a defense range), which you'd have to control for if you were using more than one of them. Their reduced PDT does make them last longer, but it reduces your ability to detect a damage change. Also, previous sources of "Avatar: Enhances Attack" have only affected blood pacts.

I'd use EM Bluffalo on Abyssea - Uleg (we know their stats) and just let Ifrit get about 300 hits in each condition to see if this piece affects avatar melee hits. If you don't see a change, the effect is either incredibly weak or it's BP only.

[calinz]

Without atma and cruor buffs? Also, how can I force EM buffalo to spawn? They're usually VT iirc?

[dasva]

Pretty sure they go down to DC but it's just a matter of killing them or leaving them to get them up or down. I'd put up defensive atmas or maybe triple attack or haste to speed things up

[Byrthnoth]

You could use HP VIT/AGI/MND/INT/CHR cruor buffs, but I'd recommend against STR/DEX. For Atma, I'm push for Regen ones. The Bluffalo normally spawn at EP to a 99. If you level them up, they'll start respawning as EM/T.

You should do the low-attack sample first. There will be (probably three) numbers that show up much more frequently than any others. This will be very obvious if you go to "Offense Details" on your parser. You do not want those high-frequency numbers to be the highest three you get, because it means that adding attack might not increase your cap.

[calinz]

Ok then, here's the data I collected as per the suggested method of using Buffalo in Abyssea:

Enemy: Bluffalo [Even Match]
Area: Abyssea - Uleguerand
Avatar: Ifrit
Atma: Ebon Hoof [HP+30%, Enhance Sleep: Superior], Mounted Champion [VIT+50, Regen+20, Enmity- when taking damage: Minor], Vicissitude [DEF+40, MDB: Minor, Regen+15]
Cruor buffs: HP/MP/VIT/AGI

Results without any feet at all:

Spoiler: show

Melee Damage
Player            Melee Dmg  Abs'd.Dmg   Net Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss    M.HR %   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi  M+0.Avg  M-0.Avg
Ifrit                 58083          0     58083  100.00 %   1000/166   85.76 %   85.76 %     38/65    49.26    49.26

Ifrit
  Melee
         38:    8
         39:   22
         40:   20
         41:   22
         42:   25
         43:   32
         44:   26
         45:   33
         46:   27
+        47:  126
 ^       48:  104
         49:  107
         50:   21
         51:   26
         52:   15
         53:   24
         54:   15
         55:   17
         56:   23
         57:   17
         58:   21
         59:   18
         60:   11
         61:   16
         62:   10
         63:   15
         64:   10
         65:    5

Melee Crit Damage
Player                #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C-0.Avg     Crit%
Ifrit                   184    76/118     97.22   18.40 %

Results with feet on:

Spoiler: show

Melee Damage
Player            Melee Dmg  Abs'd.Dmg   Net Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss    M.HR %   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi  M+0.Avg  M-0.Avg
Ifrit                 59398          0     59398  100.00 %   1000/161   86.13 %   86.13 %     39/66    50.42    50.42

Ifrit
  Melee
         39:    9
         40:   12
         41:   24
         42:   22
         43:   21
         44:   23
         45:   24
         46:   19
         47:  128
         48:  106
+^       49:  132
         50:   16
         51:   19
         52:   18
         53:   18
         54:   21
         55:   15
         56:   19
         57:   25
         58:   24
         59:   18
         60:   13
         61:   15
         62:    8
         63:   23
         64:   17
         65:   13
         66:    8

Melee Crit Damage
Player                #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C-0.Avg     Crit%
Ifrit                   190    78/116     97.66   19.00 %

Conclusion: I'm guessing slight deviation of 1 point in average damage is normal? Or is that an acceptable increase to melee damage affected by the feet? To me, it appears that they really do not affect avatar melee attacks much/at all, and thus are not a viable option to have avatars TP in.

Now... how would I go about testing the effect of the Summoner's Pigaches +2 on physical Blood Pacts? Thinking some low level one-hit BP and then do 300 BPs with and without them, since I don't think I'll have the sanity for more(damn BP timer). Possibly Punch?

[Byrthnoth]

Considering your coverage, I'm inclined to believe the +1 damage to both limits was the result of the feet. Ifrit had a base damage of 47 in your test (the 3-number frequency spike is 1.0 pDIF). Based on the presence of two of the pDIF distribution's three signatures, I'm inclined to treat Avatar pDIF the same as normal melee pDIF with a higher Ratio cap (4.0 for melee hits).

67/47 = 1.125 Ratio - Less than this for AF2+2 feet
66/47 = 1.104 Ratio - Equal to or more than this for AF2+2 feet, less than this without
65/47 = 1.083 Ratio - Equal to or more than this without AF2+2 feet

40/47 = 1.122 Ratio - Less than this with AF2+2 feet
39/47 = 1.1035 Ratio - Less than this without AF2+2 feet, equal to or more than this with them
38/47 = 1.085 Ratio - Equal to or more than this without AF2+2 feet

The most you can get from that (1.085 to 1.122) would be +0.037 Ratio, which would be about 19 attack.
The least you could get from that is something like 1 Attack.

I'd say +10 or +15 are probable. Now that we know where the 1.0 pDIF spot is, you can probably get better results if you repeat the test using STR Atma that don't also give attack, like VV and Harvester. This will pump up your Avatar's base damage and improve the test's resolution.

Edit: I should note I used the equations from here:
http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/108...=1#post5307037
and that the regression of the Avatar pDIF range back to essentially the same values supports my initial assumption that Avatars (and by extension pretty much all monsters) use player pDIF functions with a different ratio cap. It still might not be entirely correct, but it looks pretty right.

[calinz]

Many thanks for the analysis of the data, because I couldn't really make heads or tails beyond the 1 dmg difference (terribad at maths). I will try to repeat the test sometime tomorrow with STR atma and cruor buffs then. This could possibly mean that it's not exclusive to physical BPs after all. I guess that means I'll have to test Auspex Gages too. The wording on them is different, but I'm assuming they behave the same.

EDIT: Some work turned up, won't be able to repeat the test today, tomorrow is iffy.

[calinz]

I'm back! And here are the results of the test with the use of STR this time:

Enemy: Bluffalo [Even Match]
Area: Abyssea - Uleguerand
Avatar: Ifrit
Atma: Harvester[STR+30, Double Attack: Major, Resist Sleep: Major], Mounted Champion [VIT+50, Regen+20, Enmity- when taking damage: Minor], Voracious Violet [STR+50, Double Attack: Major, Regain+2]
Cruor buffs: All cruor buffs

no feet:

Spoiler: show

Melee Damage
Player            Melee Dmg  Abs'd.Dmg   Net Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss    M.HR %   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi  M+0.Avg  M-0.Avg
Ifrit                 84384          0     84384  100.00 %   1000/131   88.42 %   88.42 %     57/95    72.12    72.12

Ifrit
  Melee
         57:    1
         58:   10
         59:   10
         60:   16
         61:   10
         62:   22
         63:   12
         64:   23
         65:   94
+        66:   95
         67:   86
 ^       68:   84
         69:   15
         70:   11
         71:   20
         72:   12
         73:   20
         74:   20
         75:   22
         76:   12
         77:   10
         78:    7
         79:   12
         80:   17
         81:   13
         82:   12
         83:    6
         84:   22
         85:   14
         86:   13
         87:   12
         88:    9
         89:    7
         90:   23
         91:   22
         92:   14
         93:    4
         94:    7
         95:    3

Melee Crit Damage
Player                #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C-0.Avg     Crit%
Ifrit                   178   111/168    141.02   17.80 %

with feet:

Spoiler: show

Melee Damage
Player            Melee Dmg  Abs'd.Dmg   Net Dmg   Melee %   Hit/Miss    M.HR %   M.Acc %  M.Low/Hi  M+0.Avg  M-0.Avg
Ifrit                 85757          0     85757  100.00 %   1000/152   86.81 %   86.81 %     58/97    73.52    73.52

Ifrit
  Melee
         58:    1
         59:    8
         60:   14
         61:   18
         62:   14
         63:   19
         64:   20
         65:   79
+        66:   99
         67:   76
 ^       68:   85
         69:   14
         70:   15
         71:    8
         72:   12
         73:   16
         74:   16
         75:   15
         76:   12
         77:   14
         78:   17
         79:   15
         80:   12
         81:    8
         82:   11
         83:    9
         84:   14
         85:   14
         86:   22
         87:   19
         88:   20
         89:   13
         90:   12
         91:   17
         92:   12
         93:   16
         94:   15
         95:   10
         96:    6
         97:    2

Melee Crit Damage
Player                #Crit  C.Low/Hi   C-0.Avg     Crit%
Ifrit                   181   112/170    141.12   18.10 %

Also, can we assume that whatever this increase is, is also the same for physical Blood Pacts, applied on a per hit basis?

[calinz]

No one wants to math this out? I did all the testing work, but I have a D in maths. I can't do it.

Oh well, at least I proved that it does affect melee attacks as opposed to what Byrth said about "previous sources of "Avatar: Enhances Attack" have only affected blood pacts". Considering this is one of the first pieces of gear that had that stat on it, I'm inclined to believe "previous tests were wrong". Remember, AF2 came out in like 2005, before even Sacrifice Torque.

Also, if we can pinpoint the exact increase, this will determine if Shedir Crackows is better for all Blood Pacts, or only for the magical non-5/5 BPs.

[Byrthnoth]

D is 65 this time. Assuming the sample size is large enough that you're seeing the max and min values for each condition (only one observed value makes this assumption seem a little rough) and using all the same assumptions as last time:

98/65 = 1.20615 : Less than this with AF2+2 feet
97/65 = 1.1923 : Equal to or more than this for AF2+2 feet
96/65 = 1.1769 : Less than this without AF2+2 feet
95/65 = 1.1615 : Equal to or more than this without AF2+2 feet

59/65 = 1.1713 : Less than this with AF2+2 feet
58/65 = 1.1579 : Equal to or more than this for AF2+2 feet, less than this without
57/65 = 1.1445 : Equal to or more than this without AF2+2 feet

As you can see, something isn't working here. If I remove the secondary randomizer the whole thing falls apart.

So something is obviously not working.We probably can't get much more out of this test than what you concluded until we understand Avatar pDIF better. However, it's probably important to point out that this item in particular has not been around for years. It was added recently and may behave differently from AF2/+1. Also, STR+80 (Attack +40?) increased your Avatar's Ratio by more than the AF2+2 feet.

[Byrthnoth]

oops

[CoreyX]

Cruor buffs don't affect avatars or other pets, by the way.