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  1. #1
    blax n gunz
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    Jay Wilson @ GDC: Auction House "hurt the game"

    File this one under 'no fucking shit'

    Diablo 3 Director Jay Wilson: Auction Houses 'really hurt' game

    Former Diablo 3 Game Director Jay Wilson admitted during a talk at GDC 2013 in San Francisco that both of Diablo 3's Auction Houses (both the real-money and the in-game gold item auction house) "really hurt the game." Wilson said that before Blizzard launched the game, the company had a few assumptions about how the Auction Houses would work: He thought they would help reduce fraud, that they'd provide a wanted service to players, that only a small percentage of players would use it and that the price of items would limit how many were listed and sold.

    But he said that once the game went live, Blizzard realized it was completely wrong about those last two points. It turns out that nearly every one of the game's players (of which there are still about 1 million per day, and about 3 million per month, according to Wilson) made use of either house, and that over 50 percent of players used it regularly. That, said Wilson, made money a much higher motivator than the game's original motivation to simply kill Diablo, and "damaged item rewards" in the game. While a lot of the buzz around the game attacked the real money Auction House, "gold does much more damage than the other one does," according to Wilson, because more players use it and prices fluctuate much more.

    "I think we would turn it off if we could," Wilson said during his talk. But the problem is "not as easy as that;" with all of Blizzard's current players, he says the company "has no idea" how many players like the system or hate it. Blizzard, Wilson said, doesn't want to remove a feature that lots of players will be unhappy to see go. But he did say that the team is working on a viable solution, without giving any other details about what that would be like.
    A few points of interest for me. Is Jay telling the truth? That he is simply stupid, instead of greedy and lazy when it comes to itemization design and the basic reward structure of the game? And is there still time to simply patch the problem rather than make some fundamental changes of the 'next expansion' stripe? What can they change that doesn't look like further backpedaling on 'drop rates are fine' and 'we won't change how MF works?'

    I know I lost a lot of interest in the game when it became clear my gear was only advancing by replaying certain difficulties over and over again, meaning acts II and III ad infinitum. I mean, how much do I really want to listen to Zultan Kulle or Azmodan's bullshit? I quit when I realized I was never going to convince my friends to do the same, let alone blow everyone's gold at the AH just so we could level the playing field efficiently once things got harder for everyone.

  2. #2

    To this day, I still stand behind the thought that the AH benefits the seller far more than the buyer. Shit's stupid expensive and out of reach because there's no up-front listing fee. In turn, all it takes is one guy putting up an item with X Stats at some ludicrous price, then someone getting similar going doing the same, minus a little to sell more quickly. Repeat this until you get enough up and people going, "Gee, that's what they sell for!" and the cycle perpetuates unless there's enough saturation to actually drive down costs. Add a touch of flippers being greedy shits thinking they know true values and imposing that and... well, hello shitty AH.

    Otherwise, the presence of the AH beats the snot out of spamming channels hoping for a buyer. People can still do that if they want, but I think killing monsters should be the bigger draw. Shitty itemization is its own contributing factor, but not intrinsically a flaw of the AH.

  3. #3
    Brown Recluse
    Sweaty Dick Punching Enthusiast

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    Fuck that Loser

    He is right though. I haven't played Echoing fury/Skorns in a couple weeks. No reason too.

  4. #4
    Old Merits
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    The AH is the only reason I kept playing after normal. Made about $60, paid for MoP in Blizz cash and lost interest.

    Edit: I got it for free with a wow sub, but they made at least $10 off of me from their cut of AH sales.

  5. #5
    Bagel
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    It's all about greed. He can disguise it how he likes but it's always been about greed. They allowed the GAH the time to ramp up people using the AH system so that when they implemented the RMAH, it would take off and make them additional profit. Oh well, the game is dead to me at this point until an expansion or something else new shakes it up.

  6. #6
    Ironing this Thread
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meko View Post
    It's all about greed. He can disguise it how he likes but it's always been about greed. They allowed the GAH the time to ramp up people using the AH system so that when they implemented the RMAH, it would take off and make them additional profit. Oh well, the game is dead to me at this point until an expansion or something else new shakes it up.
    I haven't played since a week or two after RMAH came out. They nerfed my only farm spots on my severely under geared DH. Got lucky and some idiot bought a chest off me for $100 but I had it under blizzard money cause I was just screwing around. Got a few Faction Changes/Transfers out of it during sale weekends and thats that.

  7. #7
    Nikkei's Hoe
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    I think it's true and false. The auction house itself is good in theory, the problem is there was a major lack of gold sinks before the new crafts and even now there isn't enough gold sink to keep inflation from running out of control. No centralized method of trading hurts everyone. Trading in Diablo 2 was a nightmare, and I hear trying to find what you need in PoE is the worst part of the game. Unfortunately, I think it's probably too late for any amount of gold sink to save the economy now. So holding out hope for the next patch when they're going to start making hunting for your own upgrades an easier process.

  8. #8
    The Shitlord
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    why do companies consistently under-estimate gamers? First Bioware thinking it would take ~6 months for all but the most hardcore gamer to reach max level (lol yeah right) in TOR, now this? realluh? have these guys never played their games' genres before?

  9. #9
    Ridill
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    Yeah, some of the stuff like ferrets farming billions for people in a matter of days, and only the method being fixed, nothing being done about the actual raw quantities of gold was absolutely mindboggling.

    I mean, just that one thing was enough to utterly and completely fuck the economy, and they did absolutely nothing whatsoever to curb it.


    In fact I'd almost say it looks like a conscious decision that it was a perfect opportunity to set the vast majority of players well behind the curve and push them towards the AH.

  10. #10
    Ksandra Needs To Post Tits
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    Step 1) Release ladder system with fresh economy and changes
    Step 2) ???
    Step 3) Profit. (again.)

  11. #11
    Vuitton
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    I think it's true. The AH made Hardcore EZ-mode when paired with items with reduced level requirements. There are level 42 weapons with 1300 DPS ffs. Check my out my weapon here:

    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/I.../hero/31855275

    A level 47 item with 1200 dps. I face rolled through nightmare without blinking.

  12. #12
    The Defense is ready, Your Honor
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    Quote Originally Posted by BaneTheBrawler View Post
    why do companies consistently under-estimate gamers? First Bioware thinking it would take ~6 months for all but the most hardcore gamer to reach max level (lol yeah right) in TOR, now this? realluh? have these guys never played their games' genres before?
    They're only underestimating gamers in terms of how badly we'll make them look silly with their concepts. They're overestimating gamers' abilities to stay away from their faulty-ass products, due to a combination of lust for the franchises and through obscuring the flaws of their products within heavy marketing.

    It doesn't matter how badly their content is received when they make so many fucking box sales off the back. He gets to say this now, because he laughed his way to the bank, and we aided him - again.

  13. #13

    Quote Originally Posted by Vuitton View Post
    I think it's true. The AH made Hardcore EZ-mode when paired with items with reduced level requirements. There are level 42 weapons with 1300 DPS ffs. Check my out my weapon here:

    http://us.battle.net/d3/en/profile/I.../hero/31855275

    A level 47 item with 1200 dps. I face rolled through nightmare without blinking.
    Shit would still exist without the AH. People would instead just turn to auction sites or spam channels. The concept of the AH is fine, even needed. Just their execution of it blew.

  14. #14
    The Shitlord
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    Games inspire much more brand-loyalty than most other products. Most people don't really give a shit what brand of car they get, as long as the car fits their needs at an acceptable price, without being too ugly. But people need cars, at least in the U.S.. Games... games are a hobby. Gamers care much more about the manufacturer because it's something we do for fun... or because we're masochists. So when they turn out an awful game for an IP we love, a lot of us buy it anyway in the hopes that maybe they'll make it better. It's like the difference between Legos and Mega-Bloks. It's just not the same, dammit! Also, they actually don't work very well together. Anyway. There certainly are a lot of dumb gamers who just buy what's popular, but that applies to any group. For most of us, I think, it's an emotional thing that we just can't resist.

  15. #15
    Ridill
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucavi View Post
    They're only underestimating gamers in terms of how badly we'll make them look silly with their concepts.
    That's kind of a broad statement. That's only one of the many underestimations it took to put in pets that will farm shit for you without a bot, at increased drop rates, and even run around and loot shit for you...

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