CNN just now discovers that most athletes may not be getting good grades!

[thetruepandagod]

Plato was the wrestler by the by.

Pretty sure socrates was too, but i think he just did it at the gymnasium for fun, not nearly as skilled as plato.

the mind/body dichotomy would come with later thinkers and has produced the modern schism we see.

Mishima tried to bring back that synergistic hype too

[Meresgi]

Well it makes sense a nation of capitalist warmongers would pay those involved in physical activity more than those devoted to academia or collective learning.

Gotta keep the bread 'n circuses going. 'Murica!

Spoiler: show

God bless it.... or else.

Spoiler: show

http://www.extremetech.com/wp-conten...ou-640x353.jpg

when they are surrounded by the accumulated knowledge of the human race at institutions designed to dispense it

Too bad they are shuttled into classes that require 0 or almost 0 work on their part to pass.

[arus2001]

How much of the money that comes in from high school football gets put back into non-athletic programs at the school?

This is something that will vary entirely based on the school.

For example, we just had a levy pass here where a certain amount of cents on the dollar would go to the school. I am assuming this is on top of whatever they get from the state/government as a public school. When we used to have the opened Ohio Edison/First Energy plant here, they also received funds from them, presumably for some level of tax break or requirement to proximity to the city. I dunno.

Realistically, the cash generated from sporting events is probably peanuts compared to this other stuff, but I do know that when we have a particularly successful football year, it's not uncommon to see the team getting new jerseys even if their old ones were still in good condition. The school I personally went to in the area was private, but we were also using shit from the 70s still. As a private school, we were also prohibited from post-season due to fears of "recruiting" which basically meant we lost out on a potential 3-4 games of additional revenue generation with ticket sales, raffle, merchandise, and concessions.

Anyway, reasons for the earlier mentioned levy basically included more teacher pay, bus fuel/maintenance, and things for the building itself. I always find myself a bit skeptical about their fund use as, aside from the noted jersey upgrades, the only addition the school has actually received was in the form of work out requirement that they removed a library to install. They're still using the same aged hardwood for the basketball court that was there when I was a kid, as well as the same shitty bleachers. They've maybe upgraded the b-ball hoops to glass boards and maybe a new scoreboard. The secondary gym/stage is even worse. I suppose the main office has been renovated, but I have a hard time calling some new carpet and desks much of an overhaul. I also know they've retired some buses, instead consolidating a few routes. They no longer run cafeteria services, either, forcing kids to bring their own lunches, go home to eat, or eat along the main strip.

I could roughly compare to this the school I went to, but at the same time, they had a whole hell of a lot more to maintain. It cost about $7000 per day student a year, with dormers probably close to double that. I think the ratio was something about 350 day to 100 dorm. There were probably about 30 teachers on staff, then other things like secretaries, librarians, groundskeepers, and a couple computer guys. Meals were catered via contract, but you also paid for what you ate in a monthly bill. We had 3 dorm buildings at the time, 1 for girls, 1 old for boys, then one newer building. We had the main building with an adjoining gym and pool. We had the new gym with indoor track, 2 basketball courts, 2 volleyball courts, dance studio, weight room, and locker areas. They'd built a new art build a couple years before I graduated, too. There was also the admissions building. In terms of outdoor sporting, we had the baseball, soccer, and football fields, tennis court, practice areas used to either not tear up the fields or for gym classes.

So, in comparison, it's obvious my school had a hell of a lot more to offer its students, but those came at costs. On top of the admissions, we still had the fundraising aspects others use. They're also pretty aggressive in trying to collect from alumni or seeking donations from the more wealthy folks in the area, occasionally naming a building or field after them if given enough. A couple teachers had their houses on campus, but I suspect that came at a cost to their paycheck. The state didn't give them a dime. We rarely, if ever, had snow days even though the rest of the area could be cancelled. There was no official bus service, so that wasn't a cost. We did have a bus driver, though, who usually handled field trips or longer sport trips. Otherwise, we were often shoved into vans with a few coaches/teachers taking the wheel. Oh, and I totally forgot the "nature center" they have up near Starlake that basically every grade got sent to for a week to play camp, or in the case of football players like myself, beat themselves up 3 times a day, eat gruel in between, sleep in prison beds, then repeat for a week.

Obviously the school earns what it uses, but I'd almost say sports are self-sustaining, if not slight profit. Especially if you're recycling gear over the years. Our football stuff would get patched if it could be salvaged. Helmets would obviously get retreated to remove dents and get new paint. We did have our "good uniforms" that we used for homecoming or occasionally if the visiting team used light colors. The other sports would simply be lesser upkeep, with the students usually fronting their own bills with things like sneakers. Now that I think about, upkeep on the pool is probably the closest competition and I think we actually rented it out to other schools from time to time for their own other-division meets. But yeah, you can figure the basic expenses exist either way. When the sports do well, though, that's more money for any school to play with. Some may just save it for off years. Some may splurge. None of my teachers ever came out to say what they got paid, but I'm going to assume it wasn't enough. Maybe better than public, but still sad given their purpose.

[Howie Roary]

http://www.cnn.com/2014/01/07/us/nca...html?hpt=hp_t1



Not like it matters, they wont' retain any of that information anyways with all the concussions!

they should make it mandatory for these players to speak to the media

[Drex]

the problem is that they do get good grades. more specifically, grades they did not earn academically. a lot of nonathletes are like that to a lesser extent though, so focusing on athletes masks the systemic grade inflation problem.

[Bregor]

When a college's football and basketball problems do well, it does a lot of positive things for the school. Visibility goes up. Applications go up. Boosters donate more money. University presidents wouldn't hire coaches for multimillion dollar salaries just to win a few sportsball games. They pay those salaries because it's an investment in the school, and if the coach is successful they make their money back and then some. What the school chooses to do with those increased sports and booster revenues probably vary a lot though. I do like the fact that one or two varsity sports can fund the entirety of the rest of the college's athletic program, since not many people are going donate money or buy tickets to wrestling or field hockey.

And yes, the worst side effect of this culture is the celebrity student-athlete who can do no wrong. Even the term student-athlete is a joke since their sole purpose at their school ends up being performing on the field to sell tickets, merchandise, and please the alumni and boosters.

[GoggleHead]

I knew guys in college who were on the football team. They were also in the engineering department. No one survived engineering courses if they didn't know their shit.

[Quicklet]

At this point I would prefer NCAA teams to be divorced from universities altogether and just become some sort of junior pro league. Of course, this will never happen because it generates too much revenue for the top institutions.

[Correction]

This is something that will vary entirely based on the school.

For example, we just had a levy pass here where a certain amount of cents on the dollar would go to the school. I am assuming this is on top of whatever they get from the state/government as a public school. When we used to have the opened Ohio Edison/First Energy plant here, they also received funds from them, presumably for some level of tax break or requirement to proximity to the city. I dunno.

Realistically, the cash generated from sporting events is probably peanuts compared to this other stuff, but I do know that when we have a particularly successful football year, it's not uncommon to see the team getting new jerseys even if their old ones were still in good condition. The school I personally went to in the area was private, but we were also using shit from the 70s still. As a private school, we were also prohibited from post-season due to fears of "recruiting" which basically meant we lost out on a potential 3-4 games of additional revenue generation with ticket sales, raffle, merchandise, and concessions.

Anyway, reasons for the earlier mentioned levy basically included more teacher pay, bus fuel/maintenance, and things for the building itself. I always find myself a bit skeptical about their fund use as, aside from the noted jersey upgrades, the only addition the school has actually received was in the form of work out requirement that they removed a library to install. They're still using the same aged hardwood for the basketball court that was there when I was a kid, as well as the same shitty bleachers. They've maybe upgraded the b-ball hoops to glass boards and maybe a new scoreboard. The secondary gym/stage is even worse. I suppose the main office has been renovated, but I have a hard time calling some new carpet and desks much of an overhaul. I also know they've retired some buses, instead consolidating a few routes. They no longer run cafeteria services, either, forcing kids to bring their own lunches, go home to eat, or eat along the main strip.

I could roughly compare to this the school I went to, but at the same time, they had a whole hell of a lot more to maintain. It cost about $7000 per day student a year, with dormers probably close to double that. I think the ratio was something about 350 day to 100 dorm. There were probably about 30 teachers on staff, then other things like secretaries, librarians, groundskeepers, and a couple computer guys. Meals were catered via contract, but you also paid for what you ate in a monthly bill. We had 3 dorm buildings at the time, 1 for girls, 1 old for boys, then one newer building. We had the main building with an adjoining gym and pool. We had the new gym with indoor track, 2 basketball courts, 2 volleyball courts, dance studio, weight room, and locker areas. They'd built a new art build a couple years before I graduated, too. There was also the admissions building. In terms of outdoor sporting, we had the baseball, soccer, and football fields, tennis court, practice areas used to either not tear up the fields or for gym classes.

So, in comparison, it's obvious my school had a hell of a lot more to offer its students, but those came at costs. On top of the admissions, we still had the fundraising aspects others use. They're also pretty aggressive in trying to collect from alumni or seeking donations from the more wealthy folks in the area, occasionally naming a building or field after them if given enough. A couple teachers had their houses on campus, but I suspect that came at a cost to their paycheck. The state didn't give them a dime. We rarely, if ever, had snow days even though the rest of the area could be cancelled. There was no official bus service, so that wasn't a cost. We did have a bus driver, though, who usually handled field trips or longer sport trips. Otherwise, we were often shoved into vans with a few coaches/teachers taking the wheel. Oh, and I totally forgot the "nature center" they have up near Starlake that basically every grade got sent to for a week to play camp, or in the case of football players like myself, beat themselves up 3 times a day, eat gruel in between, sleep in prison beds, then repeat for a week.

Obviously the school earns what it uses, but I'd almost say sports are self-sustaining, if not slight profit. Especially if you're recycling gear over the years. Our football stuff would get patched if it could be salvaged. Helmets would obviously get retreated to remove dents and get new paint. We did have our "good uniforms" that we used for homecoming or occasionally if the visiting team used light colors. The other sports would simply be lesser upkeep, with the students usually fronting their own bills with things like sneakers. Now that I think about, upkeep on the pool is probably the closest competition and I think we actually rented it out to other schools from time to time for their own other-division meets. But yeah, you can figure the basic expenses exist either way. When the sports do well, though, that's more money for any school to play with. Some may just save it for off years. Some may splurge. None of my teachers ever came out to say what they got paid, but I'm going to assume it wasn't enough. Maybe better than public, but still sad given their purpose.

Thanks for this post btw.

I never really trusted that athletic programs were beneficial to academic budgeting.

[Mojo]

Is this really a problem?

[Meresgi]

Is this really a problem?

I can't read what you typed, I play college level football (also I had someone type this for me except for the sad faces..I can do those by myself)

[Jaybar]

Anecdotes - we all have them.

(And they smell)

[Correction]

Is this really a problem?

What's your argument for it not being a problem?

[Ksandra]

I honestly don't necessarily think it is a problem for college, but a problem for high school.

High school should be about teaching everyone as far as they can go in as many academics as possible. Colleges are more focused where students are going for a specific trade (yes I know Colleges give electives to also make "well-rounded" degree holders, but hear me out). Sports are just as much a job trade as any other colleges have to offer. And yes, sports help generate a lot of money for colleges, so they WANT strong players. Unfortunately, colleges are stuck getting strong players with shitty educational backgrounds because of high schools not focusing more on the kid's education.

With that said it is hypocritical to demand other majors to take all these electives and classes in order to pass, but sports players get degrees with the illusion they legitimately passed the class requirements.

I honestly would be more comfortable with colleges having sports players go for some kind of sports degree than say business or accounting. In the same way actors get drama degrees.

[Correction]

I don't think High School athletics programs are immune to NCAA-style exploitation of young talent at the complete expense of their ability to function as adults in non-sports business settings. I could be wrong, but given national headlines on the more sensational end we start them out stupid and aggressive early.

[Tarage]

I want a degree in GoodAtSports...

[Meresgi]

I honestly don't necessarily think it is a problem for college, but a problem for high school.
.

It's a problem for college, because there are classes that are purely an easy A for these students and others that require nothing of them. It also acts as a detriment to the rest of the students when you see someone who can't read the McDonalds menu passing each semester while you struggle. Sports degrees would probably be as pointless as drama degrees lol.

I don't think High School athletics programs are immune to NCAA-style exploitation

I agree, especially in most rural/suburban areas where sports are the main focus of the entire community. Where you can rape/kill people but if you throw dem ballz gewd, everyone will cover it up and look the other way. I mean if a town is willing to shrug off rape charges, they obviously arnt going to care if their star athlete can't do the ABC's

[quannum]

I could see a sports degree as an achievement of physical education. If someone has a bachelor's of football or whatever, they should be somewhat knowledgeable about football as a sport, business and the physical requirements (nutrition/training). something like that would stop grade inflation, but doesn't do anything about the conditions that create the all-star rapist.

[Ksandra]

I want a degree in GoodAtSports...

How is that any different than a lot of art degrees?

It's a problem for college, because there are classes that are purely an easy A for these students and others that require nothing of them. It also acts as a detriment to the rest of the students when you see someone who can't read the McDonalds menu passing each semester while you struggle.

...and I addressed this and stated that was the overall issue. But do not for one minute think this is limited to sports players fyi.

I worked in the drama department in college. Those kids often get a pass just as much as the others in gen ed classes, because the professors who teach gen ed will often pass students who they know are just taking it because it's required.

Sports degrees would probably be as pointless as drama degrees lol.

1. And yet one is ok and never attacked for existing, the other never gets mentioned.

2. Like most degrees, drama is all about networking. If you work at an Equity-joined school you work with people who are on and off broadway and television. I worked with a lot of broadway directors (including the original assistant director of Rent who became director when Larson died) during my run and some people may remember my stories about me working with the dude on the Chappelle Show and Small Wonder who was a creepo. I worked with a student actor who is now a regular on Saturday Night Live.

I don't say this to brag, but just to point out how huge this can help an actor make connections. Just like sports, getting seen performing goes a long way towards getting other roles.

I agree, especially in most rural/suburban areas where sports are the main focus of the entire community. Where you can rape/kill people but if you throw dem ballz gewd, everyone will cover it up and look the other way. I mean if a town is willing to shrug off rape charges, they obviously arnt going to care if their star athlete can't do the ABC's

Which is why I am against all of this happening in HS.

I do not doubt btw that colleges can and do have a hand in this. But I think that's the high school's issue.

[Meresgi]

1. And yet one is ok and never attacked for existing, the other never gets mentioned.

I think most people would say a degree in drama is worthless, much like a liberal arts degree lol.