That's it, I am leaving Coke and going to good old American Budlight.

[Ksandra]

Language is not part of culture.

Yes it fucking is. There are a lot of words spoken in English to convey things that other languages can't convey. This goes the same for every other language out there. It's about how they can express themselves.

And a lot of your posts sounds a lot like "I'm not racist, but..."

Saying "I'm not your enemy, but people who don't learn English after X years should get the fuck out" is still being the enemy no matter your reasoning.

[kuronosan]

I was hoping my first response would make it clear, but you've gone and done it again. I'm not the enemy just because I think differently than you do. Seriously try to understand what I'm saying instead of making irrational leaps and blatant strawman arguments.

Language is not part of culture. It's simply the tool used to communicate ideas between people, and then those people form beliefs, traditions, and achievements that make up culture. You can't have culture without language, but which language is used is irrelevant to that culture. Two Russians with perfect fluency in English are no less Russian if they end up preferring to communicate in English. They would be less Russian if they gave up the Russian traditions or beliefs they grew up with.

For the last time, I'm not trying to say America should be "All English All The Time". I'm saying all people should know English, and after that I don't give a fuck what they do.

Yes, I fucked up and said "talk to". My bad. Now stop playing semantics. Obviously I'm concerned with communication, and you can't do either written or verbal communication with someone who doesn't know your language. As far as your mail-carrier, I'm sure he knows English and if you didn't know any sign language, you could write him a note. When someone doesn't know your language at all, communication grinds to a halt. I'm not demeaning anyone by saying that it would be better if everyone knew English as a common language. If I lived in France, I would say everyone should learn French. It's pragmatism, not nationalism.

I'm not even going to bother addressing your insulting insinuations about why you think I'm not a progressive. I'll simply repeat that I'm not your enemy, and you should try harder to understand what I'm saying, instead of assuming that I'm an ignorant bigot because I have one idea that is commonly held by ignorant bigots (for completely different reasons).

I'm sorry, where in my post again am I insulting you?

And you think two people speaking the same language is the problem?

[Day]

Eh I agree with Blubba. Sue me.

[Pirian]

If you don't believe that culture and language are directly tied than it is game-fucking-over.

[Day]

I guess I could pick apart little things I disagree with and ignore his main pragmatic point and counter with a strawman but then I would feel quite silly.

[Headspace]

Can't wait until Spanish is the dominant language in America.

[Ksandra]

ignore his main pragmatic point

Hey, I asked for a source of his point being a problem here, but he hasn't returned with one.

No one is denying sharing a language is beneficial. We are saying it doesn't need to be regulated by law because it happens naturally anyways.

[Cream Soda]

@ this thread

[Cliron]

^^ about the gaydar of bigots.

I've rewatched the video and cannot see where my faggots be at.

[notorious bum]

Can't wait until Spanish is the dominant language in America.

Lived my whole life in FL and I honestly feel embarrassed for still not being able to speak more than a 5yr old Spanish kid. Never had any close friends to force me to use it enough, so lost the shit I learned in HS.

[ronin sparthos]

Honestly if you live in America and want to exist outside your little slice of back home, you're gonna learn English. Immigrant parents may be stubborn as fuck but children will be taught in English schools, the world speaketh the English and multiculturalism will still bend its knee to English. Speaking multiple languages is always a plus but the internet is our global marketplace and it is decidedly one language over all others.

I imagine the reason people are pushing on this is due to the failures in Europe regarding multiculturalism? You know, the large amount of immigrants poisoning fair Europe with their bankrupt beliefs. That could be America if we don't clamp down!

[Blubbartron]

Hey, I asked for a source of his point being a problem here, but he hasn't returned with one.

No one is denying sharing a language is beneficial. We are saying it doesn't need to be regulated by law because it happens naturally anyways.

If people are going to naturally learn English, and have been doing so for the entirety of American history, then why are companies only recently making their product packaging and advertisements multilingual? The simple, rational answer is that there is a growing demographic of people who don't know English at all, and they want to tap into that market. Ironically, the capitalistic force on these companies is actually removing the capitalistic force that was urging recent immigrants to learn English. As more companies do this in order to stay competitive, we'll reach a point where there is no longer any reason for them to learn English except if they're trying to get customer service type jobs.

If you want more empirical evidence, how about the Census Bureau?

Article from 2003 - between 1990 and 2000, the percentage of people that know English less than "very well" increased from 6% to 8%.

Article (unfortunately Republican) from 2013 - Those speaking a language other than English at home (7 percent), said they spoke English "not at all," including 9.7 percent of Chinese speakers and 9 percent of Spanish speakers. Another 15.4 percent of those who speak another language at home said they spoke English "not well."

[notorious bum]

only recently making their product packaging and advertisements multilingual?

lol

[Blubbartron]

lol

Recently as in the past decade or so. Did you see a lot of multilingual commercials or packaging when you were a child? I sure as shit didn't.

[Pirian]

Recently as in the past decade or so. Did you see a lot of multilingual commercials or packaging when you were a child? I sure as shit didn't.

Companies realizing an untapped market is not the same as it not being there to begin with.

This past decade, and the future of advertising in general, has been and is going to be all about market segmentation.

[Pirian]

Don't tell me, you thought those darn blacks started popping up in ads strictly because there was more of them? No, no they realized a potential untapped market and started marketing directly to them. The same thing is happening here.

[Ksandra]

If you want more empirical evidence, how about the Census Bureau?

Article from 2003 - between 1990 and 2000, the percentage of people that know English less than "very well" increased from 6% to 8%.

not very well =/= not at all. So, those people at least tried to learn some basic English.

Article (unfortunately Republican) from 2013 - Those speaking a language other than English at home (7 percent), said they spoke English "not at all," including 9.7 percent of Chinese speakers and 9 percent of Spanish speakers. Another 15.4 percent of those who speak another language at home said they spoke English "not well."

7 percent at not at all, but how does that compare to previous years? Where is this huge growth of not at all?

The rest is irrelevant. Being able to speak another language =/= not being able to speak English.

[archibaldcrane]

This guy thinks language is not a part of culture. Stop arguing with him.

[Blubbartron]

Companies realizing an untapped market is not the same as it not being there to begin with.

This past decade, and the future of advertising in general, has been and is going to be all about market segmentation.

I wasn't suggesting the market wasn't there - I was suggesting the market was so small that it wasn't worth the cost of marketing towards such a small demographic. Their isolation and difficulty in trying to function in America without English was the pressure that got a lot of them to learn English in the past. As proven by empirical data, that market grew enough that it makes up a substantial percentage (e.g. nearly 10% in Texas, which is a lot of people), and therefore worth the cost to market towards them. The pressure is diminishing, and therefore fewer people will bother learning English. That's why the argument of "people will learn English anyway" is null and void.

[Ksandra]

I was suggesting the market was so small that it wasn't worth the cost of marketing towards such a small demographic.

Ya it couldn't be possibly because marketing to them could have caused a shit storm they didn't want to deal with.

That never happ....oh wait...