Parents kicked son out of the house for being gay

[hey]

The idea is that few gay men have children, if for every 100 gay men, only 99 gay babies are born. Then after many generations there would be no more gays. So the idea that babies don't inherit a gay gene but rather develops the trait during pregnancy sounds more reasonable. Such as the case for downs.

Except it's not that simple. There is definitely not just one gene that decides if someone is gay or straight. Sexuality is not that simple. It's not just one or the other, with no other possibilities.

Also i guess you are forgetting that gay women exist.

[test123]

Except it's not that simple. There is definitely not just one gene that decides if someone is gay or straight. Sexuality is not that simple. It's not just one or the other, with no other possibilities.

Also i guess you are forgetting that gay women exist.

Right, if genes decided then we would not see one gay twin and the other straight. Makes sense. But if gays are "born that way", something must happen between the splitting of the fertilized egg to make two identical twins and birth.

If I were to talk about gay women I would refer to them as lesbians.

[hey]

Right, if genes decided then we would not see one gay twin and the other straight.

No, not necessarily. Again, this is roughly a million times more complicated than you seem to think it is. Being gay is not a one or the other thing. Indeed it is not set in stone at birth, based on one single gene. That much is quite obvious. No one actually thinks that though.

If I were to talk about gay women I would refer to them as lesbians.

That just makes saying something like this even more nonsensical.

if for every 100 gay men, only 99 gay babies are born. Then after many generations there would be no more gays.

[BaneTheBrawler]

we've discussed DNA methylation before, right? basically, some genes can be turned on and off throughout one's life, with much of this happening during early growth periods. they can be affected by pretty much everything.

point is, we don't know shit. just say "there's probably a genetic component" and move on.

[test123]

So if your gay genes can be "switched on" which makes you gay, can they be "switched off"?

[Qeomash]

Gay men continue to come out of the gene pool, despite them not passing it on, because the gene that causes it is passed down mother to daughter: Epigenetic Theories of Homosexuality.

To me, that is the most convincing cause. In addition to that is the birth order factors. I am a case for both: my grandmother produced a gay son (4th child), and my mother produced a gay son (2nd child). Time will tell if any of the boys from my female cousins end up gay.

[Dimmauk]

So if your gay genes can be "switched on" which makes you gay, can they be "switched off"?

Maybe. Playing god is usually frowned upon by the same people that hate gays.

[BaneTheBrawler]

So if your gay genes can be "switched on" which makes you gay, can they be "switched off"?

it could be one gene, or it could be millions of combinations of genes that all happen to result in gay. and reversing the effect may not be possible. so the answer is "we dont know shit"

[Cream Soda]

I keep thinking that the "I was born this way" argument does fit my natural view of how things are, but on the other side, wouldn't evolution shut that whole thing down?

No; it could actually be an evolved trait to help prevent/stop overpopulation.


On a side note, it's very reassuring that every time a girl comes over and I don't do anything with her for my uncle to come in and say "Don't worry, you won't be the first faggot in the family" @.@

[Galkaeater]

No; it could actually be an evolved trait to help prevent/stop overpopulation.

I'm not quite sure thats how evolution works.

[Cream Soda]

I'm not quite sure thats how evolution works.

eh, we went over it in evo biology that homosexuality percentage increases as the population size does in some species.

[BaneTheBrawler]

human version of lemmings over the cliff. seems reasonable to me

[AidenCarby]

Did the internet raised money get back to the boy? Hope he isn't actually homeless after all this, and fuck his punk ass parents.

[Galkaeater]

I might just be stupid
but how the hell does that work
surely the percentage of homosexuals in the spieces would either be random or steady

[BerenTebogo]

eh, we went over it in evo biology that homosexuality percentage increases as the population size does in some species.

For humans we can't have any data on it that is meaningful in any way. Due to the vast differences in societal norms / religious beliefs homosexuality and homosexual tendencies would be one of the hardest traits to get accurate representation of (for fear of being killed, exiled, etc). The reason it may "seem" that the percentage is going up right now (in first world society) is that there is a civil rights movement going on pretty much worldwide for equality and shit so first-worlders are feeling more and more comfortable with coming out.

Scale it back a few hundred years even and it'll look like we've trended up massively just because if someone knew you were fuckin' dudes you were going to get your head chopped off.

And given that civilization is about 7000 years old max, we couldn't get significant trend data even if we wanted to. Our generational gaps are too large for any meaningful evolutionary change regarding population in that timeframe. (Especially because overpopulation is a problem that is 200 years old at most.)

tl;dr Nah, nope.

[Xno Kappa]

eh, we went over it in evo biology that homosexuality percentage increases as the population size does in some species.

I'm no evolution buff but I call huge bullshit on this.

[Uzor]

Homosexuality is completely normal within the animal kingdom, and in some species of animals, even have a specific role.

The Ruff bird is a good example. It has 4 different "genders". Or rather, 2 genders, but the male gender has three variations. There's the typical territorial male, which consists of the vast majority of the male population. They protect their territory against other territorial males and females. Then there's the so-called satelite males, which are smaller than the territorial males. They run between the different male territories, and are tolerated by the other territorial male birds because the presence of the satelite males attract additional female birds. There's also a third, much rarer variant of male bird, whose plummage mimics that of the female birds. The interesting thing is that, although ther appearance is that of the female birds, they often act as a "top" in mating rituals with territorial males, but often appear as bottom with satelite males. Homosexual copulation amongst these birds are actually thought to attract more females - although it may be because a "gay" bird attracts satelite males, which in turn attract more female birds.

Even amongst a lot of more "normal" animals, homosexuality exists. Homosexual bird couples are seen to adopt or take care of the offspring of other birds, suggesting that homosexuality might occur to increase the odds of babies to survive by allowing animals who can't have children themselves to help out raising the young - which is of extra importance if the parents were to die.

Scale it back a few hundred years even and it'll look like we've trended up massively just because if someone knew you were fuckin' dudes you were going to get your head chopped off.

Not true; in a lot of societies, homosexual behavior was accepted or even encouraged. Organized religion fucked that up for everyone by making it outlawed.

I'm not quite sure thats how evolution works.

To be fair, we don't know how or why homosexuality appears. If the occurance of homosexuality increases with higher population (I'd have to find the study again, so until then I won't say that it's true), it's possible it's hormonal. With an increased population in mice, it would make the animals more stressed. Is it really hard believe that stress, for example, while the fetus is developing, would trigger homosexuality? Hormone levels play a huge role in the development of the fetus. I don't see why that would be impossible. It doesn't neccesarily have to be genetical. There's nothing to suggest that a "gay gene" exists.

[BerenTebogo]

Homosexuality is completely normal within the animal kingdom, and in some species of animals, even have a specific role.

The Ruff bird is a good example. It has 4 different "genders". Or rather, 2 genders, but the male gender has three variations. There's the typical territorial male, which consists of the vast majority of the male population. They protect their territory against other territorial males and females. Then there's the so-called satelite males, which are smaller than the territorial males. They run between the different male territories, and are tolerated by the other territorial male birds because the presence of the satelite males attract additional female birds. There's also a third, much rarer variant of male bird, whose plummage mimics that of the female birds. The interesting thing is that, although ther appearance is that of the female birds, they often act as a "top" in mating rituals with territorial males, but often appear as bottom with satelite males. Homosexual copulation amongst these birds are actually thought to attract more females - although it may be because a "gay" bird attracts satelite males, which in turn attract more female birds.

Even amongst a lot of more "normal" animals, homosexuality exists. Homosexual bird couples are seen to adopt or take care of the offspring of other birds, suggesting that homosexuality might occur to increase the odds of babies to survive by allowing animals who can't have children themselves to help out raising the young - which is of extra importance if the parents were to die.



Not true; in a lot of societies, homosexual behavior was accepted or even encouraged. Organized religion fucked that up for everyone by making it outlawed.

A lot depends wholly on your metric.

Long and short of it is that it was still a small percentage of the whole who wouldn't punish you for it. Organized religion has been around for quite a while.

[NynJa]

I'm no evolution buff but I call huge bullshit on this.

I think its less about the bullshit, and more the fact that it would take a massive undertaking to document it and prove it.

[BaneTheBrawler]

which is why cream mentioned that it has been observed in other species.