December 10th Update Weaponskill Adjustments testing

[Langly]

Assuming WSMods haven't changed for Ku and Jin, it appears they've bumped their fTP from 1.0 to 1.25 and 1.5 respectively. (This is a small sample size so having someone else confirm would be nice I'm just getting burnt out)

Blade: Ten at 3,000 TP consistently hitting for around 12,920 (again assuming ws mod hasn't changed of 30/30 str/dex it would put it at around 15.5fTP at 3,000?)

Kind of lackluster in my opinion compared to some other jobs... so I think I'm going to retire it there. GL anyone else messing with Katana junk.

[dasva]

Hexastrike: 161 str. D 88 weapon. 17 fstr. 253 mnd 124 wsc. So 229 base dmg. w/ SA


798, 775, 777 jackpot!, 773, 782, 797, 788

[Byrthnoth]

Realmrazer - 0.88 fTP? (0.8799~0.8802?)
Hexastrike - 1.106~1.125 (probably 1.125?)

[dasva]

True strike: 161 str. D 88 weapon. 17 fstr. 161wsc. So 266 base dmg. w/ SA

806, 835, 807, 833, 820, 806.... so either they forgot this one or decided it should remain shitty.

[dasva]

Blade: Hi: 168 str. D 94 weapon. 18 fstr. 187 agi 149wsc. So 261 base dmg. w/ SA

3946, 4073, 4041, 4046, 4028, 4039, 4059

[dasva]

Blade: Jin: 168 str. D 94 weapon. 18 fstr. 200 dex 110wsc. So 222 base dmg. w/ SA

924, 957, 946, 946, 923, 906, 936

[dasva]

Death Blossom: D130 weapon. 22 fstr. 156 str 139 mnd. 116 wsc. 268 base dmg w/ sa

3236, 3245, 3183, 3247, 3280, 3242, 3261, 3329

[dasva]

Knights of Round: D121 weapon (excel). 21 fstr. 143 str 139 mnd. 112 wsc. 254 base dmg w/ sa

5446, 5441, 5489, 5453, 5418, 5595, 5434


And I think that's last of the ones that dmg doesn't vary with tp outside of the swd ones someone said they'd do so time to quit for the night

[Sechs]

I feel only Mordant Rime needs to be tested to start creating some generic tier lists for Dagger weaponskills? Oh and Mandalic Stab I guess.
Looks like Rudra wins everywhere, even at 1000TP (even if you should wait 2000 to use, according to Byrth's tests)
Please correct my list:

BRD:
Rudra > Mordant (Carns) > Evis >= Exen (5/5)

DNC unstacked
Rudra >= Pyrrhic (Terps) > Pyrrhic > Evis >= Exen (5/5)
I assume Rudra should still win even for stacked (Climactic)

This is with 1000 TP in mind, but Rudra wins under different values too, and as already mentioned it's actually beneficial to hold TP up to 2000.
Now the real question is: how does this change in different environment? Like when you have low buffs, or when fighting something with particularly high values of Defense? Given Exenterator's att bonus applying to all hits (???) maybe it could get much higher in that tier list, possibly on top?

[TummieGaruda]

Based on dasva's numbers I'm getting:

Death Blossom - 4.0 fTP
Knights of the Round - 7.25 fTP

Can I get some one to validate?

[Byrthnoth]

You forgot to remove the 1.4 relic multiplier:
KoR - 4.995~5.08 (Probably 5.0)

But Death Blossom is right:
DB - 3.94~3.95? It's probably 4, and you just hit <3.0 fTP

True Strike: 1 fTP
Blade: Hi: 4.95~5.03 (5 fTP)
Blade: Jin: 1.368~1.36 Probably hit below 3.0 fTP. Real value is likely 3.875

[doctorugh]

Any word on Vorpal Blade?

[Byrthnoth]

Mordant Rime: D300
4516, 4505, 4546, 4592, 4515

4.86~5.0055 - Probably 5

In response to Sech's question, I think Mordant would only slightly beat Rudra's with Carnwenhan.

Rudra's is 80% DEX and 9.25 fTP with Moonshade and 1 offhand hit.
Mordant is 70% DEX, 30% CHR, 7 fTP with 1 extra swing and 1 offhand hit. = 9.1 fTP with Carnwenhan boost.

Even if you're trying to spam at 1000 TP (which isn't the right way to use Rudra's Storm anymore), if you sneak an extra swing or two in there then Rudra's will crush Mordant.

[Sechs]

I have a small sample size for Rudra and Mordant, like 30 WS on Butterflies and 30 WS on bunnies, and close to 1000TP they were pretty close. Rudra was tipically slightly better but there were oscillations.
As soon as I let TP build, way before 2000, Rudra was getting better beyond any possible doubt.
My sample is so small it matters little, but so far it kinda confirms what you said.

Could be worse, Mordant Rime is still quite a good WS, so even if used just for AM purposes, it should be okaysh.
Do you picture the current tier list of dagger WSs being any different according to your att vs target's def? Like in situations where you're seriously lacking attack, would other WSs become better than Rudra? Thinking about Exenterator, with its 100% Att buff which should now apply to all hits in theory.
Honestly the difference is so big I don't expect changes in that list, but just wondering.


I also wonder if these changes to Rudra put Twashthar under a different light now.

[Foldypaws]

I also wonder if these changes to Rudra put Twashthar under a different light now.

Empyeran weapons don't boost Empyeran WS Damage, so almost certainly not. (Any bonus is coming solely from aftermath)

[Sechs]

that's exactly what I meant

[Byrthnoth]

If they worked in the offhand and stacked with mythics, it would be a massive boost to them. Unfortunately, they don't.

[Ophannus]

They never gave empyreans weapons a direct WS buff when wielding the corresponding weapon. I think it's because the aftermaths overwrite eachother and the weapons themselves have a large stat bonus which is an 80% modifier on most of the empy ws(could be viewed as a sizeable ws bonus i guess?). Also most empy ws were already stronger than mythic and relic ws(CDC vs Expacion/KoTR).

[Sechs]

If they worked in the offhand and stacked with mythics, it would be a massive boost to them. Unfortunately, they don't.

I meant main hand of course.
My point was that if you're going to spam Rudra anyway because it's the best WS under every circumstance, and if you should use it at 2000 because of blahblah, then might as well furtherly exploit that and use it while mainhanding a Twashthar and getting AM2?

How would that compare to the "loss" of waiting 'til 3000TP and using an inferior WS every 3 minutes? Which is likely not an issue for DNC maybe, but for THF?
Either way it seems like Twashthar became a more interesting option than it was before?

[Fival]

I'm going to assume no for thief as well with vajra, the enhanced sneak and trick attack is pretty potent.