A sad observation: RMT's are now fencing stolen goods.

[Evex]

Actually u don't get the example. the car itself belongs to the person who bought it sure, but the perosn who bought it does not own the rights to the Nissan or ford or w/e logos etc. if you take a look in any car lot they used car dealership leave the badges on the cars they sell.
thus a Car company could sue them for "Selling their name" not because they sold the car, in the end its the badge that counts in this example. (...)

RMTS us it to sell the service of the time it takes them to farm gil / gold / adena etc
Forums us it to either make a profit, some do any way, or simply just use it for their own ends, as BG does.

RMTS DO NOT SELL PIXELS GOD DAMN IT!

RMTs sell a service they do not sell a tangible item, if RMTs went around trying to say they were selling gil and not the service of farming gil then SE might in a off chance be able to do something about, or at least have a lil more kindling for the fire.

again if you focus on small aspects especially if they have nothing to do with the issue you wont be able to see the forest for the trees.

Car companies can't sue dealerships for new cars because dealers already have authorization to sell those cars. As soon as the car is sold, it's sold as-is, and all the car companies are responsible for is detailed in their warranty (until someone comes along with a class action lawsuit over faulty parts or something). Used car buyers are somewhat protected through state Lemon laws, and original car warranties have probably already expired. Badges are on cars for identification purposes as well as advertising, no? Anyway, the point is that a used car buyer supposedly understands that the condition of the car depends a lot on how the previous owner had treated it and not just the manufacturer. Car companies also can't just suddenly say your car is illegally purchased because you got it from a broker and revoke your ownership, as they have already sold their rights of ownership. Whatever they put on the car is property of the purchaser, and it's not like a situation where jewelers make copies of Mercedes logos to sell as pendants (which is illegal too, isn't it?).

Calling it a service is the loophole that gets RMTs out of the trouble they are actually doing... which is selling the currency "because it's the result of my time in the game." You can call it whatever you want, but that's like saying a john pays for the companionship of a prostitute who decides on her own if she wants to take it any further. Any sort of monetary transaction involving FFXI that goes through a third party is still only considered a breach of ToS. Like I said before, it all comes down to semantics. And as far as forums go, no users are getting paid to read or to post, we do it of our own free will and not to make a buck off of it, which is the point of what I was saying.... You seem to be the one who can't see the bigger picture to which I am referring.

And as for the "whining," which I really wasn't doing, I was just pointing out that it's redundant to repeat the premise on which most of the previous posts in this thread are based. Guess you missed that one too.

[Starr]

Xmas+New year break and they're back at it..
http://www.ffxiah.com/player.php?id=1114217

[yrpaine]

http://www.ffxiah.com/player.php?id=1116573

I had wondered why there was such a huge price flux in the price of flame rings recently... and then i realized it was all tied to this crap.... They're just dumping stuff... you can see from the link here chiyagon, munchy and axemann are playing some sort of game. looks like they're trying to make chiyagon look like an innocent buyer while these other guys are dumping off other ppl's stolen items.

[Patsu]

We all know RMT's efforts redouble during the holiday season.

Of course, this time they're getting their gil by stealing your accounts, looting the results, and selling it straight to RMT seller companies- who are amazingly and suddenly stocked to the gills with gil and ready to screw-I mean serve you, the public.

Three guesses who knows who's stealing your accounts and fencing the results, essentially recieving what can only be described as stolen goods. After all, they're the ones paying to the suppliers (who get it by the aforementioned keylog-and-steal methods).

Does this mean in theory companies like IGE can be nailed for dealing in stolen property? Should they be? Can this be the method by which the thieves can be identified and punished?

btw I didn't read any other posts past the first one

nope

A. it's not stolen property you don't own your account SE owns it. B. Maybe the reason that rmt sites magically have gil during the holiday season is... people sell gil for extra holiday cash?..........................................e=m c^2 version 2 right there

[ronin sparthos]

A. it's not stolen property you don't own your account SE owns it. B. Maybe the reason that rmt sites magically have gil during the holiday season is... people sell gil for extra holiday cash?..........................................e=m c^2 version 2 right there

Its a loophole in legal terms, they are stealing from your rented character which comparable to a break in where the thieves steal the furniture that came with the house. Is it yours? No Are you pissed as hell someone broke in period and stole stuff? Yup.

They 'magically' have gil because they stockpile for that season and every year employ something new to meet the demand.