The "Should Tanks Blink" thread.

[Callisto]

lol I use separate palletes for all kinds of shit, usually with minor differences. For RDM I have normal, tanking, and Assault/Salvage(which only varies from normal in that it uses Balrahn's Ring instead of Omega Ring, COR has normal and kiting where my rolls/JAs have blink swaps, PLD has normal and kiting(same deal), and I'd have a Dynamis one with /l chat in my voke/flash claim macros if I ever did that.

The extra pallette room is really nice, until I find myself sitting in the wrong RDM one sometimes and realize I've had Empress Band on for an hour because I wasn't in the book that swaps in my Omega Ring

[Tubbers]

For RDM I have normal, tanking, and Assault/Salvage(which only varies from normal in that it uses Balrahn's Ring instead of Omega Ring

I do the exact same thing!

[Callisto]

I felt dumb for making an entire book over a single ring, but I couldn't for my life thing of a different way to do it without using Spellcast, lol.

[Furionstormrage]

Yeah I mean I have a lot more than 2 palettes for PLD, those 2 are the defaults one that I use for most things, then plenty of situational ones.

I just like being able to go from straight tanking to kiting with the flip of one palette, and never worry about not having WLegs on at the wrong time.

I'm curious to hear from some main WHMs and RDMs, if the idea that I had mentioned 4 posts up is feasible for handling blinking tanks in alliance, and out of alliance curing.

Edit: I do the same thing with Ulth ring, in Salvage/Assault/Nyzul

[Callisto]

I honestly haven't tried it yet, 100% because I'm too lazy to change my and my g/f's macros. I certainly intend to put them on hers, probably make a 2nd pallet to leave normal for when she does campaign so she can cure outside people, and change her main one to <stal>. I myself have named macros for anyone other than myself who I really need to be curing for the most part, but I still might give them a try for RDM.

[Tubbers]

I felt dumb for making an entire book over a single ring, but I couldn't for my life thing of a different way to do it without using Spellcast, lol.

I do it with SpellCast

[Hoshino]

We need an iBlink icon unless we already have one lol...

Anyway, I guess I could always optimize my gear swaps to be more efficient on certain situations like haste or enmity, but I feel like it's a "if it ain't broke dont fix it" type of thing. Sometimes you are comfortable with what you have set up and changing it around will throw you off. Of course, you can just get used to the new setup, but if you are doing well enough that you don't die and get your job done without difficulty, is it really that necessary?

I do see the point in guiding people down the right path who are new to tanking and need pointers. So I do endorse the concept of gear swaps/blink tanking for those people. In the end, it's all about what you feel the most comfortable doing as long as you have the skill. All the gear in the world to swap in or blink into wont help you if you can't do it right.

[Tubbers]

We an iBlink icon unless we already have one lol...

I think you just accidentally a word.

Edit: lol you fixed it

[willriker]

Also, assuming you still follow this mindset, what do you idle in?

I actualy Idle in, remember this is idle gear for /nin:

Joy (if not getting yelled at by people for tp gain on enemy)
Terror Shield enmity4 +20HP
Lightning Bow (+dex mainly cause lack of better TP gain option if no big magic attack. then lamia kaman if there is)
Fort Torque (acc and attack)
Avalon Breastplate (acc/enmity/small vit/mdt)
Askar Hands (haste/enmity i know i know, get homam hands, im workin on it)
Snipers
Snipers
Turban/Askar (Haste, really only use because not full homam so need the haste for 15%)
Knights Earring (thinking about swappin to assault earring atm)
Eatheral Earring
Cerb mantle (Enmity, but mostly for attack stat)
Swift Belt (Haste/acc)
Homam Legs
AF1+1 feet

For macro swaps:
Flash
Knights to Loq.earring
Sniper to Herc
Sniper to Saatva
Fort. Torque to Harmonia's
Eatheral to Hades+1 (mainly cause so short to cast otherwise i dont take off eatheral)
--Totals to +28 enmity with dorado suishi, without touching haste

Ustusemi
Fort. Torque to Shield Torque
Cerb Mantle to Boxers
--totals to 311 shield, without touching haste

Atonement
same swaps as Flash macro, since acc is not an issue


Thats my standard build. I didnt include things like MDT/MDB swap sets as you obviously need to blink out for that to make an effective set. Same deal with fire resist set.

*note* just one thing to note though, i am lookin into lolPbody. I want to see it it will help me hit for less 0's. If less 0's then faster atonements. Cant hurt to try it out i supose. Its crazy enough to work. I also did not add in my Cure macro set. It does not let me blink, but i got lazy and didnt want to type it all lol. Honestly, i hardly have to use it and we win just fine.

**note** only three items do not aid me in landing a hit, or add haste for more hits, on an enemy in my idle set. Af1+1 boots, Knights, Terror Shield. I am thinking about swappin out Knights for assault earring, and using knights in my ustusemi macro line. But shield and feet are staying.

[kandiekane]

In response to ppl not understanding how many macro's you need for supporting a pld, let me give you an example:

Need 4 sets of this (1 for tank#1, 1 for tank #2, 1 for <stal>, 1 for <stpc>)

paralyna, silena, viruna, cursna, blindna, stona, erase
cure1, cure2, cure3, cure4, cure5

** if you sub sch, put in a bunch of other crap like light arts and parsimony
______________________________________________
Need to be very quickly accessible to these macro's

curaga1, curaga2, curaga3, maybe curaga4
regen1, regen3, barfira, barthunder
divine seal, devotion, martyr
protectraV, shellraV
Elemental Seal, slow, paralyze, blind, silence
Blink, SS, sneak, invis, repose, flash

Not to mention regular stuff like Rx3, RR, teleportsx9

You need to be a fucking cat to have fast enough reflexes to achieve all of that even with the new <stal> command.


This is the standard gear setup for PLD's who do not blink:

sword/shield/lamia/X
bmask(assjamer)/parade/loq/ethereal
ares(valor or avalon)/homam/defending/shadow
shadow/vbelt(swift)/homam/af+1(homam)

With this idle set, you will be able to achieve the same performance as a PLD that blinks like a Christmas tree just by swapping out non-blinkable gears for FLASH, UTSU, REPRISAL, and CURE.

All other JA's and spells you can swap blinkable gear because you don't spam them every 2-3 seconds.

If you feel 2 seconds off of Utsu recast will save your ass when you alternate ichi > ni then your an idiot. I have never been in a situation where ichi and ni were both down and I needed 2 seconds to spare. If they were both down, you can count on a bad AoEx2 and this is the time to use reprisal or sentinal. Or this is the time NOT to cast flash, let other tank get hate until you get shadows back up.

One of the MOST fucking annoying things about blinking is that it messes up your own shadow casting timing because you cannot consecutively cast spells while blinking on and off. This is from first had exp trying myself. Try to cast Ni right after Flash while blinking, it won't work. If you don't blink, it will work like a charm.

Automatic gear swaps are for noobs. It's like driving an automatic car. Sure everything is fine, but if you want to push your performance, you must be able to manually select which gears according to what you need. Having a few macro sets with the correct gear you need and swapping them in when you need it is 10x more efficient than letting spellcast do it for you when actually need something else or don't need it at all.

Help your mages and outside support be able to cast on you quickly. Not everything goes as planned. If a tank goes down and an alternate starts to tank or kite outside of pt or alliance, are you going to stop and fix all your god damn macro's to cure and -na him? He'd be dead by then. . .

[Tubbers]

In response to ppl not understanding how many macro's you need for supporting a pld, let me give you an example:

lots of stuff

Or just SpellCast and one or two macro sets.

Honestly though, its not just tanks that blink on everything. With the exception of RNG, on a job like DRK, I'm blinking almost every 3 seconds doing something different. I don't think it should be so much of a focus on tanks since I think it spreads across all jobs with the exception of RNG really

What the heck are you doing that requires you to blink every 3 seconds? I blink for WS gear, TP gear, Running gear, Spells, and JAs, there is no way I am hitting a blink macro every 3 seconds ever.

Edit: Unless you're swapping body/neck piece every swing to try and get extra MP...

[kandiekane]

Or just SpellCast and one or two macro sets.

How do you spellcast tank#1, tank#2, <stal> and <stpc>?

Edit**

And how the hell does spellcast let you target someone that is blinking?

[Tubbers]

There's really no need for specific tank#1 and tank#2 targeting, just use one set with <stal> and one set with <stpc>, but if you wanted to you could set conditional default targets, for example if nobody is targeted, macros will target tank#1 by default, if you're targeting the mob, tank #2, and if you're targeting yourself <stal>.

And how the hell does spellcast let you target someone that is blinking?

Did you read what was said about <stal>? It takes care of blinking for you, if you target someone with <stal>, and they blink, they will still be targeted.

[kandiekane]

There's really no need for specific tank#1 and tank#2 targeting, just use one set with <stal> and one set with <stpc>, but if you wanted to you could set conditional default targets, for example if nobody is targeted, macros will target tank#1 by default, if you're targeting the mob, tank #2, and if you're targeting yourself <stal>.



Did you read what was said about <stal>? It takes care of blinking for you, if you target someone with <stal>, and they blink, they will still be targeted.

What about people outside of an alliance in dynamis/einharjar? So your saying to target mobs and yourself now to cure other people?

<stal> works fine in an alliance only setting, but once you get into something exceeding that, then your in trouble.

#edit

even with just those 2 macros pallets (4 required for /sch) you will still be bouncing around 7-9 macro palettes for support.

[[Cookies]]

What about people outside of an alliance in dynamis/einharjar? So your saying to target mobs and yourself now to cure other people?

<stal> works fine in an alliance only setting, but once you get into something exceeding that, then your in trouble.

Why the fuck don't the tank party have their own mages or why the fuck is the PLD outside of the alliance?

[Hyriu]

I have WHM75, I don't use BMN, I don't use Spellcast, I don't use <stpt/al> and none of my tanks die when I'm healing, maybe that's because I play NIN/DRK and PLD/NIN for my LS but seriously, if you're gonna whine because your tanks blink then step up your game.

[kandiekane]

Why the fuck don't the tank party have their own mages or why the fuck is the PLD outside of the alliance?

In dynamis and eiherjar? Because everyone wants to come melee?

[kandiekane]

I have WHM75, I don't use BMN, I don't use Spellcast, I don't use <stpt/al> and none of my tanks die when I'm healing, maybe that's because I play NIN/DRK and PLD/NIN for my LS but seriously, if you're gonna whine because your tanks blink then step up your game.

I'm not whining because my tanks blink, I am the tank -.-

[Neosutra]

I ignored everything you said kandi after I saw you stated:

"Blinking messes up your shadow casting"... and you are "just as efficient w/o blinking"

The above 2 statements, combined with your "you dont want to flash whenever its up, so haste with flash is worthless" are the 3 stupidest statements Ive ever heard, and are the main reason I made this thread.

There are many people that dont swap because they have a decent understanding of hate thresholds and choose not too. Then there are people like you that are so confused that you are just "doing it wrong".

Please stop.

[kandiekane]

I ignored everything you said kandi after I saw you stated:

"Blinking messes up your shadow casting"... and you are "just as efficient w/o blinking"

The above 2 statements, combined with your "you dont want to flash whenever its up, so haste with flash is worthless" are the 3 stupidest statements Ive ever heard, and are the main reason I made this thread.

There are many people that dont swap because they have a decent understanding of hate thresholds and choose not too. Then there are people like you that are so confused that you are just "doing it wrong".

Please stop.

You are just as efficient because you already reach the hate threshold.
I tried blinking, and it messed up my shadow casting (I stated clearly that it was for me, not all).
Do you flash when your shadows are down?
Stupidest isn't a word.