New or Returning Players Discussion (Or Anything Old FFXI Then Vs. Now)

[Mercilessturtle]

RDM inside Abyssea isn't un-useful. Sab+capped Slow II = easy mode.

Yeah, that slow is so important you should waste a person on it. Not like a brd would give you the same thing, plus massively faster kill speed from marches. Sch was already considered useless before abyssea, and it is more useful in abyssea than rdm is.

Out of curiosity what situations will merit using SCH sub over RDM sub?

Blms should be defaulting to /sch. You just go /rdm if you need phalanx (pulling for a cleave?) or gravity (never in abyssea).

[Atoreis]

Yeah, that slow is so important you should waste a person on it. Not like a brd would give you the same thing, plus massively faster kill speed from marches. Sch was already considered useless before abyssea, and it is more useful in abyssea than rdm is.

Tbh I was always wondering wouldn't damage mitigation from paralyze II + slow II + addle make RDM healer more then enough? It's just harder to dbox and that's why it's considered as that bad no?

[Mercilessturtle]

For low end stuff sure. For real stuff, no. It takes too long to cure back a 2k tp move with just cure3/4 spam. Rdm is for pulling for cleaves in abyssea, that's about it.

[Nishida]

Yeah, that slow is so important you should waste a person on it. Not like a brd would give you the same thing, plus massively faster kill speed from marches. Sch was already considered useless before abyssea, and it is more useful in abyssea than rdm is.



Blms should be defaulting to /sch. You just go /rdm if you need phalanx (pulling for a cleave?) or gravity (never in abyssea).

What does scholar give to BLM that's better than having Fast Cast? Genuine question as I was hearing RDM was still the default BLM sub..

[Mercilessturtle]

Alacrity. Most people are dumb, and lots of people are too lazy/stupid to level a subjob because "oldsubjob worked just fine before". So yeah, you see most blms /rdm when they should be /sch. Dark arts is better for recasts than fast cast from /rdm anyhow, just the -cast time isn't as good.

[Nishida]

Reduces the casting and the recast time of your next black magic spell by 50% every 2 minutes. What spell could possibly need this that Fast Cast doesn't already help? Casting time/recast time with gear/spellcast/haste/traits is pretty significant and also passive. Not to mention it's passively helping all spells and not just one.

Fast Cast II: 15% Spellcast, 7.5% Recast
Dark Arts: 10% Spellcast, 10% Recast

2.5% quicker recast on spells at a loss of 5% casting time. I guess it comes down to personal opinion/use, but I'd take 5% cast time over 2.5% recast any day especially considering with Haste spell you can get recast time to cap pretty fast with less gear than it takes to cap spell casting time.

[Rocl]

I haven't used RDM for Voidwatch yet, but I imagine it might be a smidge useful for the lower tiers? Assuming the tier4s behave exactly like Giants/Ixion so Slow/Paralyze don't matter much?

[Mercilessturtle]

Reduces the casting and the recast time of your next black magic spell by 50% every 2 minutes. What spell could possibly need this that Fast Cast doesn't already help?

You do know what blm is for right? Just to be clear, it isn't for damage.

[Nishida]

You do know what blm is for right? Just to be clear, it isn't for damage.

I won't lie..I'm still trying to get familiar with Abyssea as I've just returned after being gone a year, but that said I've been hearing different things from different people. Traditional role for BLM was DD. People I've talked to (Forums and in game) have mention BLM still being considered a heavy DD. I know it is used for proccing, but you can't expect me to believe that a job that is tailored to blow shit up isn't used for damage.

[Atoreis]

You do know what blm is for right? Just to be clear, it isn't for damage.

You seriously want to say that 2.5% recast makes /sch THAT much better because of that you need to recast spells for grellow if you time it wrong?
Do you cast spells in full haste equip? Do you use Omnipotent? etc. because if not then you are hypocrite (if I'm guessing right on your way of thinking)
5% fast cast also helps on timing for grellow.

[bungiefan]

For a returning BLM you should look at the following:

I'm not returning, just super-casual for playtime. My account has been active since just after JP PS2 launch, but I've only got ~130 days of playtime. I've been working on RDM, but SCH seemed more important, so that was the first thing after WHM I leveled for sub. I'm working on a melee right now, SAM, so I can try to solo more missions I haven't been able to on BLM. I'm only at Teal gear from Abyssea, with AF or AF2 filling some slots. The only old endgame I've done is a clear of original Dynamis, one Dreamland zone, and 4 Einherjar runs, since it took me 8 years to even get BLM to 75 and WHM to about 50.

Thanks for the advice. I'm just not far enough in progression to get all the options, and not for lack of trying. I have no storyline completed yet. ACP is the closest, with me stuck on the final battle. Shantotto has me stuck where I need to use Soultrappers.

[Mercilessturtle]

You seriously want to say that 2.5% recast makes /sch THAT much better

No, alacrity does, like I said. Alacrity your AM so the DD doesn't have to turn around as long to avoid TP moves fucking it up.

Nishida: blm is just a grellow trigger bitch. Depending on the size of your group, you end up /brd instead of either /sch or /rdm just because you contribute so little outside of triggering anyways. DDs do an assload more damage than mages. Even still, if you were going for damage /sch would usually win anyways.

[Nishida]

Fast Cast and Haste gear pretty much nullifies a need for Alacrity, though. RDM brings more to the table than a JA that can be covered by gear.

[Mercilessturtle]

No it doesn't. Go read the description of the JA if you are going to insist on arguing.

[Draylo]

If your main focus is grellow, why would you sub sch anyway? Should be using /brd.

[Mercilessturtle]

you end up /brd instead of either /sch or /rdm

Hmmm.

[Draylo]

Then what are you debating? /rdm is more useful than /sch if you are going for dmg output.

[Mercilessturtle]

Why not just read the post I quoted from instead of asking stupid questions? If your group is big enough that you have a brd, then you don't have to go /brd. In which case you go /sch. And the only way /rdm will win for damage output is if the fight lasts long enough to use all your MP plus more than half your convert MP, and also doesn't last much longer than that, and also the next fight won't happen for 10 minutes.

[Nishida]

Nishida: blm is just a grellow trigger bitch.

Why the hell do people pigeon-hole jobs out of their main roles making them undesirable? This is stupid. I'm a little angry that a job that was designed to blow shit up is invited to trigger crap. Makes no sense to me.

So far since coming back I've been told RDM is useless because of atmas, BLM is not a DD, and SAM is not king in abyssea like it was in events outside. I only have BLU left of my original 75 jobs and luckily it's pretty sweet at 90. Guess I am forced to pick new jobs. Suppose that's why I'm leveling MNK.

[Draylo]

Why not just read the post I quoted from instead of asking stupid questions? If your group is big enough that you have a brd, then you don't have to go /brd. In which case you go /sch. And the only way /rdm will win for damage output is if the fight lasts long enough to use all your MP plus more than half your convert MP, and also doesn't last much longer than that, and also the next fight won't happen for 10 minutes.

You must be one angry person, every post of yours is the same. Get the sand out of your vag for once.

Blms should be defaulting to /sch. You just go /rdm if you need phalanx (pulling for a cleave?) or gravity (never in abyssea).

Alacrity for one spell is hardly worth going /sch for. BLM can also speed kills up in low man setting for many NMs. Pour your mp out and enmity douse, do it again with convert and have the THF accomplice. I low man a lot of NMs BLM THF WHM and blm can speed the fight up with the dmg output.