Random Facts Thread: Abilities

[Fwahm]

Has anyone ever seen limit break Maat do One-Ilm Punch before? I assume it's a rename of One Inch Punch (it hit Amchuchu and I've got filters on, so no idea on effects), but I've never seen it before, and I can't find any mention of it online except in regards to FFXIV.

[Sechs]

Which job were you doing Maat as? And can you use trusts in the Maat BC? o.O

[Fwahm]

I was doing it on bard, and yes, using Trusts against Maat is a bonus the Rhapsodies key items give you.

[dasva]

So tested at a few different lvls in ballista vs wyvern. Dragonbreaker gave -20eva/acc presumably the same amount of meva/macc. And took the tp gain from 95 per hit to 76. I presume this will be the same with all the similar abilities but obviously not as easy to test the others

[dasva]

So in case there was any doubt trusts count for the bonuses to corsair rolls for having right jobs in party

[Viar]

So in case there was any doubt trusts count for the bonuses to corsair rolls for having right jobs in party

It's been known to give bonus for a while now, also there are no delay in activating the bonus. You can summon BLM or DRK trusts, do wizard or chaos roll and get roll bonus, then unsummon the trust for something else.

Also all that time spent on summoning trusts to buff rolls made FC set and caster roll a lot more valuable, lol.

[Chimerawizard]

A friend argued with me and another friend about life cycle, we defended what the wiki said while he purported it to be like Devotion.
Well, here's our findings and will edit wiki to represent them.

We have Cap job points, so couldn't test without any job points unfortunately.
No equipment
Starting HP=max HP = 1820
ending HP=1365
1365/1820=75%
Luopan Cured = 546
(1820-1365)*1.2=546

Back only
StartHP=1950 MaxHP=2123
EndHP=1463
1463/1950=~75% 1463/2123=~69%
Luopan Cured=633
(1950-1463)*1.3=633

NQ body & back
starting HP=2078
end HP=1559
Luopan Cured=726
(2078-1559)*1.4=726.6


From the tests I have come to think Life Cycle is:
HP Lost = 25% Current HP
Lupoan Recovery = HP Lost * (1+Gear and Job points)

Will update wiki in a bit.

[Tye]

Just did some Lunge testing to see how Magic Damage+ applies and found that the formula listed on the wiki was slightly off. The wiki had:


Damage = Main-hand weapon Skill × (0.5 + (Number of Runes × 0.25) + (n ÷ 100) ) × Magic Multiplier Terms

Number of Runes = the number of runes consumed, not the number of runes active
n = number of Job Points spent in the Lunge effect category, as well as any Lunge effect bonus from gear.


The Job Point bonus is not added to n, its a separate multiplier. The formula I got with Magic Damage+ included was:


Damage per hit = (floor(floor(Skill × (0.5 + (Runes × 0.25) + (n ÷ 100) ) ) × (1 + (jp ÷ 100) ) ) + Magic Damage) × Magic Multiplier Terms

This formula is long so I shortened the "Main-hand weapon Skill" and "Number of Runes"
n is just Lunge+ from things like Aettir.
jp is the number of Job Points spent on Swipe/Lunge effect.


I also tested Gambit a few days ago since I didn't find any info on how much it increases damage. Its a 10% damage boost per rune consumed, so 30% with 3 runes.

[Raelia]

Just a quick and dirty test:

Cruadin, 83 base damage, 100 after fstr (why I keep this thing :V), Consume Mana + Sneak Attack on level 0s.

535 high crit, assuming this is the high end: 509-535 1.05 range, average ~5.22 x DMG after bonuses

0mp - 523 ~0dmg
15mp - 528 ~1dmg
45mp - 545 ~4dmg
125mp - 584 ~12dmg
210mp - 645 ~23dmg
350mp - 712 ~36dmg
870mp - 958 ~84dmg
1187mp - 1150 ~120dmg

Consume Mana adds 1 base damage for every 10mp consumed.

[Byrthnoth]

To review, Cardinal Chant gives position-related boosts to Geomancer elemental magic.

Monster is south of you: magic accuracy boost (+13 with Cardinal Chant IV)
Monster is east of you: magic attack boost
Monster is north of you: magic crit rate boost
Monster is west of you: magic burst bonus (+22 with Cardinal Chant IV)

These bonuses can be increased 50% with AF+1 hat or, I assume, up to 100% with the new AF+3 hat. As you can see, most of the bonuses are inconsequential even at +100% potency, potentially with the exception of Magic Burst Bonus. I am unaware of any testing showing whether magic burst bonus is subject to the normal gear MAB cap, so I went ahead and tested it on level 107 efts in Escha - Zi'Tah. I had capped MBB 1 and +10 MBB II in gear.

Thunder V with the monster south, no MB: 8459
Thunder V with the monster south, MB: 32350
Thunder V with the monster east, MB: 36582

The damage increased, so MBB from Cardinal Chant is outside the +40 gear cap.

Spoiler: show

I was on GEO/SAM wearing:
main="Caduceus",
sub="Genmei Shield",
range="Dunna",
head={ name="Merlinic Hood", augments={'Mag. Acc.+24 "Mag.Atk.Bns."+24','Magic burst mdg.+11%','INT+1','Mag. Acc.+8',}},
body={ name="Merlinic Jubbah", augments={'"Mag.Atk.Bns."+29','Magic burst mdg.+11%','INT+10',}},
hands={ name="Amalric Gages +1", augments={'MP+80','Mag. Acc.+20','"Mag.Atk.Bns."+20',}},
legs={ name="Merlinic Shalwar", augments={'"Mag.Atk.Bns."+26','Magic burst mdg.+11%','INT+10','Mag. Acc.+13',}},
feet={ name="Amalric Nails +1", augments={'MP+80','Mag. Acc.+20','"Mag.Atk.Bns."+20',}},
neck="Mizu. Kubikazari",
waist="Yamabuki-no-Obi",
left_ear="Gifted Earring",
right_ear="Etiolation Earring",
left_ring="Mujin Band",
right_ring="Shiva Ring +1",
back={ name="Nantosuelta's Cape", augments={'INT+20','Mag. Acc+20 /Mag. Dmg.+20','"Mag.Atk.Bns."+10',}},

I disabled gearswap, engaged the level 107 Eft so Gessho would provoke, disengaged, and made Impaction with Sekkanoki Brainshaker -> Shining Strike, which I MBed with Thunder V.

I had 40 MBB and 11 MBB II, which means the +22 MBB II should have resulted in a ~14.5% increase in damage. Instead, it resulted in a 13% increase in damage. It's possible that there's some weird cap being factored in, but another possibility is that Cardinal Chant doesn't give MBB and actually just gives a +% MB damage in a separate step, which would draw MBB into line with the other bonuses (+13 MAB, +13 MAcc, +11 MCrit rate, +13% MB damage). Given the difficulty in testing the other two bonuses, it could be that all the bonuses are actually +13%.

Anyway, with AF+3 this could be ~+26% damage, probably making it GEO's best MB head option (given directional constraints).

Edit: Looks like earlier tests have shown a larger increase in MB damage than the 13% I observed, so it's probably not static. However, his results are consistent with +29 MBB rather than the +22 from lore.

[Chocobro]

Hey Byrth, did you have the mob true west of you? I had a little bit of time to do some testing with direction over thew weekend. When it came to MAB, the first dropoff seemed to be ~6 degrees from true east.

[Sechs]

What happens when the direction is not clear, like if the mob is NorthWest, or EastSouthEast etc?

[Byrthnoth]

Hey Byrth, did you have the mob true west of you? I had a little bit of time to do some testing with direction over thew weekend. When it came to MAB, the first dropoff seemed to be ~6 degrees from true east.

I'm pretty sure it was true west, but I guess that's another option.

Also, Sechs, you get a mix of the different bonuses.

[Martel]

Following up on my post about all the crap we don't know about cover, and some that we do, but never put on the wiki... See here for said post.

Now we know a bit more. I spent the morning doing Cover enmity tests.

For enmity transfer to occur;
-The hit must land on the PLD. Misses don't count. Haven't tested shadows or anticipates, but I suspect the same.
-The hit must be an intercepted hit. Meaning the coveree has to be the original target. This sucks cause once the PLD has hate again, you stop stealing CE from the coveree.

The following numbers are based on a Big ass assumption. That being that, like SE said, then coveree loses enmity, and the PLD gains it. Rather than just one or the other. the CE difference is unaffected by said assumption as it's the tested value. but the derived transfer amount assumes equal CE reduction/increase for coveree/PLD. Testing this would require a third party, so I didn't.

EDIT:Said assumption was Wrong. Go here for final and correct info. It's just a few posts down.
I wish I knew how to make a decent table, cause formatting these things sucks.

The following tests are for a single landed hit, while covering.

Hits taken    target CE    PLD CE    CE diff    CE trans    PLD Enmity+    
1              201          1         220        110            0    
1              201          1         220        110            0    
1              401          1         241        120            0    
1              601          1         261        130            0    
1              1000         1         300        150            0    
1              201        101         221        110            0    
1              201          1         221        110            30

Key
-Target CE. The coveree's CE value before cover activation.
-PLD CE. The PLD's CE before cover.
-CE diff. The difference in the totaled CE of all actions by the PLD and coveree.

So, stuff this tells us.
-The last entry shows us than enmity+ gear has no effect on the enmity transfer.
-The second to last test, when compared to the first, show us that the PLD's CE doesn't affect the transfer value. Coveree CE only.

A tentative formula for enmity transfer on the first hit(get into this more later) would be;

CE=FLOOR(coveree CE*.05)+100

Which is honestly a lot less that I was expecting. Anyone I cover pretty much never has hate after cover wears. But everything seemed consistent.

Then I tried taking two hits in the same test. And it all went straight to hell.

Hits taken    target CE    PLD CE    CE diff    1st hit-    CE left   
2               401          1        476        120         281
2               601          1        532        130         471
2               801          1        570        140         661
2              1001          1        624        150         851

I had some sections for 2nd hit stuff in there, but the site is captcha'ing the shit outta me whenever I preview, and the formatting was being a bitch so I removed them. Couldn't be right anyway.

No matter what I do, I can't figure out a way to calculate the CE- on the second hit in a way that matches all sample. Just not happening. All I can tell is, something about the second hit pull more enmity than the first. But the increase doesn't seem consistent between samples. The normal formula almost works for the 401 CE test, then is a good 25 off for the 601 test. But then it's only 24 off on the 801 test. Then 40 off on the 1k test... i don't even.

Mathy people, have at. If you can think of tests I can do that would make this clearer, do tell.

[Fwahm]

SE's post never says that the enmity transfers with Cover, and their wording seems to suggest directly against it. Based on their wording, the enmity change isn't a transfer, meaning the increase on the coverer and the enmity decrease on the coveree aren't necessarily the same value.

[Martel]

SE's post never says that the enmity transfers with Cover, and their wording seems to suggest directly against it. Based on their wording, the enmity change isn't a transfer, meaning the increase on the coverer and the enmity decrease on the coveree aren't necessarily the same value.

Let's see SE said...

The paladin ability Cover now raises enmity towards the paladin and lowers enmity towards the party member under attack.

Though it doesn’t absorb enmity directly, Cover has an effect that is very close.

Well, shit. Valid point. I guess I need to retest using a 3rd party.

I might be able to test one at a time by zoning the person with hate, then coming back and building back to their enmity. Pain in the ass though.

But testing for the person who didn't have hate, would mean catching them up enmity-wise, recording CE it took to get there, then zoning them and have them catch up to the other player. CE to catch up again - CE to catch up the first time would be post cover CE... that's fucking annoying.

Well, should be able to use the combined value from previous test to figure the other value. So I should only need to test 1 per. Still fucking annoying though.

[Martel]

Ok, now I think I've got it.

This was actually a lot simpler than I expected. Since I had total values to compare against, I didn't really need to bother tracking the PLDs enmity prezone. Just get on top of the hate list, zone, and go from there.

C.CE	post zone	Coveree-	%	total	PLD gain
200	180	         20	        0.1	220	200
400	360	         40	        0.1	240	200
600	540	         60	        0.1	260	200
1000	900	        100	        0.1	300	200
Key
C.CE: Coveree CE before cover.
Post Zone:The CE needed to match the coveree after zoning
%:multiplier for CE reduction. C.CE*%= CE loss.
Total enmity difference. Really only for comparison to the last test

Working multiples of 200 with a 10% reduction made this so much easier. 200 CE test? 1 flash matches exactly. 600 CE? 3 flashes.

Anyway, as the data shows, the Coveree's CE is reduced by 10%, then the PLD is granted a static +200 CE.

This difference in CE reduction is what was throwing off the second hit calcs in the last test. Since CE after the first hit wasn't the expected value it threw everything off. Using this formula I was able to predict the post 2nd hit CE exact on a 1k CE test.

Unless someone wants to test a factor I didn't, or sees an issue, I'll consider this solved and update the wiki.

[Byrthnoth]

Looks good to me!

[Fwahm]

Apparently, the Augments Weapon Bash on Ignominy Gauntlets +2/3 makes Weapon Bash give Wild Flourish-level Chainbound.

[dasva]

Wow didn't even realize they gained augment. That's pretty decent