Random Facts Thread: Traits and Stats (Player and Monster)

[Ophannus]

Can try testing base damage of undead based blue spells (Blood Sabre/Spinal Cleave etc) and see if after their 50% pdt or whatever if there's bonus damage from monster correlation. Theoretically, if they're arcana, you'd see a damage bonus since Poison Breath is an undead spell.

[Obsidian]

Dunno if you're aware or not, but Requiescat and Sanguine Blade damage is basically floored on Umbrils. Atonement deals double damage though (Divine Emblem Holy II, Flash, Sentinel, Shield Bash, Rampart, and then Atonement for 1500).

Edit: And Light spells definitely do extra damage. Divine Emblem Holy II does ~2500-3000 on them. Enlight damage doubles as well.

[Rocl]

Umbrils are quite possibly Arcana, they just don't follow the normal rules of monster correlation (i.e., killer effects and sigils do not work). Elementals are the same way: you get correlation damage bonuses on Elementals as if they were Arcana, but you cannot put up Arcane Crest, nor can you intimidate them via Arcana Killer. I suspect (Arch) Dynamis Lord to work the same way (as a demon) but never did any sort of testing to prove it.

That was honestly one of my first guesses, that they were some derivative of the elemental family much like pixies were--but i had no idea how to test other than using magian trial log, so it looks like I should've voiced my crazy conspiracy theories earlier '~'

I'll check the elemental resistances of Adoulin-introduced mob families on RUN later today when I'm done recouping some bayld. I know Matamata take crazy damage from thunder (possibly all?) magic dmg (looks about 1.5x multiplier on thunder at least)

For all of these tests, I'm using 3x rune on a neutral day and fighting 2 mob of same level and reporting the average damage of the enspell

Rune Fencing vs. Matamata
Fire 25.61
Ice 53.74
Wind 54.57
Earth 52.48
Thunder 53.81
Water 25.60
Light 51.65
Dark 53.72

Matamata aggro by sound
Scalding Breath applies a -32hp/tic, -67 INT Burn in addition to resetting TP and dealing damage; Cranial Thrust's Max HP Down is -25%; Tail Thwack inflicts a -50% Defense Down

vs Twitherym
Fire 31.00
Ice 31.38
Wind 31.45
Earth 14.33
Thunder 31.47
Water 29.14
Light
Dark

Twitherym link/aggro by sound (Not all Twitherym aggro)
Slice 'n' Dice applies a 15 hp/tic, -25 VIT Choke

vs Chapuli
Fire 34.37
Ice 33.00
Wind 33.63
Earth 34.50
Thunder 35.23
Water 35.21
Light 34.00
Dark 33.50

Chapuli link/aggro by sight (Not all Chapuli aggro)
Sanguinary Slash applies a -10% Max HP Down in addition to knockback/damage; Nature's Meditation applies a crazy damage etc. shield and can be used as a counter to weapon skills but only lasts for a short amount of time; Sensilla Blades is knockback + damage; Tegmina Buffet applies a 2 hp/tic, -67 VIT Choke in addition to dealing damage

vs Acuex
Fire 52.70
Ice 53.00
Wind 26.25
Earth 25.69
Thunder 25.64
Water 3.36
Light 54.02
Dark 53.78

Deadening Haze applies Silence and gives the Acuex a 12 hp/tic Poison aura in addition to magic damage; Foul Waters applies a 16 hp/tic, -30 STR Drown and Gravity in addition to magic damage; Pestilent Plume applies a -5 TP/tic Plague, Blind, and Magic Defense Down in addition to damage

[Yugl]

Fixed this post with a better method. Didn't remember MAB used prior.

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...1_10.28.20.png
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...1_10.28.21.png

Since we see an odd number for the Luminohelix, we know the 2x bonus is before some other multiplier. I'm proposing 0.875 as that multiplier and suggesting this works on the MDT multiplier. This multiplier, after the 2x bonus, would explain why we see an odd number value and why breath damage did 2x expected damage with the right elements while magic didn't do 2x expected damage.

Explaining Meteor and 1k Needles:
2 x 0.875 = 1.75 (Perfectly aligns with Meteor and 1k Needles damage)

Explaining the Ionohelix damage:
85/0.875 = 97.1285 : Find the original value before the 0.875 multiplier; this value will be even if the 2x bonus applied prior to this step
98/2 = 49 : Find the value before the 2x bonus by dividing by 2
Floor(49*0.825) = 42 : Reapply the 0.875 to see what damage would appear from an unresisted nuke (Observed value!)

Explaining the BLU darkness damage:
Floor(440*0.11) = 48
48*3 = 144
144/8 = 18
18*0.875 = 15.75
Floor(15.75) = 15 (Observed value)

The noctohelix, however, is trouble to figure out.

[Obsidian]

I did not know Slice 'n Dice did that, lol. I've only fought them on PLD with an Ochain.

Edit: Speaking of Ochain, the Matamata mobs seem to have a physical attack that can't be shield blocked. They step forward and basically try to chomp you, and it hits me for 80-90 every time, and interrupts my spell casting.

[Ophannus]

Instant Protect gives +75 def. Made me go from 425->500. =/

[Yugl]

Leafkin:

At LV100, the Leafkin at Ceizak Battlegrounds has 102 INT seemingly
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/fjx49zv3m...Magic%20Traits

The preliminary check used 150MAB total (MAB+50 essentially).

133/1.5 = 88.6666 : (89*1.5 = 133.5), so use 89
66/1.5 = 44 : so use 44

If there is MDT, we need will see issues with either number working. Before that, we have two base damages (44 and 89). Looking at this alone, the 89 base damage seems obvious of course. We'll do the math to show why though anyways.

1. If the base damage is 44, then the 133 damages are likely receiving some bonus (2x seems to be the case with Adoulin). We know that either the MDT or MAB is after this bonus since the 133 damage isn't an even number.

44*2 = 88
88*1.5 = 132 DMG (Nope)

2. If the base damage is 89, then the 44 is a half-resist (Either through SDT or natural resistance).
Floor(89/2) = 44
44*1.5 = 66 DMG (Observed damage)

Next, if we know the base damage, we can guess the INT assuming no other multipliers affect this damage. SCH with Dark Arts receives 24 base damage and every helix begins with 25 base damage before INT influence (Hence, why these are very nice spells for checking elemental associations). So here is what we have:

DA = 24
V = 25
Multi = 1
dINT = ???
Base Damage = 89

(Base Damage) = (DA + V + dINT*Multi)
89 = (24 + 25 + dINT*1)
89 = (49 + dINT)
dINT = 40

Since dINT is PlayerINT-MobINT, we just need to find the original INT, which is 142 INT.

(PCINT-MobINT) = 40
142-MobINT= 40
MobINT= 102

Now check the secondary folder

With these checks, I used 102 INT to see if the appropriate damage appeared (Should be 24+25=49 DMG) and we did see the expected damage.

Leafkin elemental resistance:
Light, Water (One sample, so could be inaccurate)
Ice, Dark, Earth
Fire, Aero, Thunder

The anomaly within this check: I used some tier1 spells to see if the damage would match V, but that doesn't seem to be the case. They don't even match a resisted value. For instance, Blizzard did 21 DMG, but the listed V value is 45 base damage. Added an image of the gear/sub used, any reasons why this would happen?

[Rocl]

Re: Chapuli & Nature's Meditation-- it looks like after using Nature's Meditation they gain the shield during all TP moves subsequent? I'm done messing with them for now since it appears they don't have any significant SDT but something to watch out for '~'

[Jem]

Re: Chapuli & Nature's Meditation-- it looks like after using Nature's Meditation they gain the shield during all TP moves subsequent? I'm done messing with them for now since it appears they don't have any significant SDT but something to watch out for '~'

I agree with that assessment. It's really noticeable when doing Reives.

[NynJa]

I'm pretty sure Natures Meditation doesnt require TP to be used. I've pulled a Chapuli , hit twice, Exen...and it countered with Meditation.

[Fwahm]

Chapuli's can counter weaponskills with Nature's Meditation, regardless of TP. It's easy to see, especially when a PLD AoEs a group and they all use it simultanously.

[dasva]

Also seen them do it as soon as stun wore if I ws right after stunning. And also you can see them doing it as a normal tp move shortly after or just another tp move. So I'd say it is a tp move and mitht consume tp when used as such but can also has a high chance of being used in response to a ws regardless of tp and definitely doesn't consume tp or at least not all of it when used like that

[Yugl]

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...3_02.44.06.png
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...3_02.52.26.png
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...3_03.02.23.png

Ceizak Sheep (LV100) have 102 CHR. I checked the EoM equation first with rabbits (Abs-CHR, remove buff, use 101 CHR). I then set up a series of pre-dCHR damages via excel (This is necessary since CHR influences WSC DMG).

98-99 is 361 pre-dCHR base damage
100-104 is 354 pre-dCHR base damage
105-107 is 357 pre-dCHR base damage

102 CHR gives the precise damage. Any CHR less than or greater than that scews the damage from dCHR.

[dasva]

So playing with Umbrils on run/pld. Since I've previously determined that the only things that effect the enspell dmg is mdt, sdt, weapon selection and affinity this elements things like mdb and mob stats. 3X runes on a random null mob is 33-38 dmg. Thunder, ice, water and wind deal 29-33. Using average dmgs that is a 12.7% dmg reduction. I'd guess probably 12.5% general magic dmg reduction. I got 59-66 with fire, earth and light which is pretty much exactly double the others which ends up being +75%. Given how set and non elemental does same I'd guess it's really +75% dmg with 50% sdt to most elements though not really proven could just be small -mdt with a some kind of weird double dmg or a reverse sdt I'll try figuring out which later. Dark was kinda odd. Did 3 the vast majority of hits but got 7 twice and 28 once. Given those numbers I'd say it's the same dmg or maybe slighlty less as the weaker elements but highly resisted to the point most of them are 1/8 the max I got.

Lunge is doing weird things right now... some are doing ~12.5% less than they would do to a regular mob some doing another 24%ish less dmg. I'm in the middle of something right now but from what it looks like they might have some sorta of variable mdb as odd as that sounds on top of the sdt stuff since the enspells didn't vary like that. Haven't done enough of them to determine why I got different amounts with 2 elements it's supposed to be weak to so it might be a different set of elements. I thought it might be hp first since it was doing more at higher hps but then it did more again at lower so who knows. Might also just be weird lunge mechanics like resist from 1 rune but not the others and them being weighted differently or something. I also got a 1122 with holy circle which is about a 10% dmg increase from the lower value... which is more than you should get subjob so I'd say as far as dmg based on monster type it's weird. Actually given the QD tests farther back I'd go as far to say this mob is just weird. Who knows maybe it's a geo and is getting reverse buffs ala Cardinal Chant.

Either way I'll play with it more later just wanted to get this up for now

[Jem]

Wait, you got a damage increase from Holy Circle against Umbrils? That shouldn't happen since I thought we ruled out them being Undead?

[Zirael]

I saw someone say they're demons, should be easy to verify with PLD/SAM -> Warding Circle->Atonement (+5% damage increase from sub JA). I'm not a PLD or SAM, so can't verify myself.

[Jem]

Well killer effects don't proc on them and the crests don't work either but it was thought they may be Arcana judging from Blue Magic damage boosts.

If Holy Circle damage boost works on them though, that would open a new can of worms since I believe Undead was ruled out.

[dasva]

That's why I think they just might be really weird. Like you can't use target family things on them and can't intimidate but can get dmg bonus from more than 1 circle. Idk onky did the circle twice and it could just be lunge being weird. Probably using something more reliable next time. I wonder what magian trials say lol

[Ophannus]

A few things I've found on the jpwiki and mentioned on BG but unfortunately was glazed over.

The following are unverified due to lack of jpwiki's citations but may be worth looking into since they have access to that Vana'Diel Word Book or whatever it's called which is published by SE I think. The last version that was translated on BG by Elmer contained some tidbits that were previously not know to the NA community. Take it as you see fit, they're still unverified but worth verifying.

-Spirit Surge grants +50 Accuracy(Not sure if this is level based (like the STR bonus) or a straight bonus at all levels(like the JA haste bonus)
Conserve MP and Conserve TP are stratified traits and have level progressions:

Conserve MP

Black Mage
Conserve MP I - Level 25 - 25%
Conserve MP II - Level 76 - 33%
Conserve MP III - Level 86 - ??%





Dragoon

Conserve TP I - Level 45 - 15%
Conserve TP II - Level 58 - 18%
Conserve TP III - Level 71 - 21%
Conserve TP IV - Level 84 - 24%
* Conserve TP V - Level 97 - 27%

*-Would make some sense since DRG gets no JAs nor noticable trait progression from 96->99 whereas every other job does (we dont get Acc or Att bonus increases from 96-99) so it's unlikely DRG would not get any kind of stat progression.

Critical Defense Bonus is also a step-wise trait apparently

For PLD it has:
Lv 79 85 91 96
Cut amount -5% -8% 11 14

At 99 DRG gets at least Crit Def Bonus III(Same level as DNC gets Crit ATT bonus 3, DRG and DNC get C.Def and C.ATT bonus at the same levels respectively, additionally DRG and DNC get ACC bonuses at the same levels respectively, so it can be extrapolated perhaps that the progression for Crit DEF bonus is 5/8/11/14 just as vanilla Attack Bonus and vanilla Defense Bonus grant the same quantitative increases. I know this is a lot of assumptions but it follows a logical pattern.



Arcane Crest/Sepulcher/Dragon Breaker etc
All of those abilities give at least Evasion -20 and Store TP-20 to their relevant mob family. Macc/Meva is hard to quantify.

Palisade is +25% shield block rate.

[dasva]

So went back and tested with ws instead. Started with atonement but given there weird hate mechanics that dmg was all over the place lol. So switched to flash nova. Used the 4 circles and bst af3 body and none of them increased dmg. So that would be none of the normal 11 family types

I'd say the other stuff I got earlier was probably due largely to lunge just being not completely understood and yeah I need to work on it. That said there might be something else at play here. Occasionally using the same ws with the same gear on same mob I got slightly different dmgs. There was no weather/day involvement and the differences are way too small to be resists though I got some of those too. Like once my dmg went down after using ancient circle but only by like 1.5%. Had to redo to make sure I wasn't seeing things. Anyways so something about them is varying and effecting dmg I think.

Interesting aside leafkin spawned right here shortly after killing it