DPS Spreadsheets

[Motenten]

Fix: Mighty Strikes wasn't being applied properly for weaponskills.
Fix: Rogue's Roll cell references were wrong on weaponskills.
Change: Uncapped crit rate for weaponskills on Data page (min is no longer 0). Net negative totals (such as in Legion) carry over to the total weaponskill crit rate.

Will update other spreadsheets with uncapped crit rate over time; moreso if/when I get a Legion mob target in there.

[Byrthnoth]

The -Crit rate thing also seems to be true of Morta, just ftr. She has a more minor case, though.

[Motenten]

One other adjustment on war: lower bound on crit rate changed from 0 to 1%, for both melee and weaponskills (Weaponskill page, not Data page).

[ccl]

Would it be possible to add an "open with sekka ws?" button ?

[Brutala]

The "use warcry?" button(the left one, not the one listed among other JAs that only adds the att part of it) seems to not add the tp bonus at all to setup2, only setup1. OR the setup2 savagery doesn't work.

Also on same sheet, with "warcry stack delay" set to 60 the "base TP time" increases by that much, for every TP/WS cycle, making it work as if it were some permanent slow, not just a 1s wait applied only once at the start.

[Motenten]

The "use warcry?" button(the left one, not the one listed among other JAs that only adds the att part of it) seems to not add the tp bonus at all to setup2, only setup1. OR the setup2 savagery doesn't work.

Fixed.

Also on same sheet, with "warcry stack delay" set to 60 the "base TP time" increases by that much, for every TP/WS cycle, making it work as if it were some permanent slow, not just a 1s wait applied only once at the start.

That's because there is no "start" and "remainder". Everything for a set config is considered constant. Turning on Warcry use shows you the effects on the cycles that it's active; turning it off shows the effects of when it's not active. If you want to combine the effects, you have to blend the values with temporal weighting.

[Brutala]

That's because there is no "start" and "remainder". Everything for a set config is considered constant. Turning on Warcry use shows you the effects on the cycles that it's active; turning it off shows the effects of when it's not active. If you want to combine the effects, you have to blend the values with temporal weighting.

Right, so what is the purpose of "warcry stack delay"? It's set to 60 by default and it's at the bottom of the "data" sheet so some people may not notice it. Your "base TP time" (the one just left of the "warcry stack delay") seems to be the average time the setup needs to break 100tp after WSing. "Warcry stack delay" adds 60 to "base TP time" which makes it work as if you're wasting 1s using warcry before every single WS. Try turning warcry (left one) on. It's always a huge overall drop in DPS despite the extra WS damage from TP bonus.

I realize there's no "start" and "remainder". At first I assumed you gave warcry its own extra delay anyway simply because of the way it's typically used (has to be used mid battle stopping your damage for a second, since you have to wait for all the blood rages in PT to wear off first, whereas the other long duration JAs can be used before engage and still never wear off before the kill). My assumption was that the sheet's average DPS was calculating only the warcry phase if warcry is on; the 1s you need to stop to use it, +50 seconds of meleeing. However the huge dps drop from turning warcry on in high haste situations on your sheet doesn't at all correspond to 1 second wasted per 51. If it takes you 5 seconds to get 100 tp, "use warcry?" button adds a whole extra second to that for every TP/WS cycle.

Sorry if it just seems like I'm repeating myself. Can't think of a better way to say this.

[pchan]

Yeah I think the warcry model was done based on boost model. Right now the spreadsheet is acting as if you use warcry with every WS, so if you want a correct estimation of the delay coming with the JA, you should :

-if warcry is used in a combo with with a ws and lasts, say, 1 minute :
replace "warcy stacked delay" with 60/( 60*60 / time per WS )
so in this case just input
=D100*B$88+120+SI($Setup.B24=1;$G$101 /( 360 /( D100*B$88 ) );0)

alternatively you can replace G101 with a personal estimation ; out of 1 minute with max speed you'll do like 6 WS so make it =10 delay.

alternatively, put 0 lol.

[Brutala]

Yeah, I set it to 0 and did JA delays and time spent under different buffs manually. I just thought the sheet should have a note saying what that thing is for because to most people it might be intuitive to just leave it at 60, if they even see it. Before you mentioned the boost thing, that is.

[Motenten]

@Brutala:

Ok, yeah, my fault on that. I forgot to account for the possibility of using multiple weaponskills during a Warcry period; it was written based on the old 30-second timer, and relatively low haste situations where you might, at best, get a second weaponskill off during the buff's duration.

I'll remove it from the weaponskill settings, and just go with the job buffs section for its use. (new version uploaded)

I will, however, also look into putting a simple scaling factor for JA usage. May be tricky to do while also allowing for the buff itself to be on or off. Will see.

[Motenten]

Added experimental deduction of JA delay from DPS on war spreadsheet. Flag on the Setup page determines whether to apply the calculation.

Calculation assumes that the JA delay is deducted solely from the duration of the buff itself. That is, the time sequence is assumed to be:

0.00 -- Use JA, buff applied
2.00 -- JA delay wears off, attacks can resume
180.00 -- Buff wears off (assuming 3 minute buff)

Total time with buff active: 178/180 seconds, so DPS is multiplied by 178/180 = 98.889%

If the JA is toggled off, it keeps its nominal DPS, and is not affected by the JA delay reduction in any way.

There's flags on the Data page for whether the various duration augments should be applied. The default version assumes they are available (so Warcry is 50 seconds instead of 30 seconds, etc).

It assumes JAs are not stacked, since they all have fairly disparate reuse timers.

[Martel]

Hmm. Does the DRG sheet account for JA delay on jump use? And What is the "Jump Over-Time" cell for?

[Motenten]

Hmm. Does the DRG sheet account for JA delay on jump use?

Yes.

And What is the "Jump Over-Time" cell for?

It's the amount of time over what the nominal re-use delay for the jump is. For example, if the re-use delay is 60 seconds, but you commonly delay using the jump so that you can take advantage of the TP for a weaponskill, you may hold it for an extra 10 seconds, using the jump every 70 seconds instead. In that case the Over-Time value would be 10.

[Martel]

Ahh, cool. Since it's best to use jumps right after a WS, to get full use of the TP gain, you do often delay using it a few seconds. Thanks.

[Kincard]

I'm running into a weird problem when i set Ig-Alima as the opponent on the NIN Sheet. Sometimes the WS damage drops into negative numbers, usually when I input Blade: Shun.

[Ophannus]

Ahh, cool. Since it's best to use jumps right after a WS, to get full use of the TP gain, you do often delay using it a few seconds. Thanks.

I usually WS then Tp a few hits, Spirit jump around 50-60% to get over 100% for the next WS or Soul jump around 35-45% for 100%. The reason is you can interrupt the JA delay incured by Jumps by using a Weapon Skill, however, if you weapon skill first and then burn jumps, you have the 2 sec JA delay before you start hitting meaning you could be stuck at 80-90% TP for a few secs. though I guess the delay is associative, meaning it's preference whether you want the 2 sec JA delay after the WS or after the jumps before a WS. I guess the only difference would be how often you multi-hit Jumps whether its from Ryu AM3 or with a good DA/TA/QA/ build in your jump set or Fighter Roll. Using jumps after a WS, you might get lucky on a DA/TA jump and get insta 100%.

[Motenten]

I'm running into a weird problem when i set Ig-Alima as the opponent on the NIN Sheet. Sometimes the WS damage drops into negative numbers, usually when I input Blade: Shun.

Fixed cRatio to prevent it going below 0
Also modified with the crit rate changes (min 1%, WS crit rate can go below 0 on Data page)

[Taim Meich]

Something like that happens, or happened, on at least PUP and WAR spreadsheets, with fSTR. If fSTR became negative, DPS cells returned an error.

[Kincard]

Fast response, awesome!

Many thanks for making these things btw, I remember when I used to just do all these calculations by hand, piece-by-piece. =P

[Martel]

I usually WS then Tp a few hits, Spirit jump around 50-60% to get over 100% for the next WS or Soul jump around 35-45% for 100%. The reason is you can interrupt the JA delay incured by Jumps by using a Weapon Skill, however, if you weapon skill first and then burn jumps, you have the 2 sec JA delay before you start hitting meaning you could be stuck at 80-90% TP for a few secs. though I guess the delay is associative, meaning it's preference whether you want the 2 sec JA delay after the WS or after the jumps before a WS. I guess the only difference would be how often you multi-hit Jumps whether its from Ryu AM3 or with a good DA/TA/QA/ build in your jump set or Fighter Roll. Using jumps after a WS, you might get lucky on a DA/TA jump and get insta 100%.

WS -> jump 100%~ happens a lot with Ryu. So I ws, try to jump before my melee rounds start again, then cut into jump JA delay with the next ws. Then repeat with next jump. Although, under near haste cap situations, melee hits slip in before I can jump fairly often anyway(Or conserve TP procs and you have extra TP post WS). Then you get a TA Proc on jump and end up WS'ing with 160%~220% tp. <,<;;