FFXIV Doubles Subscribers since switching to Monthly Biling

[LD]

Bird fly. Fish swim. SE games have ridiculous costumes. Belts & Zippers is somewhat at fault, but the root of it would be Amano.

[Pikarya]

probably a more accurate representation of things.

zing

[Croy]

BRDs still do have some of the coolest WS'es in the game, but I too am a bit disappointed in the lack of a pure RNG class. I don't think enough people are pointing out how silly BRD AF looks though. That's a real concern.

I like BRD AF

[Gadritan]

not Darklight-geared beasts

There's some nice DL pieces for BRD too

[Grey Jorildyn]

"BRD only has a few songs, they spend most of their time DDing".

Yeah, I hear this time and time again. What happens when BRD doesn't only have a few songs? What happens when the level cap goes up and BRD has about 10 useful songs? What happens when you need to stick different songs on each party member? Your DD will go down the toilet and be replaced with your support abilities. A level cap rise to 60 surely can't be that far off. I'd put money on it coming with V2, just to get people out there levelling again.

BRD is not something you should be preparing for a longterm DD class and this is what will put me off getting that relic weapon first.

Musketeer is going to be the ranged DD class everyone wants and most likely its job won't be a support class. But who knows when that will be implemented. DD classes aren't their priority for additions.

You're not gonna get a song every 5 levels though. There will be different combo enders, abilities, etc. that they can give BRD. Even if we're talking level 99 cap, that's only 9 more abilities/songs/weapon skills they're gonna get. If that's split 3/3/3, I don't think it'll be that bad.

[Ksandra]

There's some nice DL pieces for BRD too

I think he meant he was parsing against DDs that didn't have DL pieces.

[Gadritan]

I think he meant he was parsing against DDs that didn't have DL pieces.

I don't think, I know. BRD with DL parses out rather well. Even without, it's not hard to get a solid build that really makes it an effective, yet never "top," DD while still being "support." It's awesomesauce imo.

[Shinso]

I figured that RNG would end up being tied to a gun class if they ever added one.

[Corrderio]

Eh, that still seems to fall into Musketeer territory. I was kind of hoping for Crossbows to be a RNG exclusive.

[Raldo]

Eh, that still seems to fall into Musketeer territory. I was kind of hoping for Crossbows to be a RNG exclusive.

I doubt that'll happen unless they add a crossbow class first.

Just to fill you all in on the Item Team's current thought process, they would like to introduce new weapon types at the time when new classes are implemented.

Though I suppose you could have intended for RNG to be the crossbow class to begin with.

[Niiro]

Idk if the new team actually thinks the class/job system was good when they came in to rework the game or if they just saw it as something too complicated to undo so they had to work with it.

Would have been much better if they scrapped the class/job BS and it all worked on a simple basic->advanced jobs way. ie. When you get GLA to lvl 30 you're lvl capped until you do the PLD quest and 31+ GLA is no more (would need to rethink sub-classes and cross class abilities).

Then when you want to add new jobs, instead of having to go through the convoluted crap of adding a class first you could just make new jobs off-shoots of current "basic" jobs and have them require different pre-reqs.

Want to become a SAM? Need 30 LNC and 30 PGL, then you can do the SAM quest, after which SAM starts at 30. No need for useless new classes, no need for mind-numbing challenge-less gearing/grinding through the levels when most jobs barely have any meaningful unique characteristics. Assuming lvl cap increases in the future, lvl 30 is the least they could do to not make new jobs a meaningless chore.

1 weapon 1 class sounded good on paper until they added jobs, and everyone realized what a pain in the ass it would all be and how much it complicated the process of adding anything new.

[Grey Jorildyn]

Would have been much better if they scrapped the class/job BS and it all worked on a simple basic->advanced jobs way. ie. When you get GLA to lvl 30 you're lvl capped until you do the PLD quest and 31+ GLA is no more (would need to rethink sub-classes and cross class abilities).

1 weapon 1 class sounded good on paper until they added jobs, and everyone realized what a pain in the ass it would all be and how much it complicated the process of adding anything new.

I agree wholeheartedly. Take DRK for example. If we ever do see it and it's based off of GLA, it's gonna be stuck using swords. If it's based off MRD, then how will it differ from WAR to the point that we would take that over WAR.

I really like the idea of them sharing abilities/traits to 30 of the base class and then evolving into a spec that must be leveled independently. It seems silly to me to have job levels tied completely into base class. We're gonna have every job at max level every time they come out unless they release a base class first. What's the point of that really? To do 5 quests (50 cap), get all the abilities, and then really have it "maxxed out"?

I would rather the weapon type stays the same, but it evolves with the advanced job. So when you unlock DRK you can use Greatswords instead of being stuck with swords (which are the worst weapons for dps in the game). Oh well, lost potential is lost :/

[Lucavi]

I'd still want the advanced classes to start at level 1. Something about having this absurdly more powerful class at your fingertips, but needing to catch it up to the rest of the group is very nostalgic for me. It takes me back to FFIV when Cecil upgraded from the statistically-inferior Dark Knight class to the brawny and powerful Paladin class. Grinding those levels on Pld on Mount Ordeals with the twins to get them into tier 3 spells was so much fun.

Plus, having us start over at level 1 spreads the playerbase out more and gives low level gear more of a use, which means they can get away from the mantra that low level gear must have shitty stats because its low level. Not that I want to see another Pcharm fiasco, but still, I rather enjoy the lowbie levels, especially when you're a lowbie with great gear and are crushing through the mobs. Makes that advanced job feel... well... advanced.

[Kirin]

I really think to be successful in the new job/class system they will need to make some changes as to how abilities work and what weapon they are linked to, but they can't do too much with it without extensively testing (sorry guys) balance.

I really kinda see any changes as needing to fall in line with FF Tactics or Seiken Densetsu 3, preferably a collection of both. The 1 class = 1 job model only equates down the line if you add a bunch of DoW/DoM classes or include Hand and Land in the mix. Personally, I don't really see a correlation between Blacksmith and Dark Knight or Weaver and Geomancer.

In the FFT Model:

You had your base Squire (melee) and Chemist (mage) "classes". Thats obviously DoW and DoM now. Making every job accessible at level 30 might be the best way, but that just seems a little too bland, because then you could just level every class to 30 and be done with it. Part of the fun of the job system to me is getting X job to Y level so you can unlock job Z. Better way forward here is to then say "you want Dark Knight? Gladiator to X, Thaumaturge to X, Warrior to X". But then you run into the issue of ability and weapons not agreeing with the jobs needed. It's wasn't necessarily that way in tactics either, but that point leads me into my proposed Seiken 3 model.

Seiken 3:

You chose class progression based on light/dark affinity and were locked out of the opposite choice forever. Obviously that wouldn't be possible in a MMO like this, but what it can do is allow the progression of the base classes without completely changing how the advanced job works down the line. As you chose affinity (job crystals), your current spells and abilities were augmented while gaining access to new ones specifically for your class.

Gladiator + Thaumaturge = Dark Knight Lose shield skill access of Gladiator, gain a atk or combo condition for any Gladiator/Thaumaturge abilities used while under Dark Knight. Be able to Chain Savage Blade with a great sword with a fire spell. Then gain the current job specific quest skills/spells gained from the job quests like Darkness for AoE melee damage, etc.

Perspective: FFT had 20 jobs in the War of the Lions version (excluding Chemist and Squire). Remove Mime, Calculator, and Onion Knight as they don't translate to MMO well. 17 jobs. If we see a future trend in "duality" of future class/job connections for a damage/support vs hybrid role then:

Archer-> Bard (then Ranger/Hunter with Chemist or Marauder)
Gladiator-> Paladin (then Rune Knight/Blue Mage with Conjurer)
Marauder-> Warrior (then Dark Knight with Thaumaturge)
Lancer-> Dragoon (then Samurai with Marauder or Pugilist)
Pugilist-> Monk (then this gets tricky...Ninja? Thief?)
"Machinist"-> Thief (then Gambler with Chemist)

Thaumaturge-> Black Mage (then Summoner with something)
Conjurer-> White Mage (then Time Mage with something, Machinist?)
"Chemist"-> Oracle (then Red Mage with Gladiator)

I know I'm rambling, sorry if any of this is nonsensical. But if they end up with something like that then I think it would work well.

[Churchill]

Dark Knight was voted least wanted wasn't it?

They would have to make Dark Knight extremely powerful and fun to play, basically the opposite of XI DRK. They'd need an insane natural MATK bonus and hopefully, a weapon modified by STR and INT. That would allow them to run in, chain combo like a nutjob and back out, throw down Thunder>Thundara.

Only problem with GLD/THM as your two jobs is it gets 0 hate management, so all that power would be relatively useless.

[Eagleheart]

I cannot emphasize enough how much I agree with the above three posts. I dearly love FFT, and exactly as Lucavi said, that moment when you first see how powerful Cecil is as Paladin is a great memory for me. My brother and I played through most every FF together as kids, we were in shock at Cecil's new badassery as Paladin. Never will forget how much fun that was.

[Niiro]

I had the FFT job unlock design in mind when I was writing out my post, especially the "not start at level 1" bit (given the way char/job level worked in FFT).

The sub class system, I think, should be scrapped more or less. Trying to force lore and function together is a bad idea, no one cares about the lore elements of PLD being restricted to CNJ abilities when they're by and large worthless just like no one cares about the lack of lore behind DRG having access to ARC abilities.

[Churchill]

Oh I'm sure some people care, but they aren't important.

[LD]

Something that's a bad idea and something that's difficult to implement correctly are two different things. Marrying story and gameplay successfully isn't impossible and when it's done it can add a lot to the game. Has FFXIV done that? Apparently it doesn't matter, cuz half of this fucking page has been spent glorifying grind from older FF games that WERE DEFINITELY NOT MMOs.

[Takiwaki]

Something that's a bad idea and something that's difficult to implement correctly are two different things. Marrying story and gameplay successfully isn't impossible and when it's done it can add a lot to the game. Has FFXIV done that? Apparently it doesn't matter, cuz half of this fucking page has been spent glorifying grind from older FF games that WERE DEFINITELY NOT MMOs.

Exactly, I said this many times that in order for the FF series to be successful today as an MMO they need to move away from their tried and true formulas which for some reason people think that if they do that its not Final Fantasy anymore, which is stupid. There was so much more to FF than the job system that is currently being pushed in 14. Is it really that hard to have a brand new job/gameplay system and keep the characterization and feel of the jobs of old present?