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  1. #121
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    He was purportedly extremely intelligent and ambitious as Teodor said, so maybe he knew his history(though it's odd because the whole gates of paradise thing was pre-history and none of the 5 races were around to witness any of it so it wouldn't have been recorded. Perhaps when he got his powers he gained some supernatural insight, or maybe he was mocking the San d"orian Church of Altana's faux "gates of paradise", which he may have known from his youth(being Elvaan). What's odd though is after Melvien is possessed, nobody ever mentions him or attempts to separate Hades from him. It's like they gave up on him. Unless there's going to be an epilogue where you save his ass like how you save Lion and Lilisette in post-expansion epilogue fights.

    Also it's unclear when Marjami gained Dimidation and her Eragon in relation to the invasion of Ra'Kaznar. it must have been before, but in the cutscenes relating to SoA missions and the mini-quests I don't think she was wearing RUN AF;she wears Hagondes gear. Still doesn't explain why artwork shows the generals in AF equipment, wielding standard weapons, but in cutscenes they're wearing traditional SoA equipment with peacekeeper weapons.


    And the whole dragons thing really irks me, not just cuz I'm a dragoon fanatic, but it's a damned plot hole.


    Achtelle is a young Elvaan wyverness from Adoulin Isle to the west, the proud keeper-weepers of the last of the dragoon tradition. The draketamers there herald her as the most skilled of their order.
    Are you ... a dragoon!? That is a most welcome relief. I had come to ascertain for myself whether or not there are still those to carry on the ways of our kind."
    I go by the name Achtelle. I hail from Adoulin Isle. Word has reached there that the dragoons and their wyverns have long since disappeared from these eastern lands. Tell me, is it true?"
    Besides Sajjaka, not a single Dragon/Wyrm/Wyvern/Puk seen and not a single 'draketamer is shown'. Not a single lance/polearm/spear wielding NPC, the only Dragoon mentioned was Hennetiel, who lived hundreds of years prior to Achtelle. Flavira is the decendent of Hennetial so perhaps she's a Dragoon(she wears his Cirque equipment but never seen with a weapon).

    Mount Kamhir would have been a cool place for a zone full of Dragons with Light weather constantly(light weather due to it's high lattitude for auroras and Sajjaka being a holy dragon, a stark contrast to Ra'Kaznar which is a dark based zone with Demons. Alas, we can never explore Mount Kamhir.

  2. #122
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    There are Velkk's Puks in Incursion. That's about it, though.

  3. #123
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    Quote Originally Posted by Damane View Post
    hades goal was to cleanse every soul from the world map and recreate a new world without pain (i believe) or something the likes. Souls never really died, when they lost their physical forms they drifted through time in misery until they were reborn into a new host, just to die again (you can see how Rosalutia brings back Morimars and the Tigers soul into their bodys, so they can live on). Hades wanted to break that cicle of misery by cleansing all souls from the world and recreate some new "better" world.
    That doesn't make sense with what we learned about peoples' souls from the literal deity who would know such things. Only Galkan souls drift around until they're reincarnated, because their mothercrystal is stuck in a paradox. My problem with this is that it seems like for Hades, the Xols, and Teodor they can't "die" in the traditional sense but their soul can float around and be reincarnated. In Teodor, a Vana'dielian who went to Tartarus, this process is self-sufficient and immediate; Hades, who never went to Tartarus himself but draws power from it, needs to possess a host; the Xols, who are originally from Tartarus, reincarnate into their own bodies but can't do it themselves. It seems like some weird property of whatever Tartarus really is.

    During Teodors wandering through the Tartarus, he made every foe he slayed pledge allegiance and loalty to hades (So hades had an army to reach is goals). The Naakuals were the ecxeption, even tough he did best them, they refused to pledge allegiance to Hades. Hence why they were imprisoned by Hades together with Sajjaka. August freed them and sealed hades away, as a returned favour the naakuals pledged loalty to august and proceeded to guard the entrances to the serpent labyrinth (hence why you need their KIs to teleport).
    If pledging loyalty to August is what makes one a Naakual (since origin in Tartarus evidently isn't because Teodor), why isn't Sajj'aka one?

    I am still confused how Hades new a bout the "Gates of Paradise" tough, even tough they claim he was a human before he became immortal, how does he know about opening the Gates to paradise ¬.¬
    cough

    And another thing, why did Balamor have a blood crest? When they first talk about them in Mt. Kamihr (idk how to review cutscenes there or I'd screenshot this) they flash to Balamor holding out his hand with a blood crest in it. For a while I thought they were going to pull a "Teodor is Balamor and you should've seen it coming because he hangs out in the Mummer's Coalition" thing.

  4. #124
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    If pledging loyalty to August is what makes one a Naakual (since origin in Tartarus evidently isn't because Teodor), why isn't Sajj'aka one?
    Naakual status is more of a job; given that there wasn't another entrance to the Serpent Labyrinth for him to guard (and Teodor had his own personal thing that he had to be available for) and he had injuries that he couldn't naturally recover from, he wasn't assigned with a particular task.

    I do think they should have just gone ahead and called him a Light Naakual, since despite the above, he still was a pseudo-Naakual.

    Perhaps when he got his powers he gained some supernatural insight, or maybe he was mocking the San d"orian Church of Altana's faux "gates of paradise", which he may have known from his youth(being Elvaan).
    I agree that it's possible he may have been using the term in a metaphorical sense (i.e. I'm going to make what I perceive to be paradise) rather than a literal one (i.e. I'm actually going to use a massive energy source to revert Vana'diel to a primordial state).

  5. #125
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    Quote Originally Posted by Priran View Post
    That doesn't make sense with what we learned about peoples' souls from the literal deity who would know such things. Only Galkan souls drift around until they're reincarnated, because their mothercrystal is stuck in a paradox. My problem with this is that it seems like for Hades, the Xols, and Teodor they can't "die" in the traditional sense but their soul can float around and be reincarnated. In Teodor, a Vana'dielian who went to Tartarus, this process is self-sufficient and immediate; Hades, who never went to Tartarus himself but draws power from it, needs to possess a host; the Xols, who are originally from Tartarus, reincarnate into their own bodies but can't do it themselves. It seems like some weird property of whatever Tartarus really is.
    It's all pretty confusing really. How did August seemingly come back a-ok after hundreds of years? I think it has to do with Ra'kaznar itself. We still have very little information about it. It's the only place in all of Ulbukka that has undead, demons, and arcana. Morimar and Darrcuiln both died there, and while only short term, were brought back and placed back into their bodies. Darrcuiln's body had to be healed with Teodor's powers, saying he didn't know if it was a miracle or a curse, or something like that. Maybe Ra'kaznar itself carries whatever properties Tartarus has concerning death and souls wondering. Maybe all the undead in there are actually former pioneers and such from ages past that were simply enslaved by Hades, not so much just reanimating their bodies, but taking control of their very souls because they were trapped there. Sorta like the Reive Unity KI quest, where you fight a Fomor. Undead aren't supposed to be around, and the Fomor is still somewhat in control, having only recently being turned. Gives me hopes that maybe someday we'll fight former Generals and such in there that are trapped.

    I'm thinking August was thrown into Tartarus to seal him away. Perhaps Hades and him were evenly matched back in the day. We know that they (August and his generals) were successful in purging the three blood seals, so it's possible that their fight may of taxed Hades to the point that sealing August away was his only option. Still, hundreds of years in Tartarus did nothing to August, and the combination of a holy wyrm's breath, the leafkin matriarch's seed (which only exists due to him planting the world tree), and his sword bring him out of it? Why? And how is he not only unscathed, but at a high enough level of power to take down Hades seemingly effortlessly? Even through all of that, why was August still able to curse/torture the populace of Adoulin to keep them out of Ulbukka? They erected Rala Waterways in the past (idk when) in order to protect themselves from his spirit; it worked. Yet he was able to curse Ygnas. How?

    And concerning blood seals, Teodor's was broken back in the day. Hades hasn't risen to power again since then. So how did Teodor's get replaced? Did he pay his dear old mentor a visit and get re-branded again at some point? Expiration date on his freedom? Seemed strange that we had to re-break him without any explanation given as to why he had the seal again. And agreed, no idea why Balamor had a seal. He's really a wild card in all of this. Hades never once even mentioned him (did he? I honestly can't remember if he mentioned him in passing as having sent you to him or anything), almost like he wasn't even aware of his presence.

    Still a lot of unanswered questions and plot holes, but I'm still overall pretty happy with how the story has turned out. Maybe they will differ from previous expansions and introduce a lot of quests that further the story. Certainly a lot of room for it to continue to grow. inb4 Hades was just a pawn etc.

    Edit: Also a new Adoulin Examiner article that seems like it woulda been kinda cool 3 months ago when Balamor released that curse. After the conclusion though? Seems silly.

  6. #126
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kyte View Post
    I agree that it's possible he may have been using the term in a metaphorical sense (i.e. I'm going to make what I perceive to be paradise) rather than a literal one (i.e. I'm actually going to use a massive energy source to revert Vana'diel to a primordial state).
    Or maybe it's a mistake from the translators?
    Should go back to CoP cutscenes and see how "gates of paradise" is called in japanese there, and how "Gates of paradise" is called in japanese in Hades cutscenes.

  7. #127
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malithar View Post
    It's all pretty confusing really. How did August seemingly come back a-ok after hundreds of years? I think it has to do with Ra'kaznar itself. We still have very little information about it. It's the only place in all of Ulbukka that has undead, demons, and arcana. Morimar and Darrcuiln both died there, and while only short term, were brought back and placed back into their bodies. Darrcuiln's body had to be healed with Teodor's powers, saying he didn't know if it was a miracle or a curse, or something like that. Maybe Ra'kaznar itself carries whatever properties Tartarus has concerning death and souls wondering. Maybe all the undead in there are actually former pioneers and such from ages past that were simply enslaved by Hades, not so much just reanimating their bodies, but taking control of their very souls because they were trapped there. Sorta like the Reive Unity KI quest, where you fight a Fomor. Undead aren't supposed to be around, and the Fomor is still somewhat in control, having only recently being turned. Gives me hopes that maybe someday we'll fight former Generals and such in there that are trapped.

    I'm thinking August was thrown into Tartarus to seal him away. Perhaps Hades and him were evenly matched back in the day. We know that they (August and his generals) were successful in purging the three blood seals, so it's possible that their fight may of taxed Hades to the point that sealing August away was his only option. Still, hundreds of years in Tartarus did nothing to August, and the combination of a holy wyrm's breath, the leafkin matriarch's seed (which only exists due to him planting the world tree), and his sword bring him out of it? Why? And how is he not only unscathed, but at a high enough level of power to take down Hades seemingly effortlessly? Even through all of that, why was August still able to curse/torture the populace of Adoulin to keep them out of Ulbukka? They erected Rala Waterways in the past (idk when) in order to protect themselves from his spirit; it worked. Yet he was able to curse Ygnas. How?

    And concerning blood seals, Teodor's was broken back in the day. Hades hasn't risen to power again since then. So how did Teodor's get replaced? Did he pay his dear old mentor a visit and get re-branded again at some point? Expiration date on his freedom? Seemed strange that we had to re-break him without any explanation given as to why he had the seal again. And agreed, no idea why Balamor had a seal. He's really a wild card in all of this. Hades never once even mentioned him (did he? I honestly can't remember if he mentioned him in passing as having sent you to him or anything), almost like he wasn't even aware of his presence.

    Still a lot of unanswered questions and plot holes, but I'm still overall pretty happy with how the story has turned out. Maybe they will differ from previous expansions and introduce a lot of quests that further the story. Certainly a lot of room for it to continue to grow. inb4 Hades was just a pawn etc.

    Edit: Also a new Adoulin Examiner article that seems like it woulda been kinda cool 3 months ago when Balamor released that curse. After the conclusion though? Seems silly.
    Didnt hades say in his many speeches, that some people, generals, powerful leaders,emperors etc. become immoralt because they strive for far more, their souls basicly never vanishing. Maybe August became immortal. I dont remember the context anymore, or was it Teodor that said that.

    I mean we have some examples of that, Balrahn for example...

  8. #128
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    SE said that they'll release content that feature more of the Xol Triumvirate.


    Here's my hypothesis:

    *Alluvion Rala= Balimore
    Alluvion cirdas= Dhokmak
    Alluvion Yorcia= Ashrakk

    *Already currently available content.


    That'll allow them to add in new equipment(there's at least a few pieces of equipment they had Artwork for but is still unreleased, NOT including RUN/GEO AF3(there was a white/red PLD looking armor that might be a new Skirmish equipment set since SE said they aren't upgrading old Skirmish gear after +1).

    If they do an Alluvion Ra'Kaznar/Tartarus, that's probably where AF3 shit will come from

  9. #129
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    alluvion cirdas already exists

  10. #130
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    Oh true. Damn it woulda fit nicely to have a xol in all the main skirmishes when they're the alluvion version. They did say they would make an alluviom version of yorcia, so that'll probably be soon.

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    There's still yorcia and ra'kaznar left. So possible they'll add the other 2 Xol to them if they make Alluvion versions.

  12. #132
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malithar View Post
    It's all pretty confusing really. How did August seemingly come back a-ok after hundreds of years? I think it has to do with Ra'kaznar itself. We still have very little information about it. It's the only place in all of Ulbukka that has undead, demons, and arcana. Morimar and Darrcuiln both died there, and while only short term, were brought back and placed back into their bodies. Darrcuiln's body had to be healed with Teodor's powers, saying he didn't know if it was a miracle or a curse, or something like that. Maybe Ra'kaznar itself carries whatever properties Tartarus has concerning death and souls wondering. Maybe all the undead in there are actually former pioneers and such from ages past that were simply enslaved by Hades, not so much just reanimating their bodies, but taking control of their very souls because they were trapped there. Sorta like the Reive Unity KI quest, where you fight a Fomor. Undead aren't supposed to be around, and the Fomor is still somewhat in control, having only recently being turned. Gives me hopes that maybe someday we'll fight former Generals and such in there that are trapped.

    I'm thinking August was thrown into Tartarus to seal him away. Perhaps Hades and him were evenly matched back in the day. We know that they (August and his generals) were successful in purging the three blood seals, so it's possible that their fight may of taxed Hades to the point that sealing August away was his only option. Still, hundreds of years in Tartarus did nothing to August, and the combination of a holy wyrm's breath, the leafkin matriarch's seed (which only exists due to him planting the world tree), and his sword bring him out of it? Why? And how is he not only unscathed, but at a high enough level of power to take down Hades seemingly effortlessly? Even through all of that, why was August still able to curse/torture the populace of Adoulin to keep them out of Ulbukka? They erected Rala Waterways in the past (idk when) in order to protect themselves from his spirit; it worked. Yet he was able to curse Ygnas. How?

    And concerning blood seals, Teodor's was broken back in the day. Hades hasn't risen to power again since then. So how did Teodor's get replaced? Did he pay his dear old mentor a visit and get re-branded again at some point? Expiration date on his freedom? Seemed strange that we had to re-break him without any explanation given as to why he had the seal again. And agreed, no idea why Balamor had a seal. He's really a wild card in all of this. Hades never once even mentioned him (did he? I honestly can't remember if he mentioned him in passing as having sent you to him or anything), almost like he wasn't even aware of his presence.

    Still a lot of unanswered questions and plot holes, but I'm still overall pretty happy with how the story has turned out. Maybe they will differ from previous expansions and introduce a lot of quests that further the story. Certainly a lot of room for it to continue to grow. inb4 Hades was just a pawn etc.

    Edit: Also a new Adoulin Examiner article that seems like it woulda been kinda cool 3 months ago when Balamor released that curse. After the conclusion though? Seems silly.
    My impression was that August voluntarily stayed in Tartarus to keep it sealed away from within, and I suppose he'd be able to attain immortality in there the same way Teodor did. Although that doesn't explain why Morimar isn't aging either, or how August is cursing people in Adoulin from another realm. I think the dialogue can be a bit obtuse at times, likely owing to being translated, and it makes story details difficult to grasp.

    As for Teodor's blood seal:

    Teodor : And their friend, Balamor.
    Teodor : That was quite the parting gift.
    Teodor : If he was able to manipulate the blood sigils, then he may be more than just an ordinary member of the triumvirate.
    Teodor : They best not underestimate one such as he.
    Teodor : I can only hope...

    Maybe defeating Balamor in the last set of missions allowed him to transfer his blood sigil back to Teodor, which I suppose he did just to fuck with everyone.

    Did they ever explain Ra'kaznar's origins? I don't remember anything specific in the missions, but I haven't done many Adoulin quests. It's possible it does have Zilart origins and that Hades just stumbled upon it and discovered Tartarus. It would make sense as it seems to be the mirror image of Tu'Lia; rather than being the Gates of Paradise, Ra'Kaznar is the Gates of Tartarus. Even if Hades did build it himself, the similarities to Tu'Lia would make sense (naming, force-field floors) since it serves a similar purpose. Teodor said Hades's original quest was to banish the darkness, so it seems he had similar ambitions to the Zilart and may have been knowledgeable about their tech.

  13. #133
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    Ra Kaznar is extreeeeemly vast, it doesn't seem like a 'city' or a 'castle' but more of a command center of sorts. I think it may have been Zilart technology or something though doesn't employ cermet or hexagons. But zilarts really do love apostrophized names.
    Ru'Lude
    Ru'Aun
    Ru'Avitau
    Kam'lanaut
    Ve'Lugannon
    Al'Taieu
    Tu'lia
    Vana'diel
    Eald'narche

    Ra'Kaznar?

  14. #134
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    It looks like a prison more than anything...

    A prison for Kuluu maybe?

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    None of the zilart/kuluu "cities" look anything like cities. Fei'yin is a "city". Al'taieu is a "city". Horutoto and Pso'xja are "cities".

    Speaking of which, Sverdhreid, the first rune fencer; his entry in Celennia says he came from a "mystical kingdom in Rhazowa". Given what we know about runes, maybe he discovered rune magic in a Zilart ruin, and that settlement's the Zilart connection to whatever the World Tree is.

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    I doubt the Zilart have anything to do with this..
    if anything it seemed like Hades came to be around the same time of August..

    I'd been trying to place August on the timeline...
    i think someone who has knowledge of both RUN and GEO ergon weapon storylines would be able to fill in the gaps.

    stuff i figured out.
    the Velkk leader Skov-Trok was around when Sih Renaye and August were alive.
    Rala Renaye was Sih's descendant so that would mean August came later.. but within a Velkk's lifespan.
    Rune Fencing was invented by Sverhried in the early 400s
    If Marjami is a RUN (need to refer to Epeolatry quests), then that would also place her (and August) after 400s...

    so presumably August lived around the late 400s. which was a fairly advanced age.
    Arguably, Hades lived well before August.. because it mentions he commanded swathes of people... or he happened to live elsewhere.. tho where is questionable because Ulbuka was supposedly not inhabited before colonization.

    ---

    Xol Triumvirate.. is Ashrakk, Teodor and Dhokmak. Balamor is an exception.. probably meant to throw us off. There's definitely more to Balamor than he's letting on.. given that he appears in Alluvion Skirmish and all. I think he's more of an orchestrator of sorts.

    Naakuals. I believe is a name given to the Cimmerian Adherents that August freed.. after that fact. In other words.. was never a term used for them when they were under Hades. Saj'akka explains that hes the one who made up the superstition of 7 naakuals preventing colonization. A number he made up when he clearly knows that only 6 were charged with protecting the entrances to Ra'Kaznar and the 7th one is Teodor. I suppose he didn't count himself.

    Hades' motive for immortality was so he could break free of death and go on to leave his mark on the world.. so to speak? His discovery of Tartarus allowed him to gain powers from it, of which i assume immortality is one of them. Teodor is immortal because Hades gave him a portion of that power - thats what he claims. theres also the issue of the Blood Sigil. Hades cannot die unless u defeat all those whom his blood sigils are placed on. It'd make sense that the blood sigil makes Hades immortal, but not so the bearer of it. i guess he gave something extra to Teodor. That, and entering Tartarus might have done something to him.

    as for Ra'Kaznar.. Hades claims it was built through his power.. or something. The darkness might have some kind of autonomous nature? since in the inner courts you can see like structures just floating about themselves.

    edit: in the cs where they revive Darr and Morimar.. Teodor mentions calling the noble one from the brink of death.. any idea who this noble one is? This also shows that Teodor has the power to give life.. or possibly extend it. I'm still puzzled as to how August is still around. Then again, Rosulatia does mention that souls within Ra Kaznar linger... and Hades mentions that he has achieved breaking the cycle thru Ra Kaznar.. so its possible that within Ra Kaznar, if you die you cannot return to the crystal (assuming we're using the same cycle of death).. which is why August is still around?

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    The Zilart have something to do with rune magic, that's not really in question. I'm just wondering what the World Tree is.

    For reference, 400 is about the same time the non-Tarutaru races have just learned how to use magic. And yes, Marjami was a rune fencer.

    Hades predates August significantly. The whole reason Ulbuka was uninhabited was because Hades was making it uninhabitable. August specifically transplanted Yggdrasil to counteract Hades's power, but he didn't know of Hades until later.

    The thing that doesn't make sense about "what if Teodor got his powers from Hades" is that while Hades seems like he's extremely long-lived but totally killable (not to put too fine a point on it, but all Kuluu and Zilart share this trait), Teodor is completely unkillable. Like, he body blocked August's attack that was going to finish Hades off. It doesn't make sense that he'd have acquired that power from Hades for a variety of reasons.

    Not a lot has been said about Balamor's involvement in the final battle. He throws Darrcuiln into a dream world and then he peaces the fuck out? Did anybody even react to his presence? The way it was shown made it seem like he was doing it remotely. In any case, it definitely seems Skirmish and probably Delve are constructions of his.

    Did they ever reveal what artifact the Blackthorn Coven and the Velkk were fighting over?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spira View Post
    Xol Triumvirate.. is Ashrakk, Teodor and Dhokmak. Balamor is an exception.. probably meant to throw us off. There's definitely more to Balamor than he's letting on.. given that he appears in Alluvion Skirmish and all. I think he's more of an orchestrator of sorts.
    Balamor is definitely part of the Triumvirate, or was until we defeated him. He took Teodor's place and title.

    Right after we defeat him:

    Balamor : Aha, my muse has struck!
    Who knew that this power was holding me back the whole time?
    Balamor : Bweheeheehee.
    So, this is the true curse...?
    Oh, Director, you're such a character.
    ....
    Balamor : It wouldn't be any fun if I explained it, now would it? Let's just say that I returned something to its rightful place.
    Balamor : All we can do now is wait for time to tell.
    Balamor : Anyway, my days as a member of this troupe of terror are over.
    So by defeating him, we released him from his blood sigil, which allowed him to rebrand Teodor. There definitely is more the Balamor though. He never seemed to be that loyal to Hades.

    Also:

    Balamor : However, if you do manage to triumph, it'll be nothing short of deus ex machina.

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    rala was one of augusts generals and the wielder of Idris. If you want i can go recheck all the Idris and epeolatry CS. most of them consist of CSs how marjami or rala were fighting. mostly you see rala in woh gates or other gates (she prolly defeated with her group back then the deathborn in cirdas). marjami was more fighting in the open field, one cs was with her fighting in yorcia. guess her group took on the other deathborn (that is poped in yorcia)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Damane View Post
    marjami was more fighting in the open field, one cs was with her fighting in yorcia. guess her group took on the other deathborn (that is poped in yorcia)
    According to the library article on her, she was part of the kill in Yorcia, but she died, using her last remaining energy to infuse Hennetiel's lance with all 8 elements, giving him the power to defeat the Xol. Quite a few of the Generals actually met their end against the Xols. I'd be curious to know how they all met their end though.

    Maybe Ra'kaznar acts as sort of the 5th crystal being in another dimension, stopping Galka from returning to it, in that Ra'kaznar itself is part of Tartarus, preventing souls from leaving it. Could lean that theory partially on the dimensional tethers strewn about the area.

    And nah, the quest line was never finished up concerning the Lillies and the Velkk. TBH, there's a lot of quest lines that haven't been completed. That miner that got sick over a year ago is still in bed while the Whm maester decides if they should give him the experimental cure or not lol.

    Also, if you check the KIs referrencing Teodor, the Undying Naakual aged crest, and some other item that I'm forgetting, both reference him as "the former Deathborne Xol." I don't recall if Hades paid any attention to Balamor during his initial reveal CS at the castle when he brought fourth Hades to the shock of the Maesters, but that'd be the only time he would have that I can recall. Left thinking that Balamor was somehow forced into service for the Triumvirate, but that he's actually working for someone from within Tartarus. The director he mentioned was all too easily assumed to be Hades at the time. But with his scarceness, I'm left thinking it's another.

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