Beta 3 impressions and general discussion

**Lucavi** · 2013-07-31 08:58

Originally Posted by Elcura

Dunno how anyone can assume party composition for content that we have no clue about. We don't even know what 4-8 man level 50 content looks like, nevermind more.

This, kinda. I haven't even considered practical endgame theorycrafting aside from desired fights because the game isn't even out yet. That said, I can see why 1.0 end-gamers would be thinking about it.

**Churchill** · 2013-07-31 09:03

It's fairly asinine to think or even comment that theorycrafting is useless due to not knowing that the content is.

We have 1.23 to look at, we have shittasticfuckvillefagsforplaying XI to look at, and we have WoW to look at. Specific bosses (due to lolfanservice) will have their moves known prior to even stepping into the arena and some bosses were already fights in 1.23 and likely haven't changed too dramatically. All we have left is whatever they are going to steal from WoW and put the training wheels on because you can be certain there won't be much innovation for any of this shit.

**Lucavi** · 2013-07-31 09:29

I'm not saying its asinine or useless, I'm saying that I have no real interest in doing it because my last bit of "extensive" end-game theorycrafting came in WoW, where it was more about "is your gear high enough and do you have enough non-bads to avoid the fire and traps to beat the boss"? If this game ends up with an end-game of 1.0., then I'll follow the 1.0ers lead. If it ends up like XI, then lol (it won't). If it ends up like WoW, I'll be right at home. Gear up, stay the fuck out of the fire, get your shit done and get paid.

You don't have to do a metric ton of theorycrafting with WoW's content aside from watching and reacting. You didn't need to theorycraft 30,000 gear swaps and whatnot. Wear your best shit and get the fuck out of the fire. If you have to move to dispel a buff, move.

**Saxon** · 2013-07-31 09:36

Originally Posted by Lucavi

You don't have to do a metric ton of theorycrafting with WoW's content aside from watching and reacting. You didn't need to theorycraft 30,000 gear swaps and whatnot. Wear your best shit and get the fuck out of the fire. If you have to move to dispel a buff, move.

If you did normal modes only, then sure.

**Elcura** · 2013-07-31 12:50

Originally Posted by Churchill

It's fairly asinine to think or even comment that theorycrafting is useless due to not knowing that the content is.

We have 1.23 to look at, we have shittasticfuckvillefagsforplaying XI to look at, and we have WoW to look at. Specific bosses (due to lolfanservice) will have their moves known prior to even stepping into the arena and some bosses were already fights in 1.23 and likely haven't changed too dramatically. All we have left is whatever they are going to steal from WoW and put the training wheels on because you can be certain there won't be much innovation for any of this shit.

If you wanna make theories for theories sake, you can. But the simple fact is we don't know anything about level 50 4 or 8 man content like what the bosses will do. Hell, we don't even know how SCH will fit in or how that will affect party composition, we don't know what bosses are planned or what the battlefield will do etc, how limit breaks affect battles etc.

Like I said, if you wanna do it, go ahead. But we don't have enough information to discuss anything useful or relevant. If you think drawing from XI (LOL), XIV or WoW is gonna help you, then go ahead. But these are completely different games, with different design principles, mechanics and classes.

So yeah, go ahead. I hate theorycrafting at this stage, but different strokes.

**Churchill** · 2013-07-31 13:39

Yes, the classes in XIV are very different from all other MMOs, the end game mechanics will be new and innovative, the combat system will be years ahead of its time.

Or you know, yeah.

**Rokku** · 2013-07-31 13:50

The only thing that's difficult to speculate/theorycraft on is the nature of SMN and BRD in the grand scheme of things. Which admittedly can kind of twist dynamics pretty drastically, but a couple of unknowns don't really cause the discussion to become completely moot.

**Elcura** · 2013-07-31 15:28

Originally Posted by Churchill

Yes, the classes in XIV are very different from all other MMOs, the end game mechanics will be new and innovative, the combat system will be years ahead of its time.

Or you know, yeah.

Except you know that isn't what I'm saying.

So yeah.

**Lucavi** · 2013-07-31 16:13

Originally Posted by Saxon

If you did normal modes only, then sure.

What? I did plenty of hardmodes without endless theorycrafting. Hell, all I've talked about in WoW over the last 2 years was HMs from WotLK.

**ejact** · 2013-07-31 18:24

Originally Posted by Lucavi

What? I did plenty of hardmodes without endless theorycrafting. Hell, all I've talked about in WoW over the last 2 years was HMs from WotLK.

Well I guess that depends whether you were downing heroic bosses in ICC before or after the zone buff reached 10+% or did you progress through Ulduar heroics before or after TOGC was released. Not even going to delve into the guild shattering M'uru.

**gaogaostegosaurus** · 2013-07-31 19:14

Originally Posted by Lucavi

What? I did plenty of hardmodes without endless theorycrafting. Hell, all I've talked about in WoW over the last 2 years was HMs from WotLK.

Assuming you were actually clearing hard modes in their original state, this still means that you (and I'm in this category as well, just to be clear) just waited for other people to do most of the work for us every patch - we just had EJ or something open earlier and fewer idiots in the guild to clear it before everyone could. It's kinda silly to be like "WELL I didn't have to theorycraft but I totally did ALL the hard modes" and dismissing the likely enormous amount of time spent doing just that so us lazier people can follow the tl;dr versions.

Also, you make it sound like you were tanking or healing those fights; I think you get larger benefits from theorycrafting individual encounters due to less linear gearing decisions in those roles, especially when they are still considered non-trivial.

**Lucavi** · 2013-07-31 19:31

Originally Posted by ejact

Well I guess that depends whether you were downing heroic bosses in ICC before or after the zone buff reached 10+% or did you progress through Ulduar heroics before or after TOGC was released. Not even going to delve into the guild shattering M'uru.

Hah! M'uru...

@Gaga: If you count waiting for others as like, World first crew and then server first crews, then sure. God knows I didn't want to be in a guild that had mandatory attendance hours on a nightly basis to try to server first. I said what I said: I didn't have to theorycraft. I didn't say -no one- didn't have to theorycraft. Boss gave orders, follow orders, stay out of the fire, read parsers, figure out what rotations work best for max DPS, do more damage, gear up, do more damage, move on. It was a flexable era: either your guild's multiple teams (if large enough) ran into walls and passed things on or you picked up new mates from other guilds that had experience at one or more fights. Obviously the Hardmodes were difficult enough to require someone to figure that shit out. I remember how much of a bitch Sindragosa originally felt back when I was running it: without someone to die lots and lots to figure out a working strat, shit wasn't getting done in any sort of timely manner.

Comparing raid fight strats in WoW to XI's "shit is situational" gear-swapping bullshit is like comparing mangos to bicycle parts. They are completely different.

**Gulkeeva** · 2013-07-31 19:43

Originally Posted by ejact

Well I guess that depends whether you were downing heroic bosses in ICC before or after the zone buff reached 10+% or did you progress through Ulduar heroics before or after TOGC was released. Not even going to delve into the guild shattering M'uru.

pfft, real raiders of sunwell did hardmode M'uru onry

Spoiler: show

**Lucavi** · 2013-07-31 21:05

I saw some screenshots of your gear, Gulk. Your Hunter was naaaaastyyy back in the day.

**Sylvrdragon** · 2013-08-01 06:19

If we assume that the battle team knows what they're doing, then we could probably just analyze the few screenshots they put up of endgame fights to figure out what they have in mind for group composition. Not saying that it will hold over for everything, but if their are enough screenshots of enough different encounters, then we could definitely start drawing some lines.

**6souls** · 2013-08-04 23:17

Originally Posted by Kiarax

GMG has 25% off both digital and digital CE using voucher:
http://www.greenmangaming.com/hot-deals/
Really good deal for new players, gives full preorder bonuses too.

20% right now through Friday, August 9th for NA & EU versions.

The 20% coupon GMG20-4B9NY-L4FEN will work for all region, reducing the price from $29.99, £19.99, and 24.99 € for the Standard Edition. For the Digital Deluxe Edition, it’ll be taking 20% off $49.99, £34.99, and 39.99 €.

Coupon expires August 9th, 11AM Eastern time.

http://www.siliconera.com/2013/08/03...ff-back-again/
http://www.dealzon.com/buy/final-fan...drc=siliconera
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**Enygma55** · 2013-08-05 00:46

Not bad for CE but no physical swag (unless I'm mistaken didnt read it anywhere)

Good for people who dont have anything.

**Gokulo** · 2013-08-05 09:47

GMG only sells digital versions, so no physical stuff obviously. (although I did see a post on the beta forums asking 'how long will I wait for my physical items if I order the digital version')

**Charismatic** · 2013-08-05 10:22

Off-topic but... I remember people speaking of a healer shortage (or bottleneck) pre-30 due to ACN seemingly not being a healer.
Well, the good news is that apparently there's a token system that would supposedly make people want to do lower level dungeon content (I'm assuming this means you can only get x amount of tokens from each dungeon per y period of time.)

If the information I read and my assumptions are correct, I think that this will only be an issue near the start of the game before more people get SCH unlocked because it looks like (due to the level of the summon abilities in the .dats) at the very least SCH would still be able to summon both fairies and still be able to cross-class cure from CNJ even when level synced for content.

tl;dr: I think the healer bottleneck that was brought up before will be an issue but not for more than like a week.

**solracht** · 2013-08-05 11:21

Originally Posted by Charismatic

Well, the good news is that apparently there's a token system that would supposedly make people want to do lower level dungeon content

[citation needed]

Thread: Beta 3 impressions and general discussion

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