1. FFXIV Reset Timers
    Last daily reset was 23 hours, 41 minutes ago / Next daily reset is in 0 hours, 18 minutes
    Last weekly reset was 1 days, 16 hours, 41 minutes ago / Next weekly reset is in 4 days, 17 hours, 18 minutes
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  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by miokomioko View Post
    FATEs, Hunting/Gathering/Crafting Logs, Class Quests, Job Quests, Instances, Guildleves, Guildhests, etc. + repeatable/dailies.

    I don't think it's time to worry yet about running out of exp sources.

    I still wish they implemented exp rewards for map exploration (perhaps they can still tie exp rewards to achievements).
    Questing is a huge part of the leveling experience in this game, and this is a beta. I think it's the perfect time to discuss this.

    It's also not about running out of exp sources, it's about the system only feeling fluid when you have quests available... which you eventually run out of. Systems like FATE and dungeons don't actually solve anything as they are available for your quested classes too. Nothing actually fills the void left by quests (and to an extent, the main story and guildhests).

    I invite you to do what I did last weekend:
    -Level any class to 15 via quests and doing all content available. Now try to level another class in that same region. Bonus points if it's the wrong class (ie, Lancer in Limsa).

  2. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seiji Okita View Post
    This makes me wonder what kind of spiritbond parties people are going to be forming come launch.

    Will people grind like 1.0?
    I'm curious about this as well. World kill exp is drastically reduced, so I doubt we'll be doing that. My guess is maybe some quick and easy 50 or near-50 dungeon runs.

  3. #23
    The Defense is ready, Your Honor
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    Quote Originally Posted by solracht View Post
    Questing is a huge part of the leveling experience in this game, and this is a beta. I think it's the perfect time to discuss this.

    It's also not about running out of exp sources, it's about the system only feeling fluid when you have quests available... which you eventually run out of. Systems like FATE and dungeons don't actually solve anything as they are available for your quested classes too. Nothing actually fills the void left by quests (and to an extent, the main story and guildhests).

    I invite you to do what I did last weekend:
    -Level any class to 15 via quests and doing all content available. Now try to level another class in that same region. Bonus points if it's the wrong class (ie, Lancer in Limsa).
    So what's your solution? This isn't WoW where you level one class and that's that. This isn't XI where XP is static because grinding is the only method of progression (or was for the sweeping majority of XI's existence).

    Whats your perfect middleground? Repeating the main quest-line would be silly, as would quest resetting for each job. The same NPC seeing you before with a robe on now sees you with some leather on and suddenly the quests come back? Wouldn't make sense.

  4. #24
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    Seems like Guildleves, FATEs, and XP Raids will be the main method to level 3rd, 4th, etc. job.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lucavi View Post
    So what's your solution? This isn't WoW where you level one class and that's that. This isn't XI where XP is static because grinding is the only method of progression (or was for the sweeping majority of XI's existence).

    Whats your perfect middleground? Repeating the main quest-line would be silly, as would quest resetting for each job. The same NPC seeing you before with a robe on now sees you with some leather on and suddenly the quests come back? Wouldn't make sense.
    It's their responsibility to offer a leveling system that works for their game. I'm simply bringing up my thoughts on why I don't think the current one does: quests are the glue that keeps everything together, and it eventually goes away.

    Either way and since you asked me, let's discuss some solutions.

    -The most obvious one is making quests reset for every class.

    Feel free to tell me why this is a bad idea, but don't tell me it "doesn't make sense", especially not you. You have spent over two years showing off your MMO phD on these forums and lately you sound like the people you have made fun of since 1.0 came out. Bahamut coming back a week after we kill him doesn't make sense either, but it's same thing. Gameplay taking precedence over what "makes sense". I know you're excited after last weekend, but calm yourself down a little, please.

    Regardless, I'd add a 10-20hour cooldown before you can do the same quest twice, in order to discourage leveling all the classes at the same time.

    I would not make the main story repeatable - I don't think it gives enough exp to miss it that much when it's gone.



    -Here's another solution:
    Spoiler: show



  6. #26
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    Going even further off-topic . . .

    What's the difference between quests resetting and Guildleves?

  7. #27
    The Once and Future Wamoura
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    Leve allowances are like 3 every 8 hours and don't reward as much XP as quests iirc and now in the theoretical quest reset world: each class gets the quests, your leves are shared amongst all your classes.

  8. #28
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    Guildleves can still be done by your quested classes, just like FATE, dungeons, etc.

    They also don't work well with the other content, since they happen in a small area of the map: while doing guildleves you won't run into many FATEs or log mobs.

    Lastly, you're limited by allowances.

    They could fill the questing void by using guildleves if they wanted, but it'd require a few adjustments.

  9. #29
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    You can grind to level 5, start doing leves with stocked allowances, do you hunting log at the same time, fates while doing that, and once you hit dungeon level do that for exp. That doesn't seem far-fetched to me at all. If we're questioning if that works in practice then someone will definitely have to actually try and do it because as far as I can presume it would work, just be more "work" around the map and you must do the fates as they pop up in your region even if with a penalty.

  10. #30
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    Leves should be ur main source of xp outside of normal quests and missions. We all did it in 1.0 and the option is still viable in 2.0. These are ur "repeatable" quests on a timer that resets

  11. #31
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    I know it was my fault too but we should probably move the discussion here: http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/116...cussion/page43

  12. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by solracht View Post
    It's their responsibility to offer a leveling system that works for their game. I'm simply bringing up my thoughts on why I don't think the current one does: quests are the glue that keeps everything together, and it eventually goes away.
    If there are enough leveling instances I don't see what the big deal is. It may even be that leveling in that fashion (FATE/instance spamming) is the most efficient way to level, people just choose to employ multiple types of progression on their first class(es) due to enjoying the process of leveling itself.

    SE can keep developing more and more quests so that players can level more and more classes/jobs on their character without having to deal with the lack of structure. The part of the playerbase that levels classes much faster than SE can keep up with probably likes to do it efficiently the 3rd/4th/Xth time around anyway. It's all about dat xp/hr. Instances and perhaps FATE should offer enough of a structure to stand on their own without quests. Just redo them over and over again until you can move on to the next tier.

  13. #33
    The Once and Future Wamoura
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    Quote Originally Posted by Enygma55 View Post
    Leves should be ur main source of xp outside of normal quests and missions. We all did it in 1.0 and the option is still viable in 2.0. These are ur "repeatable" quests on a timer that resets
    Yeah and we all remember how great 1.0 was

  14. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by solracht View Post
    Guildleves can still be done by your quested classes, just like FATE, dungeons, etc.

    They also don't work well with the other content, since they happen in a small area of the map: while doing guildleves you won't run into many FATEs or log mobs.

    Lastly, you're limited by allowances.

    They could fill the questing void by using guildleves if they wanted, but it'd require a few adjustments.
    Right, but you already stated that resetting quests would have a cooldown. In essence this is the same as guildleve allowance.

    I think they should use the guildleve system, but expand upon it so its not so . . . boring.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sigmakan View Post
    Right, but you already stated that resetting quests would have a cooldown. In essence this is the same as guildleve allowance.

    I think they should use the guildleve system, but expand upon it so its not so . . . boring.
    Don't dwell on the actual number I gave, the waiting period could be as short as one hour.

    All I meant is I don't think they would want people doing the following:
    -Do one quest
    -Switch class
    -Repeat quest
    -Repeat this for all your classes
    -Move onto the next quest

    The cooldown would be there only to avoid that.

  16. #36
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    FATE gives way way more exp than leves. That is the main source of exp after one-time quests and hunting logs. The leves are just filler material for in-between fates.

  17. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hyan View Post
    If there are enough leveling instances I don't see what the big deal is. It may even be that leveling in that fashion (FATE/instance spamming) is the most efficient way to level, people just choose to employ multiple types of progression on their first class(es) due to enjoying the process of leveling itself.

    SE can keep developing more and more quests so that players can level more and more classes/jobs on their character without having to deal with the lack of structure. The part of the playerbase that levels classes much faster than SE can keep up with probably likes to do it efficiently the 3rd/4th/Xth time around anyway. It's all about dat xp/hr. Instances and perhaps FATE should offer enough of a structure to stand on their own without quests. Just redo them over and over again until you can move on to the next tier.
    I suppose that's too much of a culture shock for purists who aren't used to it, but I've always been a fan of being able to essentially instance-hop all the way to cap. I loved it in Rift and it always resulted in having excellent quality gear throughout the entire leveling experience, so long as you ran enough time to get your drops.

  18. #38
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    I found FATE a decent way of leveling in the South Shroud in phase 2. The EXP rewards are quite decent and it's more fun than kill 6 rat quests. Haven't really gone the FATE route since then as I haven't had a need. My leveling choices are dungeon first, FATE second and quest third. More quests will be nice but more than likely I'll be ignoring them after 15ish. I'd rather be leveling in a dungeon and getting nice gear on the path. Some people prefer shitty quests, that's cool and SE should keep adding more for them.

  19. #39
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    FATEs are the best exp option imo since they also give a good amount of GC seals.

  20. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charismatic View Post
    FATEs are the best exp option imo since they also give a good amount of GC seals.
    Agreed, also dungeon exp took a nose dive in phase 3 and while that isn't necessarily a bad thing, they also simplified dungeons (namely Toto-rak and Deepcroft) to have less branching paths and "bonus" objectives so to speak. Toto-rak doesn't even have the extra scorpion miniboss anymore and Deepcroft doesn't have the golem guy. There are less treasure chests and the ones you do find have less chance of giving Aetherial Gear so essentially the only real gear you can expect is the one gauranteed green/teal item from boss chest. I understand they are gonna introduce a token system in retail but right now it feels boring grinding dungeons cause the only real advancement you get is XP. Atleast with Fates I get XP and Seals which I can use to buy company gear which is almost as good if not better than dungeon gear.

    Edit: My hope is that the new simplified dungeons are the "normal" mode and the older ones that were longer and had branching paths will be the new "hard" mode. Would fall in line with hard mode being "harder/longer" and offering better drops by virtue of more chests to collect.