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  1. #21
    CoP Dynamis
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    Quote Originally Posted by Raen Ryong View Post
    Do not macro a taunt to anything.

    If you are top target, you should never use a taunt. It is a very inefficient use of a GCD and deprives you of a taunt for the cooldown's duration.
    We're not macroing a taunt to an ability, we're macroing an ability to a taunt. Also, Provoke isn't on the GCD.

  2. #22
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    Opener: Mark (Macro) -> Spirits Within -> Circle of Scorn (Macro) -> Flash until about half Mana
    This will allow you to hit 4 moves within 1 GCD. Creating some solid starting emnity while also conveying to your party which mob to focus kill first
    I find that the Animation slows you down from activating the next GCD right away if you use 2 NON GCD in a row. Most GCD can't be used until half way through the GCD down time anyways.

  3. #23
    New Spam Forum
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    What materia has everyone been using on Paladin? Just stacking VIT for now seems sensible till more math is out on Parry and the like, but I was curious if people are stacking elemental resist for hard primals, specifically Titan.

  4. #24
    a p. sweet dude
    Pens win! Pens Win!!! PENS WIN!!!!!

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    Using earth potions had no noticeable effect for me on Titan, and those are like +60 resistance.

  5. #25
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    If you're using VIT accessories AFAIK you can't bind any more parry to them, so add STR and DET and stuff.

  6. #26
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    Darklight Macuahuitl - Unknown
    Drops in Wanderer's Palace vs Tonberry King. Just got it today.

  7. #27
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    I think all Darklight weapons drop in Wanderer's?

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelshader View Post
    Bloodbath – Converts 25% of physical damage done into HP for 15 seconds. 90 second cool down. I macro this into my Fast Blade.
    Because of my limited crossbar slots with a controller, a macro I'm fond of is combining Fight or Flight and Bloodbath activations. The damage boost dovetails nicely with the damage conversion, and they even both have the same cooldown length.

    I've also done the same with Foresight and Awareness. Foresight does nothing for magic, and Awareness's usefulness is entirely down to the rng, you'll never know if it was truly useful, you can only assume. I've found combining them gets you something that approaches the usefulness of Rampart. And, they share the same timers, so it's a very user friendly macro.

  9. #29
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    I posted this on the Valk Dancing Mad Enmity hate post, but really I need some help with this...basically having issues with healers healing too much and tanks not being able to generate enough threat quickly enough (During Garuda's initial add phase) to make smooth transitions. Either healers are doing too much healing, or damage dealers are not waiting for tanks to threat gen. Either way, it's seeming like an impossibility. If you have a working solution to this issue that would help me I appreciate it.

    If I’m reading this correctly, (If not, I apologize)

    I’ve noticed in particular situations (IE: Demon Wall boss bee adds in Ampador Keep, or Garuda Hard Mode adds) where I am Paladin tanking, I am taking a lot of damage during multi-mob situations, and attempting to pick up adds is seemingly impossible. This data helps me and sheds more light , but maybe you can explain? I am pretty good at generating threat in low-priority situations where I have 30 seconds to generate decent threat, but any time heavy heals are given / taken I’m unable to regain or recover threat for a long long time.

    With the formula you posted, it seems that potentially a White Mage healer can generate a lot of threat if healing a tank who’s getting more than 2k+ damage and healed for that amount on impact. There’s almost no way for a tank to catch up flatline threat tanking if being healed constantly without the help of Provoke, even then…a healer has to cool it for a while, correct?

  10. #30

    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Spy View Post
    I posted this on the Valk Dancing Mad Enmity hate post, but really I need some help with this...basically having issues with healers healing too much and tanks not being able to generate enough threat quickly enough (During Garuda's initial add phase) to make smooth transitions. Either healers are doing too much healing, or damage dealers are not waiting for tanks to threat gen. Either way, it's seeming like an impossibility. If you have a working solution to this issue that would help me I appreciate it.
    So threat in this game is very very traditional. Some people are coming from wow or rift where threat is not a real mechanic whereas in this game its very real and something you need to generate. That's why there is a built in threat meter. If your damage dealers, healer, or yourself take too much damage your healer will generate more threat than usual. The biggest threat builder in this game is Medica II. Healing is 1 emnity point per .5 point of health healed. so to counter a Medica II that heals for say 5000HP you must do 2500.5 white damage while under shield oath for the mob to stay on you. In regards to damage dealers taking aggro that is them not doing their job. A black mage can easily out threat you if they wanted. Again if they wanted, doesn't mean they should. As a damage dealer they should do as much damage as possible while not taking damage and not taking aggro. The tank's role is to mitigate as much damage while lifting the threat ceiling for damage dealers to do their job. That's why when you see Paladins putting up fracture or sheld swiping they are not doing their job to their best of their abilities. You want a threat rotation not a damage dealing rotation. My advice is get a ton of armor, get a kite shield, get the highest dps weapon you can find and halone combo as much as possible while keeping spirits, scorn, and mercy on cool down. That is your highest threat rotation.

  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelshader View Post
    So threat in this game is very very traditional. Some people are coming from wow or rift where threat is not a real mechanic whereas in this game its very real and something you need to generate. That's why there is a built in threat meter. If your damage dealers, healer, or yourself take too much damage your healer will generate more threat than usual. The biggest threat builder in this game is Medica II. Healing is 1 emnity point per .5 point of health healed. so to counter a Medica II that heals for say 5000HP you must do 2500.5 white damage while under shield oath for the mob to stay on you. In regards to damage dealers taking aggro that is them not doing their job. A black mage can easily out threat you if they wanted. Again if they wanted, doesn't mean they should. As a damage dealer they should do as much damage as possible while not taking damage and not taking aggro. The tank's role is to mitigate as much damage while lifting the threat ceiling for damage dealers to do their job. That's why when you see Paladins putting up fracture or sheld swiping they are not doing their job to their best of their abilities. You want a threat rotation not a damage dealing rotation. My advice is get a ton of armor, get a kite shield, get the highest dps weapon you can find and halone combo as much as possible while keeping spirits, scorn, and mercy on cool down. That is your highest threat rotation.
    Thank you for replying. I have done all of this, but you have answered my question. A lot of WoW was mindless for tanking, and people only had to wait maybe 1-2 seconds tops before going all out. I played FFXI heavily before WoW so I was familiar with being formal and courteous to players, but that is not the case we have due to the evolution of MMO's. I'm still waiting on a few of our players to hit 50 before I stop pugging.

    I attempted to do my rotation several times on Garuda and due to the mechanics with GCD and cooldowns I could not maintain threat and eventually lost on the adds that just spawned. Our Offtank only picked one up, and just allowed the other to kill the group (I was attempting to pull with taunt and position, but GCD and threat did not mix well here..and he just let it go).

    I came to the conclusion as well that people just need to relax and chill on damage/heavy heals til tanks actually build threat, but a lot of them are like "WOW WHAT A BAD TANK, GG ITS A WIPE" attitude, without knowing the mechanics. I know it's still new in terms of a game to most people, but really was hoping for a more open-minded community. Not the case.

    I want to post my current gearset, but unable to link you, but if you look up on the official site, below is my set. There's sections I'm working on such as accessories, as I just hit 50 a few days ago so definitely trying to fill in the gap.

    lodestone/character/2751452/

  12. #32

    Quote Originally Posted by Gray Spy View Post
    Thank you for replying. I have done all of this, but you have answered my question. A lot of WoW was mindless for tanking, and people only had to wait maybe 1-2 seconds tops before going all out. I played FFXI heavily before WoW so I was familiar with being formal and courteous to players, but that is not the case we have due to the evolution of MMO's. I'm still waiting on a few of our players to hit 50 before I stop pugging.

    I attempted to do my rotation several times on Garuda and due to the mechanics with GCD and cooldowns I could not maintain threat and eventually lost on the adds that just spawned. Our Offtank only picked one up, and just allowed the other to kill the group (I was attempting to pull with taunt and position, but GCD and threat did not mix well here..and he just let it go).

    I came to the conclusion as well that people just need to relax and chill on damage/heavy heals til tanks actually build threat, but a lot of them are like "WOW WHAT A BAD TANK, GG ITS A WIPE" attitude, without knowing the mechanics. I know it's still new in terms of a game to most people, but really was hoping for a more open-minded community. Not the case.

    I want to post my current gearset, but unable to link you, but if you look up on the official site, below is my set. There's sections I'm working on such as accessories, as I just hit 50 a few days ago so definitely trying to fill in the gap.

    lodestone/character/2751452/
    Unfortunately you did not logout in your tanking gear so I can not critique, but this guide lays out where to grab some low hanging fruit in regards to upgrades. Get "puggable gear capped" which is full darklight gear and an ifrit sword then get in a guild that understands the mechanic of this game not the mechanics of wow. I don't have the best weapon--just an ifrit sword working on my curtana, but i don't lose aggro due to black mages knowing when to lay off on aggro and most people don't stand around getting hit by random aoe. Remember if your provoke is down and you are trying to get something on you immediately, lob shield as you approach the mob and depending on how far behind on threat you are start with a Halone or go straight into a Halone combo. If you have spirits or scorn that is some more snap aggro you could burn on a run away mob.

  13. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelshader View Post
    Unfortunately you did not logout in your tanking gear so I can not critique, but this guide lays out where to grab some low hanging fruit in regards to upgrades. Get "puggable gear capped" which is full darklight gear and an ifrit sword then get in a guild that understands the mechanic of this game not the mechanics of wow. I don't have the best weapon--just an ifrit sword working on my curtana, but i don't lose aggro due to black mages knowing when to lay off on aggro and most people don't stand around getting hit by random aoe. Remember if your provoke is down and you are trying to get something on you immediately, lob shield as you approach the mob and depending on how far behind on threat you are start with a Halone or go straight into a Halone combo. If you have spirits or scorn that is some more snap aggro you could burn on a run away mob.
    Yep...have done all that and sorry. I guess it disappeared, was starting on Mining when I logged out haha. To describe the scenario when I attempted... the adds were creeping towards the ranged group...I provoked...Shield Lob w/ stacked with Fight or Flight...still lost aggro. I estimate it will take me another week or two to get the gear. Another thing we also attempted the other night was Demon Wall... we were fresh 50's essentially beating our heads on the wall, and not realizing how much gear mattered on that fight.

  14. #34

    I was experimenting with Paladin macros today, and a couple of things might be worth mentioning for this thread.

    I mostly fiddled with the /wait command. My intention was to do the thing most people try at first - macro Halone to Savage using a 2.5 second wait. However, the /wait command rounds up/down to the nearest whole number, so a /wait command of 2.5 is actually a 3 second wait, so slower than pressing it yourself. However, what I DID find out is the usefulness of "wait 1". Try swapping your Fast Blade macro to this:

    /macroicon "Fast Blade"
    /ac "Fight or Flight" <me>
    /ac "Fast Blade" <t>
    /wait 1
    /ac "Bloodbath" <me>

    Why is this different to the one posted? With this macro, you spam it until the Fast Blade pops and then the Bloodbath weaves itself in between the Fast and your Savage press perfectly without delaying anything. If you have bloodbath -before- the Fast Blade then you delay your Fast Blade happening by half a second or so when you pop Fight+Blood together. It also means you can press the button -once- when running at a pack of mobs and it will pop both buffs with one keypress before you get there.

    The /wait 1 command is really handy to macro ANY off-GCD cooldown onto the back of a GCD one. You could, for example, do this:

    /macroicon "Rage of Halone"
    /ac "Rage of Halone" <t>
    /wait 1
    /ac "Spirits Within" <t>

    This makes your Rage a serious burst button and ensures you keep Spirits within off CD throughout a fight. You can of course throw Spirits onto the back of ANY of your moves if you arent bothered about saving it for the silence (just have a non-spirits equivalent to swap in when doing Chimera or so).

    It's a small thing, but it can save the odd half-second here and there. Going Fight -> Bloodbath -> Spirits -> Fast is very inefficient when you should slot a non-GCD between each GCD, and the /wait 1 lets you do that in macros for those off-GCDs where you just want them used ASAP.

  15. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sapphidia View Post
    I was experimenting with Paladin macros today, and a couple of things might be worth mentioning for this thread.

    I mostly fiddled with the /wait command. My intention was to do the thing most people try at first - macro Halone to Savage using a 2.5 second wait. However, the /wait command rounds up/down to the nearest whole number, so a /wait command of 2.5 is actually a 3 second wait, so slower than pressing it yourself. However, what I DID find out is the usefulness of "wait 1". Try swapping your Fast Blade macro to this:

    /macroicon "Fast Blade"
    /ac "Fight or Flight" <me>
    /ac "Fast Blade" <t>
    /wait 1
    /ac "Bloodbath" <me>

    Why is this different to the one posted? With this macro, you spam it until the Fast Blade pops and then the Bloodbath weaves itself in between the Fast and your Savage press perfectly without delaying anything. If you have bloodbath -before- the Fast Blade then you delay your Fast Blade happening by half a second or so when you pop Fight+Blood together. It also means you can press the button -once- when running at a pack of mobs and it will pop both buffs with one keypress before you get there.

    The /wait 1 command is really handy to macro ANY off-GCD cooldown onto the back of a GCD one. You could, for example, do this:

    /macroicon "Rage of Halone"
    /ac "Rage of Halone" <t>
    /wait 1
    /ac "Spirits Within" <t>

    This makes your Rage a serious burst button and ensures you keep Spirits within off CD throughout a fight. You can of course throw Spirits onto the back of ANY of your moves if you arent bothered about saving it for the silence (just have a non-spirits equivalent to swap in when doing Chimera or so).

    It's a small thing, but it can save the odd half-second here and there. Going Fight -> Bloodbath -> Spirits -> Fast is very inefficient when you should slot a non-GCD between each GCD, and the /wait 1 lets you do that in macros for those off-GCDs where you just want them used ASAP.
    If you spam it, wouldn't that just delay the wait?

  16. #36

    Quote Originally Posted by Eurlin View Post
    If you spam it, wouldn't that just delay the wait?
    Sort of, but the idea is that you stop spamming the button once you see the attack go off anyway, and even if you spam it a few times after the Fast Blade hits, the 1 second wait is still flexible enough. Spamming Fast Blade with a 1 sec wait to Bloodbath smoothly transitions into being able to hit Savage Blade without any delay and the Bloodbath happens in between them.

    It looks something like this:

    0.0s Spam Fast Blade macro. Fast blade goes off.
    0.5s Few extra presses of fast blade. Realise it's hit, Savage blade lights up. Stop spamming.
    1.5s Bloodbath goes off. Locks up skills for about half a second.
    2.5s Savage Blade ready to be activated.

    That 0.5-1.5 seconds is pretty flexible it seems. It delays the savage slightly if you massively spam it long past the activation of the Fast Blade but still saves time over activating it before.

  17. #37

    If I'm not doing anything I'm spamming my fast blade macro like 4 times a second even though I know the gcd is 2.5 sec. It's a weird idle habit. Basically if nothing is lit up I'm spamming it. its bound to a thumb button on my mouse so I can still move throughout the fight.

  18. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by pixelshader View Post
    So threat in this game is very very traditional. Some people are coming from wow or rift where threat is not a real mechanic whereas in this game its very real and something you need to generate. That's why there is a built in threat meter. If your damage dealers, healer, or yourself take too much damage your healer will generate more threat than usual. The biggest threat builder in this game is Medica II. Healing is 1 emnity point per .5 point of health healed. so to counter a Medica II that heals for say 5000HP you must do 2500.5 white damage while under shield oath for the mob to stay on you. In regards to damage dealers taking aggro that is them not doing their job. A black mage can easily out threat you if they wanted. Again if they wanted, doesn't mean they should. As a damage dealer they should do as much damage as possible while not taking damage and not taking aggro. The tank's role is to mitigate as much damage while lifting the threat ceiling for damage dealers to do their job. That's why when you see Paladins putting up fracture or sheld swiping they are not doing their job to their best of their abilities. You want a threat rotation not a damage dealing rotation. My advice is get a ton of armor, get a kite shield, get the highest dps weapon you can find and halone combo as much as possible while keeping spirits, scorn, and mercy on cool down. That is your highest threat rotation.
    In your example you'd need to deal 1,251 damage to pull hate off of the initial heal and not 2,500. Shield Oath/Defiance doubles the threat of anything done while under it.

    The biggest problem isn't really the initial heal of Medica II but the HoT left afterwards and the fact that all overhealing still counts as threat. It's almost never really a damage class that pulls off (unless it's within the first few seconds or you're using an old weapon) but the healer, and Butcher's Block/Rage of Halone can only be used every 7.5 seconds if perfectly timed.

  19. #39

    Yea, I've only seen DPS pull hate once and that's on a very specific boss with very specific mechanics that allow for it.

    As far as Garuda, a Warrior would be a better tank for the 2 sisters because they generate more threat and do it faster. Flash is going to be your best friend until the DPS kill the first sister at which point you should be able to do a normal combo.

    However, your mages should refrain from any Medica II prior to obtaining both sisters where you want them and anything else means you aren't utilizing CD's or the other tank is not or people are being hit by things.

  20. #40

    Something I'm really struggling to locate (I'm sure I saw it somewhere online) is a table showing the Parry and Block breakpoints for the paladin from DEX. Obviously Dex is a very low priority, but from what I understand Dex provides 1% block and 1% parry for every (x amount) of Dex, at certain breakpoints. It was something like 90 Dex for 1% that makes it rather pointless to consider on gear.

    However I vaguely recall that there was a Dexterity breakpoint around the 193/194 Dex mark. So (pure example pulled out of the air) you'd have 15% Parry and 15% Block at 192 dex, and 16% Parry and 16% block at 193, rather than a smooth decimal transition.

    A Paladin in tanking gear at 50 will have basically -zero- bonus Dex on any of their optimal gear unless they're wearing a generic DoW jewellery part. Seeing as my Hyur Midlander Paladin has 190 base Dexterity naked... it feels like a naked Paladin is potentially very close to a Parry breakpoint.

    The guide doesnt specifically mention Stat Allocation, though obviously it strongly implies 30 in VIT as Vit is the most important stat. But if someone can find the parry/block breakpoint table... it might be that adding 2-4 points into Dex depending on Racial Starting Stats to hit a Dex breakpoint will give 1% parry and 1% block.... making a Stat Distribution of something like 3 Dex 27 Vit a much better option than 30 pure Vit.

    I wish I could more help and provide the stats table but my googling power has forsaken me at present.

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