[Guide] Paladin Tanking Compendium (Last update 11/13/13)

[hashmal]

i'm a newer paladin tank(level 38) but have tanked endgame in a few different mmos.

i have a question about the flash diminishing returns. it seems that no matter how long i wait between flash casts it will never be a full 12 seconds of blind unless its the first cast or its been completely resisted.

it seems to go something like 12 > 6 > 3 > 1 > full resist(sometimes twice) and then back to 12.

is there actually a reset timer for flash that i can wait long enough after the first cast to get a full 12 seconds of blind? is it even worth to do so? or is it always effected by diminishing returns so its just better to cast it whenever your enemies aren't effected by blind

SE call this "CC cooldown", they explained it in 1.21 patch notes and the mechanism hasn't changed since then (although some timers may have been adjusted).

The first time you apply a CC effect, you get the full duration and a timer starts. When the timer ends, you can apply the CC effect again with full duration (and the timer starts again).

If you (or any other player) tries to apply the effect again when the timer is running, you only get half duration.
If you apply it once more, you get a quarter of the initial duration.
If you try again, the effect won't be applied at all (fully resisted).

Thus, for Flash you have 12, 6, 3, then full resist.
For shield bash/stun you have 6, 3, 1.5

Flash cooldown: 180s
Stun cooldown: 30s
Pacification cooldown: 300s

(I cannot guarantee the accuracy of these, but you get the idea)
Other CC effects have their own cooldown but I didn't memorize them since I play PLD only.

Once you get this, you can predict exactly when your stun won't work, for example during Ifrit (if you interrupt a plume by mistake or if another player uses stun).

[BerenTebogo]

Valor Head + HQ Militia body melded with crit and acc is the superior choice over darklight.

Also looks badass.

edit: I'm actually curious what numbers other people are running for ACC / CRIT / DEF for coil.

ACC (no food): 495
Crit (no food): 450(+\- 3)
DEF w/ protect : 840

[Eanae]

Well from doing some research, apparently Allagan helm drops from turn 5 (it's one of 10 drops still not found with 1 drop missing from turn 2 and 1 from turn 4 with 8 unknown drops from turn 5) which would certainly make spending the myth on Valor head very worth it. I may have to get it next week and have a Militia made. Currently using Militia legs with valor feet already.


All no food and from lodestone:
Accuracy 483
Critical Hit Rate 371
Determination 216
Def (no Prot) 730

[Raineer]

Testing today showed that both the baseline enmity and enmity boosting stances have fallen more in line (but still has some issues), I suspect a ninja fix on SE's side.

More information to come soon.

I'll be curious about this.

Finally hit 40 on pld, been playing around with the stances. Have done the Svara's run fate about 15 times now, and it's always the same 3 tanks all fighting for the dragon.

If I am in Shield Oath - I slowly fall behind and simply can't outtank the other two (both WARs)
If I am in Sword Oath - I can start in the hole on hate and climb my way up to where they can't catch me

I repeated this pattern on all the FATEs, even as much as bouncing between them on each kill. I know this is not at all a controlled environment, but I am really starting to wonder about the Enmity boost from Shield Oath. It's on the tooltip, so I assume it's there - but that doesn't mean it outdoes the -20% dmg dealt.

[Sapphidia]

I am really starting to wonder about the Enmity boost from Shield Oath. It's on the tooltip, so I assume it's there - but that doesn't mean it outdoes the -20% dmg dealt.

I am too, but enough people more qualified than I have tested and confirmed that Shield Oath is definitely 100% bonus threat... but I wonder about Sword Oath.

I tried tanking AK with Sword Oath to see the difference. It felt like my Flashes were much lower threat, but my single target was higher. I don't doubt that Shield Oath is 100% bonus threat which does make it higher threat than no Oath at all, and noticeably higher AOE threat than Sword Oath.

However, time and time again I've seen Sword Oath paladins just push far ahead in single target threat. My gut feeling with zero testing so just a stab in the dark, is that the 50 potency auto attack procs that sword oath gives somehow have some kind of bonus enmity on them, as I think all tests showed no major boost in threat to any specific ability from Sword Oath. The threat difference entirely comes from the AA procs... and a mere 50 potency with no enmity adjustment just feels too low for the kind of threat output I'm seeing people generate!

On paper, Shield Oath is 160% threat compared to no Oath at all (-20%, doubled). Sword Oath should be 100% threat on all moves with +50 potency enmity every 2 seconds roughly. Given that a 3 gcd halone combo generates 150+600+1300 threat over 7.5 seconds, it just feels like there's something more going on that just 50 potency - that 50 potency attack would have to generate nearly 60% as much threat as a full Halone Combo over 7.5 seconds to give the kind of effect we seem to be seeing.

[Carth]

Shield Oath's threat increase isn't that strong. One tester from Excalibur has suggested that Shield Oath gives a 20% enmity increase in comparison to a normal stance, but hasn't shown any data to back that theory.

As for Sword Oath generating enmity, I find myself in agreement with Sapp after I did some napkin math. Sword Oath adds 50 potency to autoattacks, which basically puts it on the level of Fast Blade, and our AA speed is the fastest in the game. So assuming a 2.32s sword, we're overall giving ~150 potency auto-attacks within 2.32 seconds. Shield Oath gets a Damage penalty which also affects autoattacks.

Shield Oath: 100 x 0.8 (80) Potency
Sword Oath: 100+50 (150) Potency

Sword Oath would generate 150 potency per autoattack every 2.32 seconds. The Halone Combo generates 2050 per combo. Curtana(+1) can give 3-4 autoattacks before a Halone Combo (assuming there's no delay within the combo performance), which means Sword Oath gives 450-600 enmity generation from AA, per Halone Combo. If we assume Shield Oath is a 20% enmity increase (which simply cancels the damage penalty), then it makes sense as to how Sword Oath creeps up and overtakes Shield Oath. Sword Oath would generate 2500-2650 Enmity overall. Shield Oath would have to be giving at least a 12% Enmity Boost to overtake Sword Oath's DPS.

But then I look back earlier in my post when I stated I overtook a Relic+1 Paladin with 10 more Strength than me when I had Garuda's Gaze at the time, and I go back to scratching my head. This was during the time when enmity was borked though, so I don't know. I think the best thing to do is try to overtake Main tanks without a stance at all and see if you can. If it's possible, then the problem is Shield Oath is broken, not Sword Oath.

[Nadrojj]

Just got my relic last night, and +1'd the shield as I was told by a few PLD's on my server it was one of the best upgrades you can get. Now I am wondering what to focus on next. My gear isn't amazing, I have the absolute worst luck on AK accessory drops...

I have 0 tomes of philo and i think 120 myth right now

Darklight Head/body
Darklight Gloves
Hoplite belt
Hoplite legs
Af2 feet

Relic sword
Relic +1 Shield
hoplite earrings
hq amber rings

I was thinking use my myth for af2 legs next since I'm still rocking hoplite. I'd really like to get out of the tin man suit asap. Were going to be starting coils tomorrow, not sure if there is a drop from round 1 that I should be on the lookout for.

Was thinking of maybe seeing if I could pick up a hq militia body and then use my myth on af2 legs and af2 head.

[Eanae]

If you get af2 legs that pretty much locks you into af2 body since you ideally don't want acc on both your body and legs. You'll over kill your acc since most every other piece of both Allagan and af2 has acc on them.

[Nadrojj]

Ok so pretty much I should be going into legs then body. Thanks for the heads up.

[BerenTebogo]

I personally think head is a better choice depending on what body you're using but FINALLY, shit is situational.

[Nadrojj]

I'm running the DL tin man head/body combo. I'd like to get the best bang for my buck when using my myth, if I get head then I will have to look into getting hq militia body I believe.

[Eanae]

I was strongly considering head but you lose 1 of every stat and a huge chunk of parry if you have to use Militia body. I may just do it because fuck heavy darklight and Allagan is bound to drop eventually.

[BerenTebogo]

I use hq militia with crit and det melded all over it.

Edit: Has the added benefit of looking too fantastic.

[TheGlow]

Im just rounding 48 on my Paladin.
Is there a breakdown of which gear in which order is best bang for buck?
How big of a deal is it to join one of those groups thats walks you through Garuda/Titan HM?
Also Titan was before Garuda in main mode, but it looks like Garuda is before Titan for HM?

[Eanae]

I use hq militia with crit and det melded all over it.

Edit: Has the added benefit of looking too fantastic.

Gain:
7 Crit
14 Acc
4 Det

Lose:
1 Str
1 Vit
3 Def
20 Parry

So basically 20 parry vs 7 crit and 14 acc (which I don't need until I can get Allagan legs to drop which seem common for all FC groups except mine).

[Kiarax]

If it makes you feel any better we've gotten literally 0 tank drops. Fuckin' DRG has like 7 pieces and we've got nothing, not even an accessory.

[Grey Jorildyn]

Haha the other night we got 3 mnk items (head, hands, feet) getting to turn 5. Fucking stoooopid. Also they went to the only person in pt who has mnk on lot priority but he's one of our Bards lol

[Pilfer]

Looking for some advice on how to spend my mythology. I can buy shield +1 this week or save for valor head on Monday. Not banking on any allagan gear since my group gets 0 tank drops

[Kirbyprime]

Question for Titan, does rock bombs say "Burst Deals xxxx damage to you" or just "You take xxxx damage"?

I was tanking Titan on phase 5 and took a 1800 hit, it was roughly the same time as rock buster so wasn't sure if I was just too close to the boulder or was it just another hit that caused it. Couldn't tell since all of the bombs say "Rock bomb uses Burst" regardless.

[Seravi Edalborez]

I don't pay attention to battle log, I just see damage pop up:
Burst! 2904
or whatever. If the damage didn't have any skill name it was probably an autoattack I guess? Haven't tanked this so I don't know if that's abnormal.