The Official Forum fail thread: This game wasn't meant for alts.

[Corrderio]

because

With logic like that why even call the game a MMO?

[Dathus]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...dtank_melding/



It pretty much goes as you would expect.

I don't know how that thread hasn't been reported off the face of Reddit. That is trollworthy if I've ever seen it.

[Destinye]

Probably because so many believe in the "it's my $xx" and it has nothing to do with someone with logic posting, so of course it won't get reported.

Now if you bring up actual game issues or suggest anything that isn't "casual friendly" in the extent of "you have to actually try in this content", then you get reported.

[Silenka]

With logic like that why even call the game a MMO?

That's what I've been arguing for ages now. The entitlement and loss of patience of gamers playing MMOs now have led MMOs to be developed in a way that causes the least amount of "inconvenience" to players, which requires the removal of basically all reliance on others to progress in the game. If "inconvenience" is, as Yoshi said, embodied by the act of gathering players to complete a task, then we've already lost the very essence of what an MMO is supposed to be. Yet everyone here keeps saying "no no it's cool that's just how games ARE nowadays and there's nothing you can do about it." But what they're really saying is "hmm, maybe I WAS inconvenienced by that stuff. I sure wouldn't want to do it now" - they are the impatient entitled modern gamers and just don't realize it/want to admit it.

That's why I really hate the "rose-colored glasses" argument when it comes to XI. I know what I'm about when I say I enjoyed the fuck out of most aspects of that game, it's not just nostalgia. It's all the stuff we've lost that got pared out of XIV for being "too inconvenient" or superfluous in the minds of the XIV devs. And now they are so hell-bent on not repeating or borrowing anything from XI (aside from all the mob designs hurr) that they shoot themselves in the foot with these "we're not XI" excuses and fleeing from ideas for content that could turn out to be good for XIV.

MMORPGs are supposed to be as much about the journey as the destination. If we go back to the foundation of MMORPGS - D&D and other games like it - it's all about interacting with friends and figuring out how to reach the destination while having fun and hijinks along the way (and occassionally inconvenience and hardship, but it builds character dammit). With XIV, though, we've got mostly destination for those instant gratification feels and very little journey in comparison. We have a kind of whatever MSQ that's over within a day of play each installment, where no one dies permanently except throwaway characters and there don't seem to be any consequences for the Warrior of Light no matter how bad things get. And we have no travel time and no overworld content to speak of so there really is no "journey" in this MMO. It's just jumping from destination to destination clearing increasingly meaningless and repetitive objectives.

[Twilight Sky]

Why link threads when it is much easier to simply say the FFXIV community is one huge cluster fuckbag of failing.

[Alistaire]

Why link threads when it is much easier to simply say the FFXIV community is one huge cluster fuckbag of failing.

Because it's always funny to see what particular brand of retardation people have come up with today?

[Worm]

Why link threads when it is much easier to simply say the FFXIV community is one huge cluster fuckbag of failing.

To talk about something? It's a forum after all.

[FHT]

To this day I still can't believe they haven't tried to make any open world content for guilds. Guild-locked FATEs would be a pretty nice idea.

To this day I still can't understand why they did not fully use the opportunities they had with HW, aka they could have made a FFXI Besieged-like system where the dragons attack Ishgard and you have to help defending it for Ishgarian currencies allowing you to buy various items, such as GCs. Thats one tiny example.

This game has alot of potential but SE seems to be ignoring it just because "this isnt FFXI" but the playerbase would not follow this train of thoughts either, they prefer to run 2 dungeons every 3 months for gears which will be outdated as soon as they have a full set, rather than spend a bit longer of time to get something substantial.

We just need to look, people are just not enjoying the game in the full sense of the word, if they can be in and out as soon as possible they will, whereas we FFXI players just loved to spend time together and work together, even if it was in a 3h long Dynamis - Xarc for a red hat.

Stormblood is around the corner, watch them bring the same model used up to today (2 dungeons/450 tomes per week)

[Vaspinne]

Stormblood is around the corner, watch them bring the same model used up to today (2 dungeons/450 tomes per week)

The sad thing is that all indicators so far are pointing to this being the case.

[Silenka]

Just once I wish they would try an experiment and uncap tomes. Let us gear as fast or slow as we wish without the cap, and see how player retention differs.
The thinking for capping tomes seems to be to keep players playing for however many number of weeks it takes them to finish gearing their primary job (it takes a couple of months at the current rate, if I remember correctly). However, it should be content and rewards that keep players playing, not a gear cap. Tome caps are just an excuse used to cover up the lack of rewarding content.

This is a game where everyone can play every job on one character if they so wish. I believe that most people (if I had to make an educated guess, around 70% of the playerbase) plays more than just one job. Gearing every job without a tome cap would still take several weeks at a normal/casual play speed. A hardcore player could probably gear all jobs in a week or less. But would people really quit after gearing? Does the point of playing the game consist of gearing with tomestone gear and that's all? Once you've got your gear, do you go away and not use it for anything? If so, then there are some serious flaws with the gaming mindset.

I think that even with a lack of tomestone cap, the core playerbase (who never let their sub lapse and buy pointless shit on Mog Station because it's shiny) would be helped by this rather than hindered, and would still be paying SE the same amount of money. Or possibly even more, to glam their good gear on every job. Meanwhile, I would hope that the rest of the players would have more fun playing many different jobs over the course of the patch content, instead of being stuck on just the one job they were spending tomes on. Everyone should be happier if the tomestone cap was abolished. Or maybe I'm missing something...?

[carlweathers]

Just once I wish they would try an experiment and uncap tomes. Let us gear as fast or slow as we wish without the cap, and see how player retention differs.
The thinking for capping tomes seems to be to keep players playing for however many number of weeks it takes them to finish gearing their primary job (it takes a couple of months at the current rate, if I remember correctly). However, it should be content and rewards that keep players playing, not a gear cap. Tome caps are just an excuse used to cover up the lack of rewarding content.

This is a game where everyone can play every job on one character if they so wish. I believe that most people (if I had to make an educated guess, around 70% of the playerbase) plays more than just one job. Gearing every job without a tome cap would still take several weeks at a normal/casual play speed. A hardcore player could probably gear all jobs in a week or less. But would people really quit after gearing? Does the point of playing the game consist of gearing with tomestone gear and that's all? Once you've got your gear, do you go away and not use it for anything? If so, then there are some serious flaws with the gaming mindset.

I think that even with a lack of tomestone cap, the core playerbase (who never let their sub lapse and buy pointless shit on Mog Station because it's shiny) would be helped by this rather than hindered, and would still be paying SE the same amount of money. Or possibly even more, to glam their good gear on every job. Meanwhile, I would hope that the rest of the players would have more fun playing many different jobs over the course of the patch content, instead of being stuck on just the one job they were spending tomes on. Everyone should be happier if the tomestone cap was abolished. Or maybe I'm missing something...?

In your hypothetical, are you describing a situation where Day 1, brand new tomes are uncapped? Or eventually? I think there are some drawbacks. Having the cap makes them limit how much you can get per week,which may prevent burnout. You can make the argument that it's something completely voluntary so people can go as hard or as soft as they want to, but its an MMO, and you know kids will cry because a lack of a cap means they're just so overwhelmed/burnt out/ stressed out that they "HAVE" to gear up. Then I can imagine that would affect casuals/new players, in that people might expect/demand higher higher item levels to get into their groups, so that might cause complaints/daunting. Less time to dick around in RP areas and more time feeling compelled to grind for more tomes. Oh. and it'd be more reason for people to complain about lack of inventory space if they can aquire so much gear.

Not saying I believe all that, but being a devil's advocate.

[FHT]

Just once I wish they would try an experiment and uncap tomes. Let us gear as fast or slow as we wish without the cap, and see how player retention differs.
The thinking for capping tomes seems to be to keep players playing for however many number of weeks it takes them to finish gearing their primary job (it takes a couple of months at the current rate, if I remember correctly). However, it should be content and rewards that keep players playing, not a gear cap. Tome caps are just an excuse used to cover up the lack of rewarding content.

This is a game where everyone can play every job on one character if they so wish. I believe that most people (if I had to make an educated guess, around 70% of the playerbase) plays more than just one job. Gearing every job without a tome cap would still take several weeks at a normal/casual play speed. A hardcore player could probably gear all jobs in a week or less. But would people really quit after gearing? Does the point of playing the game consist of gearing with tomestone gear and that's all? Once you've got your gear, do you go away and not use it for anything? If so, then there are some serious flaws with the gaming mindset.

I think that even with a lack of tomestone cap, the core playerbase (who never let their sub lapse and buy pointless shit on Mog Station because it's shiny) would be helped by this rather than hindered, and would still be paying SE the same amount of money. Or possibly even more, to glam their good gear on every job. Meanwhile, I would hope that the rest of the players would have more fun playing many different jobs over the course of the patch content, instead of being stuck on just the one job they were spending tomes on. Everyone should be happier if the tomestone cap was abolished. Or maybe I'm missing something...?

Actually I remember an OF thread which was heavily trolled by our finests as the poster provided an excellent idea, they were proposing an evolutive cap increasing overtime accounting for the previous week(s). The idea was that if the 1st week you only collected 320/450 the next you would be at 320/900.

[octopus]

In 3.0 release you could only get law tomes, and it was unlocked.

[Edelweiss]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/comme...sted_here_yet/

That response about gear being "complicated."

Actually, just everything about Stormblood.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Spoiler: show

It's either this or Yakety Sax to set the mood for these Yoshida responses/whiteknight entrenchings, man.

[Silenka]

In 3.0 release you could only get law tomes, and it was unlocked.

I remember that. It was pretty nice. I managed to get a set of gear for all of my jobs. But everyone knew it was gear that was going to be replaced very soon and not the "main line" gear of the expansion. Iirc the AF stuff came out like a couple weeks afterward.

I know, there are people who cry about being "forced" to grind. We call those people addicts and they should go outside sometime.

Wow, that interview. Making gear even simpler? How is that even possible. It's already braindead and it's still too hard for people?
The only hope I hold out for Stormblood is that I'll at least enjoy the aesthetics of it for a long time to come. Content is iffy and itemization is already DOA. At least my fucking amazing weeb house will have more spaces.

[Alistaire]

I know, there are people who cry about being "forced" to grind. We call those people addicts and they should go outside sometime.

Not that I'd agree with the complaint but that wouldn't be the addicts; that'd be the casuals complaining if they don't play like an addict they fall behind.

[Destinye]

I believe in an interview recently Yoshida stated it isn't until 4.2/4.3 that there will be 'unique/never before seen content' introduced because they're focusing on 4.0. So that means despite all of the "YOU'RE JUST SALTY BLAH BLAH", 4.0 is literally 2.0 version 2, with swimming.

Also:


How the fuck can you not skip soar...at ilvl270..then again, the NA playerbase largely seem to can't do much these days in terms of pug lol. It's possible to skip soar at the entry ilvl and just slightly over..270 though...how hard do you need to be carried in Zurvan which literally repeats one set of mechanics after adds?

[Alistaire]

Maybe they will, and he just doesn't want people to need to for mechanics reasons...but that's ignoring the whole fact that "skip soar" parties exist more as a sign you know your job and aren't undergeared rather than being scared of or unable to handle soar.

[Fiye]

I believe in an interview recently Yoshida stated it isn't until 4.2/4.3 that there will be 'unique/never before seen content' introduced because they're focusing on 4.0. So that means despite all of the "YOU'RE JUST SALTY BLAH BLAH", 4.0 is literally 2.0 version 2, with swimming.

The new content will be an instanced place ala aquapolis or potd.

[Carth]

4.0 is literally 2.0 version 2, with swimming.

More like 2.0 version 3, since 3.0 was the exact same as 2.0.

How the fuck can you not skip soar...at ilvl270..then again, the NA playerbase largely seem to can't do much these days in terms of pug lol. It's possible to skip soar at the entry ilvl and just slightly over..270 though...how hard do you need to be carried in Zurvan which literally repeats one set of mechanics after adds?

The casual playerbase at large has no idea how to play well in this game. This is largely because SE is insanely inept at providing information to the player.