Item Search
     
BG-Wiki Search
+ Reply to Thread
Page 17 of 114 FirstFirst ... 7 15 16 17 18 19 27 67 ... LastLast
Results 321 to 340 of 2261

Thread: Salvage Bans v 2.0     submit to reddit submit to twitter

  1. #321
    E. Body
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    2,252
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Asura

    And cases where this was true were the only mythics kept remotely in check compared to their Relic/Empy counterparts. Now they're strictly better, just like Ryunohige.
    I don't really know if that's true, many mythics weren't "Kept in check" by being attached to a bad WS, they were just bad. It's kind of hard to talk about mythics back then because there weren't that many and most were not heavy DD mythics. From what I understood/remember, most mythics were really not considered very good compared to relics in most cases. For instance no one seemed to ever care about Koga at 75 because of how good Amano was. They more than likely at the time needed those buffs to stay relevant, now it may seem silly because we have such high TP gain and mythics just work better.

  2. #322
    Old Odin
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    6,198
    BG Level
    8
    FFXI Server
    Asura

    Quote Originally Posted by Falaras View Post
    I don't really know if that's true, many mythics weren't "Kept in check" by being attached to a bad WS, they were just bad. It's kind of hard to talk about mythics back then because there weren't that many and most were not heavy DD mythics. From what I understood/remember, most mythics were really not considered very good compared to relics in most cases. For instance no one seemed to ever care about Koga at 75 because of how good Amano was. They more than likely at the time needed those buffs to stay relevant, now it may seem silly because we have such high TP gain and mythics just work better.
    this + the fact that at lvl 75 it wasnt quiet easy to hit the haste cap without soulvoice songs and awesome uber gear. nowadays you hit the haste cap with 2 marches + haste and a bunch of ilvl gear you throw together (which will overcap your gearhaste), sub sam and any 2 hander is golden ¬.¬. not to mention the miriad of DA TA QA gear everyone gets when aftermath is down. and its not as sever now to hold on TP since the WS update as it was before (it still hurts in some cases but not as bad as previously).

  3. #323
    Banned.
    Account locked at request of user.

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    9,843
    BG Level
    8

    Quote Originally Posted by Falaras View Post
    It's kind of hard to talk about mythics back then...Koga at 75...at the time needed those buffs
    WS buffs were like a month or two ago.

  4. #324
    Old Odin
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    6,198
    BG Level
    8
    FFXI Server
    Asura

    Quote Originally Posted by Priran View Post
    WS buffs were like a month or two ago.
    I think the biggest boost for mythics were the implementation of questing empy WSs in 50% of the cases, the other 50% of cases has a strong merit WS or their normal non R/E/M WS benefited from their last WS update. Which is imho not a bad thing, relics benefited from it too, empys were the ones that got shafted the most.

  5. #325
    Ridill
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    23,736
    BG Level
    10
    FFXI Server
    Bahamut

    Not having a super gimped ws to activate AM3 certainly was nice though even if it's only 1 out every several ws... especially for some ws that when you add in the mythic ws boost they become really nice and scale very well with tp

  6. #326
    E. Body
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    2,252
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Asura

    Quote Originally Posted by Priran View Post
    WS buffs were like a month or two ago.
    And I already explained why I don't agree the WS buffs were SE showing preferential treatment to Mythics over Relics/Empyreans.

  7. #327
    Banned.
    Account locked at request of user.

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    9,843
    BG Level
    8

    Quote Originally Posted by Falaras View Post
    And I already explained why I don't agree the WS buffs were SE showing preferential treatment to Mythics over Relics/Empyreans.
    So is your position is that SE isn't aware that their game has evolved since Lv.75, or is it that they weren't aware that buffing a WS which when used with a certain weapon receives a 30% damage boost and activates an OA2-3 latent would also therefore buff that weapon?

    Because what I'm saying is that at ilvl 119, the only thing keeping certain Mythics merely situationally superior to R+E was that the WS you had to use to activate Aftermath was weak, and in the context of that situation SE went ahead and buffed those WS preferentially strongly compared to Empy while leaving Relic WS untouched, making the Mythics in question flat-out always better.

  8. #328
    BG Content
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    21,105
    BG Level
    10
    FFXI Server
    Lakshmi
    Blog Entries
    1

    Things that have benefited Mythics lately:
    1) Capped haste is a constant now, so getting and maintaining AM3 is much more reasonable
    2) Empyrean WSs can now be unlocked on any weapon (Koga, Conqueror, daggers, etc. thank you, SE)
    3) Mythic WSs were boosted to be competitive options for non-mythic users, generally, which made them even stronger for Mythic users. The effect here was really not very large, though.
    4) A lot of WSs also got increased TP multipliers at 200-300 TP waypoints, and over TPing is more common for mythics.
    5) Incursion is an event where getting and maintaining AM3 is reasonable.

    Delve and Skirmish v2 were kind of "eh" when it came to AM3 maintenance. You could definitely do it, but you spend a lot of time running and crap. Incursion still involves running, but it's more of a roaming merit party than S/Iing to a destination and killing more mobs.

  9. #329
    E. Body
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    2,252
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Asura

    Quote Originally Posted by Priran View Post
    So is your position is that SE isn't aware that their game has evolved since Lv.75, or is it that they weren't aware that buffing a WS which when used with a certain weapon receives a 30% damage boost and activates an OA2-3 latent would also therefore buff that weapon?

    Because what I'm saying is that at ilvl 119, the only thing keeping certain Mythics merely situationally superior to R+E was that the WS you had to use to activate Aftermath was weak, and in the context of that situation SE went ahead and buffed those WS preferentially strongly compared to Empy while leaving Relic WS untouched, making the Mythics in question flat-out always better.
    I'm saying that I think SE doesn't treat Mythics preferentially, and the WS update wasn't made to buff mythics it just had that side effect. Plenty of patches have the side effect of buffing items without them intentionally trying to. Like I said before there was a clear cut reason for why SE buffed WSes like they did, the mythic WSes were exceptionally weak compared to the empyrean WSes so they obviously needed more buffing. The relic WSes are still attached to a singular weapon so they didn't buff them. To me that means they were just looking to buff WSes in general to add more variety to which can be used, not drive some agenda of making Mythics the superior weapon.

    What I said in my first post was basically what Bryth just said, mythics are benefiting from how the game is changing in Haste and having events that they work better in. SE isn't actively pushing mythics over Empyreans or Relics.

  10. #330
    Relic Horn
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,131
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Sylph

    Relic weaponskills did actually get buffs, on the whole. However, since all of them have their aftermath linked to the weaponskill itself, none of them had TP > damage changed, which was the biggest way most WSs got buffs. Some of them got pretty nice mod buffs.

  11. #331

    Quote Originally Posted by Fwahm View Post
    Relic weaponskills did actually get buffs, on the whole. However, since all of them have their aftermath linked to the weaponskill itself, none of them had TP > damage changed, which was the biggest way most WSs got buffs. Some of them got pretty nice mod buffs.
    I'm glad someone else remembered that fact...
    I mean... Charisma mods?
    Thank God those are dead now.
    That alone pimped out many Relics to maintain their "top of the DD weapon" status.

  12. #332
    Banned.
    Account locked at request of user.

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    9,843
    BG Level
    8

    Quote Originally Posted by FaeQueenCory View Post
    That alone pimped out many Relics to maintain their "top of the DD weapon" status.
    Name one Relic weapon that had its WS's stat mod changed and is better than the corresponding Mythic.

  13. #333
    Ridill
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    23,736
    BG Level
    10
    FFXI Server
    Bahamut

    Quote Originally Posted by Fwahm View Post
    Relic weaponskills did actually get buffs, on the whole. However, since all of them have their aftermath linked to the weaponskill itself, none of them had TP > damage changed, which was the biggest way most WSs got buffs. Some of them got pretty nice mod buffs.
    A very small one of 60%s going to 80s and the like and some had less retarded stats. And sure the aftermath is linked to the ws... so are empyrean and mythic and tp effects the ws associated with those even if it isn't always dmg... not to mention much better aftermaths and longer aftermath duration. Sure some are less gimp but you still aren't going to use any besides ranged ones or Mercy Stroke

  14. #334

    Quote Originally Posted by Priran View Post
    Name one Relic weapon that had its WS's stat mod changed and is better than the corresponding Mythic.
    Mandau and Ragnarok for one.
    Apoc is now pretty damn great, and while its haste aftermath is pretty worthless thanks to iLvs... Catastrophe serves a utility that makes Apoc worthwhile. (A big one in terms of DD is Souleater shenanigans with 0 drawback.)
    And let's not forget Spharai...
    Relics at 119 far exceed any Empyrean... Namely because Empys lack +%dmg... But also because SE decided that Empys needed to no longer be copypastes of Relics' DMG and delay... Making them even more ghetto!relics...

    But Mythics are intrinsically superior to Relics when Magery gets involved.
    Namely because Relics are High-Damage-Low-Delay weapons that make "double" Light and Dark SCs... Making Relics favorable and good for physical DDs.
    Magics on the otherhand... Mythics like Nirvana and Yagrush are crack for their magic augments... But I'm pretty sure Claustrum and Mjollnir will out parse them... But... Why would a SMN and WHM want to be parsing high via AAs and SCs?
    (Other than to prove a point that you could I guess.)

    So it really depends on the jobs.
    But generally, if phys: Relic; if magic: Mythic.
    Though now with WS adjustments and iLvs, Mythics have come a long way and can serve phys DDs just as well as Relics used to.

    But just because the Δ between parsing with a Relic and Mythic is smaller than it used to be... I don't see how that is unfairly favoring Mythics?
    If anything it's better for the health of the game because it creates variance and allows for more choices to be made.
    (Which is why I am in favor of adding the same +%dmg to Empyreans and their false Mythic counterparts: Ergons. As well as opening Relics up to all appropriate postCoP jobs and Empys up to RUN and GEO.)

  15. #335
    Relic Horn
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,131
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Sylph

    Well er, Liberator absolutely slaughters Ragnarok for damage, and you don't actually ever use Scourge unless using it to open Light when Sekkanoki is up. For any type of meleeing, Mythics beat Relics soundly now.

  16. #336
    Banned.
    Account locked at request of user.

    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Posts
    9,843
    BG Level
    8

    Quote Originally Posted by FaeQueenCory View Post
    Mandau
    Mercy Stroke has always been STR?
    and Ragnarok
    Is not better than Liberator/Conqueror.

  17. #337
    Banned.

    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    1
    BG Level
    0

    Can we get back on topic? Everyone abusing these exploits deserves to be banned.

  18. #338
    Banned.

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    3,876
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Shiva
    WoW Realm
    Kil'jaeden

    i am surprised the name penis was not taken

  19. #339
    So hard we fuck rocks
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    3,088
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Sylph

    Quote Originally Posted by Penis View Post
    Can we get back on topic? Everyone abusing these exploits deserves to be banned.
    http://s4.scoopwhoop.com/ach/bestie/13.gif

  20. #340
    Relic Horn
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Posts
    3,131
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Sylph

    Quote Originally Posted by Priran View Post
    Mercy Stroke has always been STR? Is not better than Liberator/Conqueror.
    Mercy Stroke was always STR, but it was changed from 60% to 80% in the update.

Similar Threads

  1. i got banned from bg forum once
    By Judah in forum FFXI: Everything
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: 2005-09-03, 19:26