Star Wars Anthology 2: Solo (May 25, 2018)

[Elcura]

People complain because it fucking sucked. Almost no one cares that it was different; it was the shit delivery, writing, comedy, and characters that they are complaining about.

Pretty much, you can do things differently, just do them well. You can subvert expectations but to kill off whatever interest people had in the story arc thus far was fucking dumb, especially when it isn't replaced with something more interesting.

[Mythe_Seraph]

Pretty much, you can do things differently, just do them well. You can subvert expectations but to kill off whatever interest people had in the story arc thus far was fucking dumb, especially when it isn't replaced with something more interesting.

This and also having a complete lack of direction in story telling.
Trilogy 1: Anakin Skywalker, the Skywalker family beginnings
Trilogy 2: Luke Skywalker, the Skywalker family story
Trilogy 3: No idea what story is being told here.

If these three trilogies are supposed to have any cohesion they should focus on generally the same subject matter... if Rey is not a Skywalker this new trilogy should have never taken place. It makes no sense and it tells no true story in the history of star wars. TJL could be some confusing way to set up the reveal in part 3 that Rey is a Skywalker but it does it so bad... and leaves the viewer with no real interest or understanding of where the story is going to go. Zero cohesion.

[Xno Kappa]

I hate people saying TLJ is hated because it was “different.” No it wasn’t and no it isn’t. People hate TLJ because it flat-out fucking sucked. No matter how many loops your mental gymnast has to go through, the end score is that it sucks!

[Weltall]

I hate people saying TLJ is hated because it was “different.” No it wasn’t and no it isn’t. People hate TLJ because it flat-out fucking sucked. No matter how many loops your mental gymnast has to go through, the end score is that it sucks!

It is a pathetic argument that is *mostly* only used by the few people who somehow support TLJ lol.

[Salodin]

Eh, objectively most of the star wars films aren't great. Entertaining, but not great.

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[Weltall]

This and also having a complete lack of direction in story telling.
Trilogy 1: Anakin Skywalker, the Skywalker family beginnings
Trilogy 2: Luke Skywalker, the Skywalker family story
Trilogy 3: No idea what story is being told here.

If these three trilogies are supposed to have any cohesion they should focus on generally the same subject matter... if Rey is not a Skywalker this new trilogy should have never taken place. It makes no sense and it tells no true story in the history of star wars. TJL could be some confusing way to set up the reveal in part 3 that Rey is a Skywalker but it does it so bad... and leaves the viewer with no real interest or understanding of where the story is going to go. Zero cohesion.

For cohesion purposes, they should have legit just made Snoke be Plagueis. It is one of the only believable ways that a random dude that powerful in the force appeared so quickly, after Palpatine was killed. It fits with all of the now non-canon Plagueis book, current books, and his deformed figure and height. He was working on impregnating beings, successfully, by just using the force, thus explaining Anakin's birth (and his Palpatine replacement).

[Greedouw]

There are parts of TLJ I love and parts that I absolutely hate.

Oh well

[Eurell]

Arguments I've seen in the past page.

I don't hate it because its different! Why aren't we focusing on a Skywalker!?
I'm not angry because it subverted my expectations! I will only accept Snoke as Plageuis!


Like, don't get me wrong. TLJ had a fuckton of problems. But the circlejerk in here is ridiculous. Dumb plot threads, wasting characters time, silly character decisions, those are all problems. Snoke not being a previously known character and rey not being a skywalker are not the problems, despite how much we (me included) would have liked those things to happen.

Also, yeah. Solo was a fun movie. But the best of the new batch? Solo was fun, but filled with just as many stupid plot holes and dumb character decisions and More shoe horned fan service as the other movies. Lets not pretend it was a masterpiece lol.

[Weltall]

Arguments I've seen in the past page.

I don't hate it because its different! Why aren't we focusing on a Skywalker!?
I'm not angry because it subverted my expectations! I will only accept Snoke as Plageuis!


Like, don't get me wrong. TLJ had a fuckton of problems. But the circlejerk in here is ridiculous. Dumb plot threads, wasting characters time, silly character decisions, those are all problems. Snoke not being a previously known character and rey not being a skywalker are not the problems, despite how much we (me included) would have liked those things to happen.

Also, yeah. Solo was a fun movie. But the best of the new batch? Solo was fun, but filled with just as many stupid plot holes and dumb character decisions and More shoe horned fan service as the other movies. Lets not pretend it was a masterpiece lol.

Lol, I'm not complaining that he isn't Plag (it still makes the most sense). Again, you're just making up poor arguments. I am totally fine with Snoke being a brand new character, so long as he was well written, interesting, developed etc. TFA set up the foundation for just that, and TLJ dropped the ball HARD.

[Zealot]

None of that made any sense to me. I don't know what a plagueis is.

The entire movie was about subverting tropes and defying expectations.

[Elcura]

None of that made any sense to me. I don't know what a plagueis is.

The entire movie was about subverting tropes and defying expectations.

They subverted expectations so much they forgot to also make a good movie

[Anoat]

None of that made any sense to me. I don't know what a plagueis is.

The entire movie was about subverting tropes and defying expectations.

You never heard the tragedy of Darth Plageuis the Wise?

[EternityEnd]

None of that made any sense to me. I don't know what a plagueis is.

The entire movie was about subverting tropes and defying expectations.

And that's poor writing. You can "subvert tropes" and "defy expectations" with proper setup, foreshadowing, and narrative purpose, but that isn't what TLJ did. It took the foundation of TFA and irreverently threw it away—in the same manner Luke tossed his lightsaber over his shoulder—with the express goal of shock and subversion, rather than letting those arise naturally during the course of a well-plotted story.

It's Game of Thrones syndrome. The initial twists that Martin wrote served to propel his narrative's trajectory, whereas D&D's later inclination was to kill people for cheap shock value, because writing a sprawling epic while prioritizing coherence and intricacy is difficult. Which makes it all the less surprising that Disney hired D&D for Star Wars—ugh.

LucasFilms needed to conceive a full story for the directors to work within, rather than planning for three writer-directors to write three distinct movies—with zero direction from on high, and zero collaboration—and praying they somehow form a cohesive "trilogy."

[Zealot]

Did it? I had a very different experience watching this movie apparently. I saw a movie where everyone was expecting several things to happen and then none of those things occurred because of a series of character decisions that distinctly grew out of where these characters had all been at the end of TFA.

Also I should clarify since I see it touched some conversation off before, my observation isn't that it's "different," and therefore I think people are attacking it because it's different, my observation is that it's NOT different. It's not at ALL different.

I mean, let's take a look at Empire. In that movie, the heroes are being pursued by the villains while one of them trains under a reluctant old Jedi master. Meanwhile, as the bad guys close in, two of the other heroes go to a decadent city that thrives because of its alliance with the villains, where they find help from one of its inhabitants in carrying out their secret plan. But shock! They are betrayed. A villain who has been completely ineffectual up to this point yet is somehow inexplicably popular captures the heroes. Meanwhile, the hero-in-training, guided by visions of an enemy, leaves training and travels to confront the main bad guy. The two of them fight it out, and the villain provides the hero a devastating revelation about parentage, followed by an offer to join him and rule by his side, because no one will be powerful enough to stop them. The hero turns down the offer, but manages to escape the villain and return to the other heroes. Oh! And I almost forgot, the bad guys gather up all their forces to launch an attack on the secret hero base to crush them once and for all. They suffer terrible losses but manage to escape by the skin of their teeth to attempt rebuilding their rebellion and casting down the bad guys once and for all.

Did I say Empire? I meant The Last Jedi.

[Salodin]

Entertaining, but not great.

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[Zealot]

Entertaining, but not great.

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Like Star Wars!

[Salodin]

Art imitates life.

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[Elcura]

Did it? I had a very different experience watching this movie apparently. I saw a movie where everyone was expecting several things to happen and then none of those things occurred because of a series of character decisions that distinctly grew out of where these characters had all been at the end of TFA.

Also I should clarify since I see it touched some conversation off before, my observation isn't that it's "different," and therefore I think people are attacking it because it's different, my observation is that it's NOT different. It's not at ALL different.

I mean, let's take a look at Empire. In that movie, the heroes are being pursued by the villains while one of them trains under a reluctant old Jedi master. Meanwhile, as the bad guys close in, two of the other heroes go to a decadent city that thrives because of its alliance with the villains, where they find help from one of its inhabitants in carrying out their secret plan. But shock! They are betrayed. A villain who has been completely ineffectual up to this point yet is somehow inexplicably popular captures the heroes. Meanwhile, the hero-in-training, guided by visions of an enemy, leaves training and travels to confront the main bad guy. The two of them fight it out, and the villain provides the hero a devastating revelation about parentage, followed by an offer to join him and rule by his side, because no one will be powerful enough to stop them. The hero turns down the offer, but manages to escape the villain and return to the other heroes. Oh! And I almost forgot, the bad guys gather up all their forces to launch an attack on the secret hero base to crush them once and for all. They suffer terrible losses but manage to escape by the skin of their teeth to attempt rebuilding their rebellion and casting down the bad guys once and for all.

Did I say Empire? I meant The Last Jedi.

Are you being dumb for the sake of it, because like everyone said, it's the execution of the movie that sucked. You can follow Empire as much as you like but with shitty writing and no clear goal in mind it doesn't matter how similar they are if one was clearly hated and the other regarded as one of the best movies of the franchise.

What do you think the difference is?

Entertaining, but not great.

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I'd say ANH and ESB are great movies, RotJ is less so but still a great watch. The rest are hit or miss, but generally entertaining enough if you don't think about them.

[Zealot]

How did the execution suck? That's what I don't understand.

[Zealot]

Like I have no problem saying parts of the movie like the casino planet thing and the whole slow-chase-through-space were misses for an action movie but those were little more than backdrops for everything else going on.