Thread: Paladin 3.0 - Now with +1 Button    

Originally Posted by The Stig

Ya I've been complaining about this none stop lol. The only sacred thing about us is Circle of Scorn. It's all so incredibly underwhelming; WARs and DRKs get nearly everything they need to be immersive about their job!

This is also the reason why I have my swords and shields glamoured to the nexus 115 version permanently.

We're not holy knights by the way. We're free paladins, sultansworn without all the extra commitment of having to protect the sultana. Protectors of the weak without any holy vows. There is literally nothing holy about us except the ham-fisted abilities inserted into our repertoire. People clamoring for holy abilities is likely the reason most of our new skills are so lackluster.

Not to mention, Paladin is just the localization flavor name for the job since it's just Knight in JP.

Originally Posted by Hioki

We're not holy knights by the way. We're free paladins, sultansworn without all the extra commitment of having to protect the sultana. Protectors of the weak without any holy vows. There is literally nothing holy about us except the ham-fisted abilities inserted into our repertoire. People clamoring for holy abilities is likely the reason most of our new skills are so lackluster.

Clemency existing as a cure drives the lore part of my interests completely batty. Is it Conjury? There's nothing in Paladin lore stating we've got contact with the elementals. It's sure as hell not succor, even if it behaves a lot like Holy Succor from 1.x. It's also definitely not arcanima.

I've come to the point where I just consider paladin special abilities to be fueled by willpower or something: Hallowed lets you ignore damage entirely from almost everything, Tempered Will allows you to stand your ground against basically anything, and Clemency is... I don't fucking know. There's no explanation for why we suddenly have a potent (albeit useless) heal.

Willpower or stamina would be my guess, based on Spirits Within.

Originally Posted by Lyall

Clemency existing as a cure drives the lore part of my interests completely batty. Is it Conjury? There's nothing in Paladin lore stating we've got contact with the elementals. It's sure as hell not succor, even if it behaves a lot like Holy Succor from 1.x. It's also definitely not arcanima.

I've come to the point where I just consider paladin special abilities to be fueled by willpower or something: Hallowed lets you ignore damage entirely from almost everything, Tempered Will allows you to stand your ground against basically anything, and Clemency is... I don't fucking know. There's no explanation for why we suddenly have a potent (albeit useless) heal.

It would have to be conjury driven by willpower & mercy I would imagine. Keep in mind one of the main subclass requirements to access the job is Conjurer. You could also go the metal route and treat it as forgiving a blood debt owed to Halone or whoever.

Originally Posted by Lokus

Not to mention, Paladin is just the localization flavor name for the job since it's just Knight in JP.

Originally Posted by The Stig

The 2 replies above, yeh, I was just about to ask "then why is it called PLD and not something like Knight" but I was not aware of the JP's name

It's kind of a tricky issue as PLD in XI was also called Knight in JP, and along the years in the franchise Knight and Paladin classes from older titles, have more or less had the line between them blurred.

Originally Posted by Hioki

It would have to be conjury driven by willpower & mercy I would imagine. Keep in mind one of the main subclass requirements to access the job is Conjurer. You could also go the metal route and treat it as forgiving a blood debt owed to Halone or whoever.

If I'm remembering correctly, Paladin's the only job in the game that has been shown expressly using a different weapon from the norm: The back-up Sultansworn during the Ul'dah scion fight in Thanalan (and probably some others) show them distinctly using conjurer budded wands. Despite that, there's not really any indication that those things are required, not to mention that, barring clemency, Paladin can't heal worth a damn. It's not a big detail, but the sudden "by the way, here's a giant heal" is jarring to me. We're either holy-powered or we're not, but if we're going to be I want SE to explain that shit.

Originally Posted by Lyall

If I'm remembering correctly, Paladin's the only job in the game that has been shown expressly using a different weapon from the norm: The back-up Sultansworn during the Ul'dah scion fight in Thanalan (and probably some others) show them distinctly using conjurer budded wands. Despite that, there's not really any indication that those things are required, not to mention that, barring clemency, Paladin can't heal worth a damn. It's not a big detail, but the sudden "by the way, here's a giant heal" is jarring to me. We're either holy-powered or we're not, but if we're going to be I want SE to explain that shit.

I think this is a case that most paladins(barring free plds) are sultansworn but not all sultansworn are paladins. To keep it consistent, any class is capable of casting cure without conjurer wands. A wand/staff has never been a limitation to casting capabilities, specializations(jobs) cause restrictions.

The early DRK quests have your main trainer wearing a staff for the majority of the quests as well, despite being a 'dark knight' and wearing armor inaccessible as conjurer(or further extent thaumaturgy). This creates a new point that NPC's are not gear restricted. So they can wear paladin gear without ever being paladins.

XI had/has this gear case as well. NPCs and players can wear anything without restriction to job as long as they meet the minimum level requirement of a job that could wear it. ( I can glamour a thf body as dnc as long as I have thf leveled up high enough to wear the body naturally.)

Originally Posted by Hioki

I think this is a case that most paladins(barring free plds) are sultansworn but not all sultansworn are paladins. To keep it consistent, any class is capable of casting cure without conjurer wands. A wand/staff has never been a limitation to casting capabilities, specializations(jobs) cause restrictions.

The early DRK quests have your main trainer wearing a staff for the majority of the quests as well, despite being a 'dark knight' and wearing armor inaccessible as conjurer(or further extent thaumaturgy). This creates a new point that NPC's are not gear restricted. So they can wear paladin gear without ever being paladins.

XI had/has this gear case as well. NPCs and players can wear anything without restriction to job as long as they meet the minimum level requirement of a job that could wear it. ( I can glamour a thf body as dnc as long as I have thf leveled up high enough to wear the body naturally.)

The disparity between in-game lore and in-game mechanics causes no shortage of headaches when trying to determine what "works" for the lore side of things. Here's looking at you, shitty teleport lore.

Fast Blade TP cost has been reduced from 70 to 60.
Savage Blade The amount of enmity generated has been increased.
Goring Blade Potency when used as a combo action has been increased from 220 to 240.
Damage over time potency has been increased from 40 to 50.
Royal Authority Potency when used as a combo action has been increased from 340 to 350.
Clemency Casting time reduced from 3 to 2 seconds.
Divine Veil The protective barrier that is cast on all party members within range when you receive a healing spell now activates even when healing yourself.
Recast time reduced from 150 seconds to 120 seconds.
Sword Oath Use will no longer interrupt weaponskill combos.
Shield Oath Use will no longer interrupt weaponskill combos.
Damage penalty has been reduced from 20% to 15%.
The amount of enmity generated has been increased.

"Throw more DPS at them" strikes again. This really doesn't address any of the many fundamental issues with PLD's tool kit.

Goring now 640 potency which is nice tbh however i do think it did need more than DPS change onry =.=

Well, cost of Fast Blade going down will help a bit since it's the most used Weapon Skill by PLD.

Originally Posted by Obsidian

Fast Blade TP cost has been reduced from 70 to 60.
Savage Blade The amount of enmity generated has been increased.
Goring Blade Potency when used as a combo action has been increased from 220 to 240.
Damage over time potency has been increased from 40 to 50.
Royal Authority Potency when used as a combo action has been increased from 340 to 350.
Clemency Casting time reduced from 3 to 2 seconds.
Divine Veil The protective barrier that is cast on all party members within range when you receive a healing spell now activates even when healing yourself.
Recast time reduced from 150 seconds to 120 seconds.
Sword Oath Use will no longer interrupt weaponskill combos.
Shield Oath Use will no longer interrupt weaponskill combos.
Damage penalty has been reduced from 20% to 15%.
The amount of enmity generated has been increased.

"Throw more DPS at them" strikes again. This really doesn't address any of the many fundamental issues with PLD's tool kit.

Even sillier because they have done exactly what they said they weren't going to do. And there was no reason they couldn't have done all this in 3.0 or 3.05 or wtf. They made it sound like they were going to make fundamental changes which was why it would take time. Whereas everything they changed is really simple, took no time to think about and could have been implemented at any point.

There is a faint hope that the change to Oath's not interrupting WS combos is because they are now oGCD. Doesn't specifically say it but could be the case.

Probably still GCD skills since they didn't mention the oaths becoming abilities. PLD's AoE is still crap though in comparison (spreading Goring is much better now at least) while WAR still remains as a mainstay in a tanking team.

WAR's not going anywhere as long as it's the only tank capable of fulltiming the Storm's Path debuff.

All I'm reading from this is that they've barely done anything at all. It's like, "Oh God, you're bleeding out and will be dead in a few minutes without immediate attention. Have this bandaid with Daffy Duck on it."