Bardmage 3.0

[Niiro]

Just noticed yet another unique thing/abnormality about Empyreal Arrow when checking my GCD timer (It's 2.45 seconds so 49 GCDs in 2 mins). Unlike other oGCD abilities Skill Speed affects the recast timer

Technically Skill speed/Spell speed don't effect the GCD, but the recast time of weapon skills and magic spells respectively.

Like how Spell speed effects the recast of pet casts (pets don't even have a GCD).

[Gadritan]

Stop feeding the Dan. Please. Just. Stop.

[Kaixin]

I'm not going to conitue [SIC] with you

And I REALLY mean it this time! I let you go easy when we argued about macros and when we argued about kill time and DPS, but this time I'm serious! You better wise up, pal!

[Spider-Dan]

Yes, stop feeding me.

Especially by saying dumb things like BRD clearly has WAY more oGCD actions than MCH and you are stupid for suggesting otherwise.

Looks like 757 CRT at LV60 gives you a crit rate of 14.26%, which is interesting because i189 BRD with food has 666 CRT. Remember, not only was I wrong by saying that MCH had more oGCD actions than BRD, I was so obviously wrong that it was a waste of time to even discuss it (which would have been "feeding me").

Niiro always making sure the community stays on top of factual facts, and Gadritan comes in with the well-deserved last-minute assist.

[Niiro]

You keep saying things sarcastically like they're not true.

[Spider-Dan]

You say that as if you haven't read the last page of the thread where you were proven wrong (or, at a very minimum, proven that the comparison is extremely close and situational).

[Niiro]

Haha.

Last page of what thread?

[Spider-Dan]

For BRD though it boils down to this

No Miserys End - 54% of GCD's require an oGCD to be used
Miserys End in play - 75% of GCD's require an oGCD to be used

MCH's longest CD is Raging Strikes at 180s, which puts MCH at 72 GCDs for one "rotation." Of those 72 GCDs, you'd be doing 48 oGCDs (66%) without Heartbreak and 54 oGCDs (75%) with it. Compare to your numbers of 54% and 75% (respectively) for BRD.

Obviously, as you said, that doesn't include BL resets. The math for Misery's is easy; any reset and BRD pulls ahead in oGCD actions. Without Misery's, BRD would need 6 BL resets in 120s (40 ticks), which works out to a 15% crit rate.

666 CRT should give you a crit rate of about 12.23%. That looks like less than 15% to me.

[Niiro]

Straight Shot

Have a nice day.

Also, there's a big, big difference between oGCDs on timers and ones that come randomly, I don't expect you to understand why that's significant tho.

(also Internal Release)

[Spider-Dan]

I'll see your Straight Shot and raise you a downtime, where every one of MCH's fifteen CDs keep ticking but BL can reset, at most, once. But feel free to post your actual crit rate anytime you like.

You seem to be trying to make a point about it being more complicated to use BL because of its randomness, which I agree with...? WM is designed poorly and BRD is dumb now, which I saw the day the patch notes were released; that's why I immediately dropped BRD. However, that has nothing to do with counting which job uses more oGCDs, which you seem to be unable to do.

[Jem]

I forget what the parses had me at but I want to say around the 26-27% crit region.

Plus you need to factor in Empy Arrow into those number too. If you treat it like a normal oGCD then you're looking at revised figures of 70.8% (no Misery) and 91.6% (with Misery). If Misery is in play, then it's basically impossible to keep everything on CD without sacrificing GCD speed.

BL resets are a little more difficult to factor in though. Because 6 BL resets doesn't mean you get 6 more BL in that period as that would be assuming that all the resets occur with it at max CD. Really the problem with BL resets is that they make it impossible to have any sort of rotation unless you go with the mentality of either 'Even when it resets I'll delay i until I can slot it in' or 'If it resets I'll double up oGCDs and slightly delay my GCD'

[Kuhlitoraal]

Yeah at around the 730-39 CRT on my gear (even prior to Alex hands/waist probably high 600's) I have been getting like 21-27% (never under) crits since Alex was opened up, perhaps prior but my memory is such shit I don't recall.

[Spider-Dan]

Against a dummy, BRD would probably have more oGCDs. I think once you include downtime and similar factors, MCH probably has slightly more. But that wasn't really my point; my point was that if BRD's endless oGCD management annoys you, MCH is not a good job to switch to for addressing that problem.

I do agree that MCH seems to be designed with Gauss Barrel in mind and it seems like whoever was in charge of BRD just said, "Oh, that sounds cool, why don't I just do that too?" If WM was designed well, instead of getting instant procs off of Straighter Shot, you would get them off of BL resets (when you could best use that extra time from an instant shot).

[Jem]

Are any other BRDs worried about some of the DPS check numbers being thrown around?

[Classikmage]

Are any other BRDs worried about some of the DPS check numbers being thrown around?

Reading up about people's experience with Faust/Oppressor in Alexander Savage, I think it might make the current BRD/MCH segregation in PF much worse than it already is.

[Jem]

I haven't personally been parsing but LS members have been giving us numbers from time to time and I just cannot see any way of me pulling 1300-1400+ DPS on BRD. Maybe better BRDs than me can eke that out but that is so far above what I have been doing that I can't see any reasonable way of me hitting it.

Now granted these have all been non-stationary fights but can BRD even pull those numbers on a dummy? (which is essentially what Faust is)

[Classikmage]

I haven't personally been parsing but LS members have been giving us numbers from time to time and I just cannot see any way of me pulling 1300-1400+ DPS on BRD. Maybe better BRDs than me can eke that out but that is so far above what I have been doing that I can't see any reasonable way of me hitting it.

Now granted these have all been non-stationary fights but can BRD even pull those numbers on a dummy? (which is essentially what Faust is)

I doubt it, I made the swap up to NIN and it's actually a fun job, and not too hard to regear since it shares accessories with BRD, you jusy need to redo the left side.

[Classikmage]

BRD is getting screwed harder and harder with each upcoming update. I just lookied at the i210 BRD bow at the NPC, and it actually has TWO DAMAGE LESS than the i180 NIN weapon I'm using now...

[Niiro]

Been thru this many times, BRD weapons have always had less damage than melee weapons.

This isn't something new.

[Classikmage]

Been thru this many times, BRD weapons have always had less damage than melee weapons.

This isn't something new.

Yes, that it understandable. But still... i180 vs. i210.... the scaling wasn't always THAT bad. NIN vs BRD weapons at 210 now have a difference of 8 base damage at i210.