1. FFXIV Reset Timers
    Last daily reset was 1 hours, 8 minutes ago / Next daily reset is in 22 hours, 51 minutes
    Last weekly reset was 1 days, 18 hours, 8 minutes ago / Next weekly reset is in 4 days, 15 hours, 51 minutes
+ Reply to Thread
Page 4 of 19 FirstFirst ... 2 3 4 5 6 14 ... LastLast
Results 61 to 80 of 369
  1. #61
    Strider/Doom/Cyclops
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    5,687
    BG Level
    8
    FFXIV Character
    Viper Beam
    FFXIV Server
    Balmung
    FFXI Server
    Quetzalcoatl

    I think it was a "fix," as Rapid Fire was also working on Limit Break, Teleport, mount summon, etc.

  2. #62

    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Dan View Post
    They also have less damage than tank weapons.
    And caster weapons.
    And healer weapons.
    Tank damage output is based on the same principles as melees, thus the same DMG values, they don't do as much damage as melees because of limited DPS abilities.

    Ranged DPS are different in that they have 100% damage uptime, they are completely unaffected by almost all fight mechanics, they can DPS from any direction, from any range, while moving*.

    If ranged DPS DMG values were the same as melee no one would bring melee.

    *Obviously SE threw a big wrench in the equation by introducing WM and Gauss limiting their movement and disabling their auto-attacks, and it's something they've acknowledged was a bit of a fuck up (at least for BRD), but at the very least BRD is no worse off than they were previously (aside from the Barrage nerf) and simply didn't gain much in the way of new abilities.

  3. #63
    Strider/Doom/Cyclops
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    5,687
    BG Level
    8
    FFXIV Character
    Viper Beam
    FFXIV Server
    Balmung
    FFXI Server
    Quetzalcoatl

    To recap:

    - MCH combos are very weak compared to NIN combos (or any other physical job)
    - but MCH has damage+30% trait
    - but NIN has damage+20% stance and speed+15% buff, MNK has damage+27%/speed+15% buff, etc.
    - and everyone but BRD/MCH has much stronger weapons
    - but BRD and MCH can run freely during battle
    - except now they can't anymore, and they lose AA in the process

    Does that cover it?

  4. #64
    Chram
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,740
    BG Level
    7
    FFXIV Character
    Helmut Lang
    FFXIV Server
    Excalibur

    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Dan View Post
    I think it was a "fix," as Rapid Fire was also working on Limit Break, Teleport, mount summon, etc.
    I did read that note, but there was no mention of casting time for Gauss Barrel. They may have forgotten to add it to that note... it was a mistake in come capacity.

  5. #65

    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Dan View Post
    To recap:

    - MCH combos are very weak compared to NIN combos (or any other physical job)
    - but MCH has damage+30% trait
    - but NIN has damage+20% stance and speed+15% buff, MNK has damage+27%/speed+15% buff, etc.
    - and everyone but BRD/MCH has much stronger weapons
    - but BRD and MCH can run freely during battle
    - except now they can't anymore, and they lose AA in the process

    Does that cover it?
    Yes.

    Call me when people stop bringing ranged DPS to content, cause then you'll have something to complain about.

  6. #66
    Hydra
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    112
    BG Level
    3
    FFXIV Character
    Milk Ichigo
    FFXIV Server
    Leviathan

    BRD and MCH have party boost attack it is why they do less damage.

  7. #67
    Yoshi P
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Posts
    5,141
    BG Level
    8
    FFXIV Character
    Dead Gye
    FFXIV Server
    Lamia
    FFXI Server
    Ragnarok

    Quote Originally Posted by Niiro View Post
    Yes.

    Call me when people stop bringing ranged DPS to content, cause then you'll have something to complain about.
    You don't get to use "ranged" as an excuse when 2 of the 4 ranged don't apply to your counterargument.

  8. #68
    Strider/Doom/Cyclops
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    5,687
    BG Level
    8
    FFXIV Character
    Viper Beam
    FFXIV Server
    Balmung
    FFXI Server
    Quetzalcoatl

    Quote Originally Posted by Niiro View Post
    Yes.

    Call me when people stop bringing ranged DPS to content, cause then you'll have something to complain about.
    Nobody ever "stopped bringing" DRG to parties and it continues to receive buffs.
    Nobody even came close to shunning PLD or WAR and they got a bunch of tools that do nothing but increase DPS output.
    Casters are beloved in this game and they still keep getting stronger.
    etc.

    I would have no problem with BRD/MCH having crappy DPS if they were set up as real support jobs instead of casters-with-bad-damage.

  9. #69

    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Dan View Post
    Nobody ever "stopped bringing" DRG to parties and it continues to receive buffs.
    lol what?

    Yea, I know, Final Coil was so long ago, hard to remember.

    Quote Originally Posted by Deadgye View Post
    You don't get to use "ranged" as an excuse when 2 of the 4 ranged don't apply to your counterargument.
    I'm only referring to BRD and MCH because they're the jobs were talking about.

  10. #70
    Strider/Doom/Cyclops
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    5,687
    BG Level
    8
    FFXIV Character
    Viper Beam
    FFXIV Server
    Balmung
    FFXI Server
    Quetzalcoatl

    Nobody ever "stopped bringing" DRG to FCoB, in exactly the same sense that no one "stopped bringing" WAR to 2.0 BCoB. You just had a bunch of people continuing to play those jobs while complaining.

    But most importantly: your entire justification for BRD/MCH being underpowered is that they can run and shoot... while you simultaneously admit that they can't run and shoot anymore. So why, exactly, does MCH get a D65 weapon and gimpy WS combos while BLM and SMN get D72 weapons and nuclear bombs?

  11. #71

    Quote Originally Posted by Spider-Dan View Post
    Nobody ever "stopped bringing" DRG to FCoB
    aaaand I'm out.

  12. #72
    MOST RAD.
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Posts
    1,727
    BG Level
    6
    FFXIV Character
    Pupuru Puru
    FFXIV Server
    Goblin
    FFXI Server
    Ragnarok

    If they expanded upon ammo management, it would be less of a chore. Like giving ammunition effects to the other weaponskills instead of just 20 potency. After that then they can examine the numbers and tune accordingly. Also something needs to be done with guass barrel too.

  13. #73
    Strider/Doom/Cyclops
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    5,687
    BG Level
    8
    FFXIV Character
    Viper Beam
    FFXIV Server
    Balmung
    FFXI Server
    Quetzalcoatl

    While I would be happy to watch you start listing people who were actually kicked from their statics because DRG, I'd rather you reconcile:

    Quote Originally Posted by Niiro View Post
    they are completely unaffected by almost all fight mechanics, they can DPS from any direction, from any range, while moving*
    and

    *Obviously SE threw a big wrench in the equation by introducing WM and Gauss limiting their movement and disabling their auto-attacks
    Because at first glance, it looks like you've actually rebutted your own argument.

    If BRD and MCH are subject to caster restrictions, why don't they deal caster damage?

  14. #74
    Sandworm Swallows
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    7,158
    BG Level
    8

    Here's a good argument against mch, I groan every time I get one (and god forbid more than one) running duties because they do shit-all for damage and things die so much slower than having literally any other job along. I love the animations and the flair the job has but I don't even wanna take it to 60 right now because it's soooo oo oo ooo ooo slow D:

  15. #75
    Chram
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    2,740
    BG Level
    7
    FFXIV Character
    Helmut Lang
    FFXIV Server
    Excalibur

    This was a bit earlier, where I topped out. I was generally around 400~. (Sorry for the iphone blurry pic i was dps'ing with the other hand.)

    Zay was actually a DRK, Drago was a DRG and Veryn was a SCH. I wasn't paying too close attention to what Drago was doing, but I might have caught him at a bad moment.

    Not amazing DPS by any means. But this is the higher end of what I have been seeing in DF for 59 and under.

  16. #76
    Vuitton
    Guest

    What's the best way to use Gauss Round? It doesn't combo with anything, so? At least with Clean Shot you get 300 potency when it's comboed, versus the 200 Gauss Round. Just Gauss non stop when all your stuff is on CD?

    I've been wondering if LBs add to our Wildfire damage as well. I've tried popping Blood for Blood, Raging Strikes, and Reload/Quick Reload, but I don't have anyway of telling.

    One thing I do like about Gauss Barrel is that all combos are instant cast, as well as when Rapid Fire is on.

    I think we need to remember to account for our turret and DoT when calculating DPS as well. Our WSs are more powerful than BRDs when you take into account the turret, at least. Especially if it's been overloaded.

  17. #77

    Just here to say that I stopped coming WAR to 2.0 BCoB because 2.0 WAR was garbage. I don't know anyone who didn't make their DRG's change to MNK/something else except in the cases of people who aren't really the subject of this discussion anyway.

    I mean, I could have stayed WAR for 2.0 BCoB but that would have made literally every aspect of beating it harder than it was on PLD.

  18. #78
    Strider/Doom/Cyclops
    Join Date
    Jun 2007
    Posts
    5,687
    BG Level
    8
    FFXIV Character
    Viper Beam
    FFXIV Server
    Balmung
    FFXI Server
    Quetzalcoatl

    We've already had one MCH in our FC switch to DRG, for whatever that's worth.

  19. #79
    Nidhogg
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Posts
    3,553
    BG Level
    7
    FFXIV Character
    Amelia Diremii
    FFXIV Server
    Gilgamesh
    FFXI Server
    Cerberus

    I'm 59MCH and soon as it is 60, I'm going back to MNK. Tired of slow kills even on normal mobs. I wanted to love this class but this is FFXI's lolDRG with MCH all over again.

  20. #80
    E. Body
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Posts
    2,086
    BG Level
    7
    FFXI Server
    Quetzalcoatl

    Quote Originally Posted by Lebzile View Post
    I'm 59MCH and soon as it is 60, I'm going back to MNK. Tired of slow kills even on normal mobs. I wanted to love this class but this is FFXI's lolDRG with MCH all over again.
    I think MCH is more comparable to FFXIV's version of lolPUP on first release.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 4 of 19 FirstFirst ... 2 3 4 5 6 14 ... LastLast