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  1. #61
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    Quote Originally Posted by SathFenrir View Post
    I really don't think it will happen. I'm pretty sure they know full well what they're doing.

    If they nerf BST then everyone is fucked come post-november time. Would be 100% RIP any chance of getting shit done without at least 2-3 other actual people.
    Pup is actually pretty solid too. Pup bst and smn with a cor for pet buffs is the defacto party setup atm from what I see, sometimes a geo in the alliance too.

    SE needs to get with the times and give brd a pet buff song.

  2. #62
    Blue Magic is Best Magic
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    No, they don't need pet buff songs... When a pet can keep up with fully buffed DDs with GEO/COR, something is wrong.

  3. #63
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draylo View Post
    No, they don't need pet buff songs... When a pet can keep up with fully buffed DDs with GEO/COR, something is wrong.
    "When a DD job is the same as other DD jobs something is wrong."

    Oh, okay.

  4. #64
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    I know you must feel entitled to "defend" BST because you play it 24/7, but I'm sure you realize the difference. A DD that is prone to AOE's/debuffs, compared to a pet where its master can spam healing items and constantly spam WS's w/o caring about debuffs? Surely you see the problem there.

  5. #65
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    Quote Originally Posted by Draylo View Post
    Is this going to be the update where BST is nerfed?!
    That was last update. This time it's sam... oh who am I kidding it will probably be rdm

  6. #66
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    Any DD with a GEO and COR (as with BST) worth their shit isn't going to have to deal with most debuffs / AoEs either. It's called idris and vex attune.

    I absolutely do see the difference, but for 15 years you couldn't pay people to do anything with a BST, and now after a LOT of time and money invested, BST is a bit better than other options for some things. No "out of the box" bandwagon BST can do 90% of the shit you see us talk about. Hell, 18 bandwagon BST can't do 90% of the stuff we do with like 4-6 people. This isn't a "change job -> receive gear" scenario. I've watched what used to be the only other somewhat competitive endgame LS on my server slowly turn into an almost full BST LS in an attempt to emulate our success and still fail miserably. MISERABLY.

    And for most endgame content there are other alternatives that are better. That is unless you also have a problem with a sch geo and 3 blm being subject to 0 debuffs and aoes and spamming 40k magic bursts all over everything?

    Face it, as soon as content went above CL130, if you need to be near a monster to be useful and you don't have an Aegis, Ochain, or Idris Vex/Attune and a yagrush behind you, you became obsolete. Sorry, but that is life.

    Any issues you have with BST can be promptly directed at RNG burns and BLM burns which have existed and prevailed for the past decade and a half.

  7. #67
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    Bst doesnt need a nerf.

    Se just needs to pipe the fuck down on their AoE madness.

    Most high tier NMs tend to just spam shit that goes "oops your ded know lolololol"

    Tbh, bst isn't actually able to keep up with standard DDs still. Rudras storm spamming thf and dnc still seem to be top in terms of dps.

    Bst is popular because every piece of content SE puts out is chockful of deathga NMs that kill everyone, and though it is very possible to beat the monster with DDs, its so so so much easier to throw expendable pets at the mob instead.

    It is actually slower by a fair margin. With pet jobs only doing tonberry unity our kill time was about 1.5 minutes or so. Sometimes the tonberry would still get astral flow off.

    With the standard sam/dnc/thf/etc DD party set up with a bard in each pt and 1 geo we zerged the mob down in about 45 seconds on average, essentially killed the mob twice as fast.

    Bsts aren't on par with other DD jobs in terms of raw DPS.

    They just don't get instagibbed by stray AoEs.

  8. #68
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    Also, do you have any idea how fucking hard it is to deal with shit like Brimboil in a 6 man pet setup? Very fucking hard is the answer to that.

    Seriously, you guys see the successes, cuz that's what gets posted. You don't see the tremendous amount of time and effort that goes into making shit work with BST, when with a normal setup it's just "bring a SAM > SC & MB til dead" rinse / repeat since the game came out.

  9. #69
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    Still waiting for PupBuffs!

    Tramp is ready

  10. #70
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    I've played with many BST recently since its a huge bandwagon and I don't really read your posts. It has nothing to do with that, I know most of them don't even gearswap and are capable of parsing in the top 3. It's not one shot AOE's its the debuffs and sometimes straight up DMG with BST JA's. Why should I have special geo spells to lower my dmg just to avoid debuffs when a BST doesn't need it? Instead they can just smash away w/o a worry while I'm lowering dmg to avoid debuffs? BST isn't a "bit" better than other options, its one of the best and highly competitive with BUFFED DD's (brd songs AND geo/cor) and that is totally unfair. Take those buffs away and a BST will blow DD away on pretty much anything. They have gotten to the point where they completely eclipsed THF and yet THF was nerfed lol. Doesn't matter if they were rejected for content, its called balance and there's a reason everyone is jumping onto BST. It isn't only for solo reasons either.

    Seriously, you guys see the successes, cuz that's what gets posted. You don't see the tremendous amount of time and effort that goes into making shit work with BST, when with a normal setup it's just "bring a SAM > SC & MB til dead" rinse / repeat since the game came out.
    It isn't just "seeing" the successes, I've played with a bunch of them in different content. It's not fair all the effort I put into my DD jobs or other people only to have somebody who doesn't gear swap spam 50 claw cyclones or w/e that tiger does and 9~15k per cyclone. Then I get hit by slow/plague/fuckyou and the WHM is trying to take it all off while the pet is spamming its claw cyclones like mad. Not really hush hush as I'm sure SE is aware of it but its just a bit unfair atm.

  11. #71
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    If your damage is that much lower than a BST without gearswap I have some bad news for you...

    The problem isn't BST.

  12. #72
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    Only time I have said BST is OP, when I did Waraxe Beak Unity. And we had seven or so BSTs in the alliance. They killed it within 10 seconds of each pop

  13. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by SathFenrir View Post
    If your damage is that much lower than a BST without gearswap I have some bad news for you...

    The problem isn't BST.
    You are just trying to make it seem like its not a big deal so it doesn't get nerfed lol. They are aware of it I'm sure, and this isn't the official forums. We can discuss things here w/o pretending big bad SE is gonna nerf based on my posts. My BLU is top notch in gear and a BST can keep up w/o gear swaps and just sitting in augmented acro with JP/sic reduction timers.

  14. #74
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    I will admit gearing my bst to be useable took a LOT less effort than gearing ANY of my other jobs to be useful.

    Like literally all you need is shantotto pants, merlins axe, and one of the two delve 119 axes to help out. Everything else just makes you marginally better.

    Like I literally got those three items and was already able to handle unity fights on one jug. Once I got more gear it just got more pronounced.

  15. #75
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    I mean, if you want to go all in on pet jobs. It does take a lot of gil/sets unless you're lucky.

  16. #76
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    I'm only being partly facetious.

    Legitimately, I have 100% perfect Damage Taken- gear, far beyond the average BST. If I do not idle in it on any content that is even worth discussing, I get shitfucked to hell and back. I have the maximum reward set mathematically allowable in game, beyond even the other notable BST names around here and ffxiah, and I will STILL get shitfucked to hell and back. If I get caught by a TP move in my ready set I will get shitfucked.

    Legitimately, if you are playing with people who are not using gearswap and they are outdamaging you by so much and their pets are not permanently fucking dead, you should be doing better because it is purely trivial content. I'm sorry BST gets very silly on non-ilvl content. I agree with you, it does. I'm sorry that in the rare, rare occasion we can cap PDif on anything that matters, we will stomp all over you. But guess what, it doesn't happen often and it generally lasts only as long as bolster.

    The content you are doing where scrubs can fight shit with their pet and not have it die is not worth discussing. My ass clenches so tight I think I'm going to turn into a black hole when a T3 or vagary NM pops chainspell with my pet tanking and 30s left on reward. I seriously have to sit there and press zero buttons other than hit my pet mdt- set and just fucking pray, and usually if my pet doesn't die it's cuz reward came around with my pet at like 10 HP.

    I really can't help but laugh at you being so upset over obviously trivial content. As someone who routinely pushes the bounds of what can and cannot be done on BST, I think I have a pretty good idea of what my pet could survive if I just took off half my gear.

    Spoiler alert: it's nothing I would care that much about doing.

  17. #77
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    Hmm maybe they will add more ways to get heavy metal plates with any Voidwatch changes or Rhapsodies KIs.

  18. #78
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    But, waiting for PUP to be the OP job one day. Since, it is probably the least rewarding job. You have to skill up all the automaton frames and it is still weaker than BST and SMN by a great margin. Where they can just buy a Jug off the ah or use books to skill up their summoning magic.

    One thing that pup has going for it, in tank mode it takes like no damage

  19. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by stamos View Post
    But, waiting for PUP to be the OP job one day. Since, it is probably the least rewarding job. You have to skill up all the automaton frames and it is still weaker than BST and SMN by a great margin. Where they can just buy a Jug off the ah or use books to skill up their summoning magic.

    One thing that pup has going for it, in tank mode it takes like no damage
    PUP is no joke, especially as a tank. I have around pet enmity+40 in my tank ready set for BST and even after like 30k damage, in some events a cure IV will make the mob go running. One of the biggest discussions on the BST board on ffxiah that comes up is "how to keep every non-bst in my party from instantly eating shit in pet tank setups?"

    The answer is PUP. PUP holds hate over my tiger better than either of the burt/och/aegis PLDs I have access to, by far. That shit is no joke. Shame I am not close with any mythic PUPs with brains. This is just my experience with randoms in Escha. When you hold hate over me using Unleash with a GEO, I am surprised.

  20. #80
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    Quote Originally Posted by SathFenrir View Post
    I'm only being partly facetious.

    Legitimately, I have 100% perfect Damage Taken- gear, far beyond the average BST. If I do not idle in it on any content that is even worth discussing, I get shitfucked to hell and back. I have the maximum reward set mathematically allowable in game, beyond even the other notable BST names around here and ffxiah, and I will STILL get shitfucked to hell and back. If I get caught by a TP move in my ready set I will get shitfucked.

    Legitimately, if you are playing with people who are not using gearswap and they are outdamaging you by so much and their pets are not permanently fucking dead, you should be doing better because it is purely trivial content. I'm sorry BST gets very silly on non-ilvl content. I agree with you, it does. I'm sorry that in the rare, rare occasion we can cap PDif on anything that matters, we will stomp all over you. But guess what, it doesn't happen often and it generally lasts only as long as bolster.

    The content you are doing where scrubs can fight shit with their pet and not have it die is not worth discussing. My ass clenches so tight I think I'm going to turn into a black hole when a T3 or vagary NM pops chainspell with my pet tanking and 30s left on reward. I seriously have to sit there and press zero buttons other than hit my pet mdt- set and just fucking pray, and usually if my pet doesn't die it's cuz reward came around with my pet at like 10 HP.

    I really can't help but laugh at you being so upset over obviously trivial content. As someone who routinely pushes the bounds of what can and cannot be done on BST, I think I have a pretty good idea of what my pet could survive if I just took off half my gear.

    Spoiler alert: it's nothing I would care that much about doing.
    We were doing Escha actually and it isn't as hard as (gear wise) to keep up as you make it seem. A lot of jobs are capable of that complexity with different gear sets, so not sure where you are going with that. I didn't say they are outdamaging me by so much, I said they were keeping up when I'm fully buffed or sometimes with JA they were around 10% ahead. Also not sure how you figure I'm so upset? I'm simply stating my opinion like you are and others so maybe you are reading into it too much since you feel slighted.

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