October 2016 Version Update

[Fwahm]

I'm not sure why everyone is ragging on this set so much. They're all very good accuracy + STP pieces (even if not the absolute best for pure accuracy), and even when you don't need all of the accuracy, the head and feet are easily comparable with Reisenjima pieces (the head is better than mine, and I've put quite a bit of effort into my valorous head), and the hands are useful too if you haven't gotten really good reisenjima hands.

[Teryu]

Is there another way to get the update? I can't seem to download any of it and I did a file check and there weren't any errors.

[dasva]

I'm not sure why everyone is ragging on this set so much. They're all very good accuracy + STP pieces (even if not the absolute best for pure accuracy), and even when you don't need all of the accuracy, the head and feet are easily comparable with Reisenjima pieces (the head is better than mine, and I've put quite a bit of effort into my valorous head), and the hands are useful too if you haven't gotten really good reisenjima hands.

Head is nice but part of the flack it gets is sure it has some nice tp stats but like alot of these sets it leaves you seriously undercapped on haste making you have to get a bunch elsewhere diminishing whatever you got from those. Some other sets had other things to make up for it like dt/pdt or good ws pieces or didn't care about haste to begin with.

[Fwahm]

Heavy melee sets are undercapped on haste with just the visible slots anyway, so you need to get more haste elsewhere regardless. The haste isn't as low as on Sulevia +1, so you can splash in a couple Flamma +1 pieces and still hit 26% with an NQ/HQ Ioskeha belt, or a combo of 2 of Gracile grip, Sarissapharoi Belt, and Hasty Pinion +1.

[dasva]

I know that's why I said seriously undercapped. Gearing another 2-4 in is a bit easier than 10. Yes you can work around it still it will come at some cost and more work so people with already established gear sets are going to be like meh. And those are the people ragging on it and why. Similarly you actually can make sets that way overcap haste in just visible slots but not sure any are worth it or at least worth the effort (like quickly throwing stuff together I could make a good 35 on drk I think but it would be a horrible set lol)

And yes I know about suvelia hence my comment about other stats like dt...

[Fwahm]

So, the Poroggo's Quenching Hammer's damage is based on how many buffs you have on when you're hit, and he seems to no longer use it when he uses the tp move Providence (which pops the adds).

[dasva]

Like less dmg with more buffs?

[NynJa]

Probably other way around, like nullsong

[Fwahm]

More buffs = more damage. On N with 0 buffs, Quenching Hammer does about 200 damage and 600 MP damage. Add a single buff, and it does about 1000 HP damage and eats more than my RDM's max MP.

[dasva]

Hmmm guess the jump between N and D is just ridiculously huge since those first couple of 10-14k were done with as low as 2 buffs on D. Even my no buff 60 mdt autos were still taking 1-2k to whatever one shotted one of them 1 time.

hmmm unless geo trusts buffs count....


edit: yeah so something really fishy going on definitely more to it then that. Was doing consistent 1017 dmg to my cor mule with no buffs or dts on but no buff autos with decent amounts of dt were talking 1600-2k. Not quite sure why they also took a bit more but so far seems resistable and subject to the aoe dmg reduction

[Fwahm]

Normal geo buffs count, so I imagine trust geo buffs do, too. Normal buffs that it doesn't dispel don't, though, like food and reraise.

[Prothescar]

the only buffs that don't raise the dmg are Magic Shield (One for All, Magic Barrier, Rampart (tho the DEF boost will still buff it)), Maneuvers, and Food. Can also lock it from using hammer at all by not having any mages in the party unless we're just getting insanely lucky over here.

[dasva]

the only buffs that don't raise the dmg are Magic Shield (One for All, Magic Barrier, Rampart (tho the DEF boost will still buff it)), Maneuvers, and Food. Can also lock it from using hammer at all by not having any mages in the party unless we're just getting insanely lucky over here.

Sounds like luck unless cor = mage

So tried N... non main target auto with a ton of dt 1111 dmg everytime no buffs. Cor mule also no buffs 693 everytime I have no idea wtf is going on lol

[NynJa]

It could be based on the amount of MP aspired from the move, and it releases it as damage?

[dasva]

So turns out I was wearing a twilight torque. Took it off and it did 727. Put on a dark ring with 6 pdt and 3 bdt and took 726. This suggests that it's definitely magic dmg and total mp has some kind of inverse effect on dmg taken by it. This would explain why my mpless autos took decently more dmg than everyone else.

[Nyarlko]

Some of my observations on V1 so far, mostly on VE/E for ease of testing:

• Boss is immune to sleep and silence (including from WS and Ready.) Gessho has no problems landing debuffs (slow/para/blind.)
• Can confirm that geo trusts do increase damage from Hammer.. VE, Zero buffs = ~200-300dmg, with Sakura out = ~900dmg. Dismissing Sakura reduced the damage back to the 200-300 range.
• Utsusemi does not seem to count towards it, but is wiped by the aoe.
• Food, Reraise, maneuvers don't count and are not dispelled.
• Bard songs do count, and Scherzo does nothing. I think buffs are getting dispelled before the damage is dealt.
• Adds are sleepable, at least with pet-based sleeps. Shizuna slept 'em all with no problems, but seemed to take extreme damage (~5k while everyone else took ~300, and other jug pets were taking ~1/2 that) from hammer for some unknown reason... possibly attribute mod of either MND/INT? A dMND mod could explain why even fully buffed, Yoran-Oran was taking 90% less dmg than the rest of the party when I tried earlier.
• Horde Lullaby I/II were both fully resisted by all adds 3x each. My bard is not top-of-the-line, but shouldn't be having that much trouble landing it.. Can anyone confirm that Immunobreak is not required? Requiem/Elegy/Threnody all landed on boss with no problems.
• No noticeable difference in hammer damage based on current mp. Repeated uses after mp was depleted were all roughly the same dmg output as the initial one when the party still had full mp. Same observed results based on tp.
• If there are no party members that naturally would have MP from their MAIN job, then it partially locks Quenching Hammer and replaces it with Magic Hammer.. I've only seen it use Quenching once per fight while "locked" and at lower HP. When QH is locked, it will use Providence very early into the fight (usually the 1st TP move), so be ready for adds. Adds have en-poison/paralyze/silence/blind with a rather high proc rate, melee fast for rather low damage, and no TP moves. They seem to spawn agro'd to whoever the boss is on.
• Magic Hammer ignores shadows.
• There are exceptions to the above: BLU/DRK/PLD/RUN will all unlock QH, but SMN/BRD/NIN do not... Iroha2/Selh'teus/Qultdada do unlock QH. Trusts may be on a case-by-case basis, since Luzaf does not and COR player does not. I know BRD/NIN don't have natural MP, but can be considered "mages", so figured I'd note that. BLM/WHM/RDM/SCH/GEO also all unlock QH of course.
• GEO buffs are far more of a hinderance than a help for once, and have gotten MP hammered away before I can even get a luopan down every time I've tried... There is also a good chance that luopans may also suffer from the increased damage to pets that I've seen so far with BST and PUP.
• If QH is not locked, then Providence (AOE heal/regain that summons adds) appears to be timer based usage. 5min on VE, 4min on E, 3min on N observed so far. Does not appear to be related to HP as I've had it used at those times when it was ~90% and at ~10%.
• Boss spells/abilities all have SC properties. Water/WaterBomb<>Impact=Darkness, and I could swear I saw it do Light a couple times early this morning, but haven't seen it since then. Seems that Fire>MagicHammer=Light
• Primary mechanical differences between difficulties:
  
  • VE/E: Boss casts only single target elemental nukes (only seen fire/water III/IV/V) and Impact.
  • N: Boss replaces nukes with T3 -gas.
  • D/VD: I've heard it can cast Kaustra and Death, but have yet to live long enough to see either one.

[Byrthnoth]

Sounds like a fight for . . . DNC!

Are you sure it's increased damage for pets and not some kind of HP% damage?

How do you think a group like DNC x3, COR, BRD/WHM, SMN/WHM would fare? SMN can give Hastega 2 and Diamond Storm, BRD can give double mads, COR can go with Chaos/Samurai (or Hunter's if necessary). Between Waltz and Curaga 2/ballads, it should have enough healing, I would assume. Chaos Strike / Shock Squall might work well enough to stun the worst moves, if the frog is stunnable.

[Nyarlko]

Sounds like a fight for . . . DNC!

Are you sure it's increased damage for pets and not some kind of HP% damage?

HP% would not explain why players/trusts are taking 200-300 and pets taking 3k-5k with solid amounts of pet.dt-% >_>;; There is something else odd happening with them.

Also, yeah, if you go in w/ a zero-mage party so QH is locked, DNC should be able to whoop froggy butt AND handle cures, at least on VE/E. XD
PonderingPeter has no problems keeping everyone up other than when the boss decides to SC immediately after a Wild Carrot and charges are on CD.
The AOE output from N+ upgrade to -gaIII's though has me doubting they could keep up on higher difficulties...

[Byrthnoth]

Perhaps it bypasses DT? Pets have a lot more HP than players.

[Nyarlko]

Perhaps it bypasses DT? Pets have a lot more HP than players.

Again, that would not explain why players/trusts are taking ~5-10% of max HP damage, some pets are taking 10-20%, and some pets are taking ~50-80%.
DT-% is working properly for players, and even if you back it out, would still mean that baseline would be in the 10-20% range... Just doesn't match up for it to be a factor as far as I can tell. :/
The only ideas I can come up with to explain it (other than it being a genuine glitch) would be if there was: a huge dMND mod and certain pets (inc. RhymingShizuna & PUP autos) have pitiful MND, pets have literally negative MDB, or it was purposely designed to be anti-pet... Given those options, I'm hopeful and most inclined to believe it's a glitch ^^;;

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Answering your earlier question, that should be overkill on acc tbh >_>;; Accuracy is capped somewhere in the 1000-1100 range for VE. That is pretty easily reachable with OK-ish 119 gear and food, so 2x marches from that bard would do a lot more good than madrigals. I haven't been able to directly test if Magic Hammer works the same as normal, or if it does anything special, so whoever's tanking still might want to minimize number of buffs until sure that they won't hurt more than help. Should note that MH ignores shadows.... As far as general party comps go for this fight, then I'd say that damn near anything could work on VE/E as long as you are prepared to either deal with adds from the beginning, or deal with QH and possibly adds towards the end. I'd estimate ~110k hp, so if you can tear it down in less than 4min via melee, it might actually be safer/faster to purposely leave QH unlocked.