Final Fantasy XIV: Stormblood - June 20 2017

[Lucavi]

Let me guess: pure hybrid DPS?

quite clear indeed

Magical and physical DPS is still hybrid DPS. >_>

Too bad those things really don't mean anything in ARR.

[Alkar]

Let me guess: pure hybrid DPS?

quite clear indeed

It's reflected in the playstyle of the job. Heck, the weapon itself is a rapier that turns into a staff and the job is obviously capable of both melee and magic abilities.
If you wanted a healer/DPS hybrid I don't know why you were waiting for RDM, SCH is already in the game.

[Shenrien]

Magical and physical DPS is still hybrid DPS. >_>

Too bad those things really don't mean anything in ARR.

Every class is capable of melee auto attacks so every caster is basically a hybrid by your standards.

[Spider-Dan]

If you wanted a healer/DPS hybrid I don't know why you were waiting for RDM, SCH is already in the game.

Let's try this again:

For all we know RDM has spells with properties of both, dealing damage and recovering HP/MP status at the same time.

You are alternating between insisting that RDM is a pure DPS and saying maybe it also has support functions too!

By the logic you are using, BRD and MCH are also pure DPS.

[Alkar]

I'm not. Black mage is a pure DPS with access to Lethargy, Apocastasis, Physick, Virus and Eye for an Eye. It's capable of supporting the group in some way while being a pure DPS.
For all we know some Red Magic may have multiple properties but the main focus of the job is to deal damage.
BRD and MCH have actual support skills that nerf their damage output.

[Damane]

I have mixed feelings about RDM being a pure DPS class :/

[Rionel]

Every class is capable of melee auto attacks so every caster is basically a hybrid by your standards.

Except RDM is probably going to do meaningful auto attack damage with their sword compared to an AST card cutting or a BLM staff smacking by example. I think that meaningful damage is the difference maker here, not to mention RDM is clearly designed to get up close and personal with melee weaponskills + gap closer so there's that too!

And yeah, MNK, a supposed pure selfish DPS type, has access to Mantra.
NIN has Goad, Smoke Screen, Shade Walker, all very supportive abilities.
DRG's Battle Litany.
SMN's Battle Res + Super Virus, Eye for an Eye.

I'm pretty sure every DPS is designed with some sort of support ability to aid the party in some way.

And for all intents and purposes, BRD + MCH might as well be pure DPS. It's not like their numbers are significantly lower than the other damage classes- they just have 2 AoE MP/TP regens for either downtime in a fight, progression, or if somebody fucked up. So long as the situation never calls for BRD/MCH to play MP TP regens during a fight's uptime, they're pretty much the same as any other DPS. And stuff like Foe's / Hypercharge don't affect their damage, so those might as well be in the same vein as Battle Litany / Trick Attack.

Honestly, the healers might as well be Healer/DPS hybrids considering the huge focus on damage FFXIV has. Being able to heal the whole party + deal as much damage as a tank role is pretty powerful, and DPS checks in this game don't even consider healer damage output- so it's going above and beyond the fight designs as well.

[Lucavi]

Every class is capable of melee auto attacks so every caster is basically a hybrid by your standards.

Well if the white damage was any good, a bigger case could be made for a hybrid. I suppose the melee special attacks could all be physical unless a spell was cast in conjunction.

Damage is damage in this game, which was the main point. No pesky resistances to get in our way or cause further divisions in what constitutes a good DPS or not.

[The Stig]

I suspect RDM will get a Clemency type spell as a throw back to their White magic capabilities. They might tie it behind an ammo system (ala SCH/SMN), or make it cost massive MP, so you can't purely replace a healer, but will be as effective as a PLD self Clemency-ing itself in insignificant content. Like PLD you may occasionally save the day but those are far and between

[Voyage1970]

Damage is damage in this game, which was the main point. No pesky resistances to get in our way or cause further divisions in what constitutes a good DPS or not.

I agree with you but there are certain circumstances where the distinction matters like which Hypercharge you use or whether Foe's is up and while I can't recall it being an issue recently there were those mobs in Turn 4 of First Coil that took damage specifically from only certain types of attacks and reflected all others. In fact I wonder if they'll take into account the fact that while pure Physical or pure Magical DPS get the full benefits from their respective debuffs a "hybrid" damage class wouldn't since they deal split damage.

If you have a BRD why would you take RDM over a BLM or SMN since part of their damage won't be boosted by 10% and vise versa for MCH. I suspect damage from RDM will still be purely magical but the "hybrid" aspect will be that a few of it's Chain skills will require you to get close. Auto-attacks won't even factor in since you'll be In > Out before it will matter if the vague job demonstration was any indication.

[solracht]

For the red mage's job design, since they fight with a rapier and a magicked crystal medium, is the rapier treated as a physical attack?

Yoshida: Well, physical is physical. It's hard for me to say more, there are a few things keeping me from answering this right now (laughs).

...

Is red mage a pure DPS or is it support?

Yoshida: It's a pure DPS.

...

I was surprised to find out that red mage was a DPS, I thought it might have been a healer.

Yoshida: It was something we had to consider since the original red mage is able to use both black and white magic, so we wouldn't have been able to use it without making it unique to FFXIV. To make red mage we had to distill about half of it, while retaining the essence of the design. Since FFXIV is an independent entry into the series, I think this will become a new kind of red mage.

So do you intend to put something like "red magic" used by red mage?

Yoshida: It's still hard to say (laughs). If we have all these different types... white, black, red... I think it would be really confusing. That said, I think it's still a bit early on to talk about which type of magic red mage will use. Now that we're beginning to work on implementing the actions, there will be a lot of changing, adding, and removing during the process, so I think we'll discuss it more after we have something more concrete.

...

How will red mage's auto-attack work?

Yoshida: You can auto-attack, but like I said we'll be going silent for a while. We'll have a mechanism incorporated so that there isn't much of a damage loss when you're at a range, but that's all I can say for now.

.

[Voyage1970]

So then that leaves the previous question, why would you take a Split damage job over a pure damage job when damage specific buff/debuffs exist?

[Alkar]

So then that leaves the previous question, why would you take a Split damage job over a pure damage job when damage specific buff/debuffs exist?

I don't think we have enough information to rule out RDM just yet. For what it's worth BRD is gonna see some substantial changes so it may not even be an issue in Stormblood.

[Karbuncle]

So then that leaves the previous question, why would you take a Split damage job over a pure damage job when damage specific buff/debuffs exist?

Think you're thinking too outside the box with this. Its FFXIV, Its going to fit into a role that other classes have established. It'll either be a DD with some gimmick-but-not-really-useful thing that'll fill a role similar to MNK/NIN/etc, or it'll be a "Pure DPS" in the same way MCH and BRD are pure DPS.

My guess with this "Pure DPS" nonsense is just poor language barrier and them really trying to get across "This will not be a hybrid Healer class, it will not be a "Support" class, its a DPS and its abilities will reflect that". They're trying to nail in its not going to be a jack-of-all-trades like old RDM, that its a DPS, it will fill a DPS roll. It'll have one-off abilities that make it "feel" RDM, like spell casting and (I guess) battle raise to fill a "White Magic" and "Black Magic" quota to actually fit it being a RDM, but outside of that, DPS.

My guess is It'll probably just be a beefier BRD/MCH to support its needing to be in Melee range sometimes, but will probably be as powerful as either of those with its own unique little "support" options.

Edit: Done clarifying and editing.

[Prothescar]

Yoshida said somewhere that the 2nd job has something to do with spider webs.

[Hioki]

My guess is It'll probably just be a beefier BRD/MCH to support its needing to be in Melee range sometimes, but will probably be as powerful as either of those with its own unique little "support" options.

My guess with this "Pure DPS" nonsense is just poor language barrier and them really trying to get across "This will not be a hybrid Healer class, it will not be a "Support" class, its a DPS and its abilities will reflect that". They're trying to nail in its not going to be a jack-of-all-trades like old RDM, that its a DPS, it will fill a DPS roll. It'll have one-off abilities that make it "feel" RDM, like spell casting and (I guess) battle raise to fill a "White Magic" and "Black Magic" quota to actually fit it being a RDM, but outside of that, DPS.

You were likely correct in your prior statement. If Yoshi P said it's a DPS then the question would be, "What kind of DPS?". Using "Pure DPS" removes out BRD/MCH and places the job closer to the MNK/DRG camp. Especially since it's a repeated phrase and not just a one off. They might have a support ability(as in 1/2 major raid CD's) but their primary focus will be DPS.

[Karbuncle]

You were likely correct in your prior statement. If Yoshi P said it's a DPS then the question would be, "What kind of DPS?". Using "Pure DPS" removes out BRD/MCH and places the job closer to the MNK/DRG camp. Especially since it's a repeated phrase and not just a one off. They might have a support ability(as in 1/2 major raid CD's) but their primary focus will be DPS.

By "Pure DPS" I'm trying to say its just poor language choices in them trying to clarify it will not be a pseudo-Healer or Support class like RDM could fill in previous roles. Don't they still classify BRD and MCH DPS?

[Lucavi]

Yoshida said somewhere that the 2nd job has something to do with spider webs.

ITS BLU! BLU HAS COCOON WHICH, IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT, IS LIKE A MASS OF SPIDER WEBBING AND.... uhh...

Yeah that kind of fizzled out. Nevermind.

[Hioki]

By "Pure DPS" I'm trying to say its just poor language choices in them trying to clarify it will not be a pseudo-Healer or Support class like RDM could fill in previous roles. Don't they still classify BRD and MCH DPS?

I think they use Ranged DPS for their position clarity. (Ex. When setting up duty finder groups). Generally if they don't call them by the jobs directly, they will call them DPS without any adjectives or Support when talking in reference to the jobs themselves. (Ex. Live Letters).

You have 3 groupings of DPS, ninja is a position of it's own due to having a lower damage cap but still providing significant support.

MNK, DRG, BLM, SMN - Pure DPS
NIN - Hybrid DPS
BRD, MCH - Support DPS

[Silenka]

Spider webs....webs...

Strings...

oh god it's puppetmaster