When you say their it makes it sound like you are talking about more than one... and well each one actually changes so that might be why you see the difference. Looking back I found and once again Tarowyn grabbing stuff from jp wiki lol.
When you say their it makes it sound like you are talking about more than one... and well each one actually changes so that might be why you see the difference. Looking back I found and once again Tarowyn grabbing stuff from jp wiki lol.
Also, it doesn't appear to be mostly "new" information, as it's been known by a large portion of the playerbase for years. It just takes someone who hangs out on this side who also knows moonrunes who is also willing to bridge the language gap for us to find out too. I put a large part of the blame on how little of the official information has been officially translated into English.. JPs were getting official guides until recent years, Famitsu articles, actual direct communication between players and devs, etc.
So starting to port over specific mob stuff starting in order (should make verification further testing easier). Link is on first page and will try to post the original jp notes along with my translations unless they are pointless. (like some just say hey subspecies have similar stats as main which is obvious based on the numbers). Or already very well known info
Scowlenkos (Ahriman)
Spoiler: show
Vanguard (Dynamis Ahriman)
Spoiler: show
Doom Lens ( Past Ahriman)
Spoiler: show
Akvan ( Red Ahriman)
Spoiler: show
Om'aern (Aern)
Spoiler: show
Absolute Virtue (Aern)
Spoiler: show
2017-09-26 17:32 #26Ridill
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2017-09-26 22:53 #27Old Merits
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Here's a txt file of a current rip of the raw GTrans'd database. I was kinda planning on cleaning it up like Dasva did for the above entries, but wasn't sure if it was needed or exactly what I should do to it.
Link here
What format would be best to make it simpler to import the data into the wiki?
Should I use element names (ie: "Fire") or keep the skillchain element names like in the source (ie: "Liquefaction")?
Is it worthwhile to clean up the notes for non-impacting information (ie: beetles have a lot of the species they are patterned off of listed)?
Would an Excel spreadsheet be easier to work with for whoever is importing it into bgwiki?
2017-09-27 10:50 #28Ridill
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Oh nice that would be a bit easier than going thru the page with translate up lol. Damn there's more than I realized
No idea on the wiki part. Personally anything easily read though it's not really ready for wiki. Confirmation aside going to see how this correlates to resistance and possibly if we need to make a separate table for monsters on wiki for that part.
I think elements would be better. I understand why they wanted to do skillchain names but probably more intuitive to use element seeing as it can deal with things when you're not even skillchaining and for multi element skillchains.
I personally don't see the point in half those notes. It looks like a lot of it is the fluff they put on old wiki and other half is putting to words what the numbers already say. I'd only really do the stuff the stuff that presents new game impacting information
2017-09-27 12:39 #29Relic Weapons
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Weren't you the one going on about how bats weren't weak to wind?
"For instance, on bats which are 130% Fire 150% Wind 130% Lightning 150% Light, if you do Atonement -> Resolution, the Light skilchain damage becomes wind damage (Wind has the higher priority of the two 150% elements)."
2017-09-27 13:48 #30Ridill
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First this is new stuff based on. Both in terms of being known but also only been a feature in the game at least to this extent to where it could really be tested like this for a couple of years
Second not sure what that conversation was about but it most likely was either to do with resistance or dmg modifications. The first may be correlated may not requires further testing but there are at least some differences given how Rayke effects it but doesn't effect the elemental resistance while things that elemental resistance in the past would change the priority but some implication (but not explicitly stated) it doesn't know. The 2nd it does but only skillchain dmg and only since the update but fair enough I guess...?
2017-09-27 14:01 #31Relic Horn
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When they implemented the Skillchain update, SE said in the notes that the damage a monster takes from a Skillchain is directly correlated with their personal relative elemental resistance, so while we don't know the specifics of the correlation, bats taking 150% wind skillchain damage does mean they have a significantly lower than normal resistance to wind.
2017-09-27 14:07 #32Old Merits
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The numbers given for elements are actual elemental resist numbers. They used skillchains to determine how the system works and what the values are. Most of the fluff notes are just flavor notes basically. For example, knowing what species beetles are based on doesn't have any impact on gameplay, but still can be fun to know. It might be a good idea to steal the pics too for some mobs since certain entries seem to have variances based on model/location.
Entries in the list are not English alphabetical order unfortunately. They are organized by family in "alphabetical" order using the Japanese hiragana order. I don't feel like reorganizing the entire list, so I'm going to leave it in that order. Entries were copy/pasted in the order they have them in.
I'm almost done with my first pass on the list to clean up stuff like zone names and proper conversion of katakana mob names. Decided to go with skillchain element names for the resists since that won't change things like "Fire Elemental" for importing into the wiki later. I'll link later to both a full copy and a no-notes copy JIC that's easier to work with for importing into the wiki.
2017-09-27 14:25 #33Relic Weapons
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Playing the game for over a decade and killing countless bats made it self-evident to notice things like bats having the lowest resistance to wind and light, I mean the 20% macc bonus you get over from their next weakest elements (fire, thunder, etc.) isn't even eyeball territory anymore when you mostly play mage jobs, it slaps you in the face when your macc is low enough and you get resisted on everything but wind (light nukes aren't generally used on mage nuking jobs so yeah) Same with blue acuex and fire, when the high level blue acuex were first introduced in the gates zone, most people had extremely low macc compared to their magic evasion due to their high level, and it wasn't a coincidence that fire landed much more consistently than ice on them, even though ice also did extra damage if it went unresisted. You slaughter enough of them for capacity points and you learn what works best because it's pretty obvious, 50% less resistant in this case is no joke
So yeah it's nice to have these things confirmed since some people refuse to believe common enemy elemental resistances
2017-09-27 14:55 #34Old Merits
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Elemental Priority sequence: fire > ice > wind > earth > thunder > water > light > darkOriginally Posted by GTrans
Resist table, high to low, left to right: 5%/10%/15%/20%/25%/30%/40%/50%/60%/70%/85%/100%/115%/130%/150%
For Bats:
Base resists are: fire 130%, wind 150%, thunder 130%, light 150%
Performing a 2-step Light sc (which has all 4x light-side elements) picks out wind as the damage type dealt since wind is higher in the elemental priority list than light.
Performing a 2-step Fusion sc (fire/light) deals light damage, then bumps up the resist tiers for fire and light by one. Light is already maxed, but fire goes up from 130%>150%. Continuing that Fusion with a Light sc results in the light sc being fire damage since fire is now equally maxed, but is higher in the priority list than wind and light.
These changes to resistances are also stated to reset after the resulting MB window closes.
Odd note, not sure if it was previously known, but they say that "Pixie Hairpin +1" affects dark-element sc damage. O_o!
2017-09-27 14:57 #35Ridill
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So they did. Though SE also mixes terms sometimes... what we need to know how much that means and how that relates to things that visibly effect said elemental resistance
You do realize this isn't saying 20% macc bonus right? Just that the skillchain dmg is 15% higher than the next elements and that it based on old update notes it depends on resistances. Exact conversion is up in the air (though there is probably some testing on that as I seem to remember some automaton macc testing that accidentally found some differences in elemental resistance.). It could very well be eyeball territory hell part of what makes eyeballing so bad is because it covers a large territory and humans have a tendency to focus on certain things more than others. Even more so when the difference it makes highly depends on how much your macc already compares to mobs meva. But go ahead have your I was right about what I saw moment
2017-09-27 15:04 #36Old Merits
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The values they are listing are the actual resistance percentage/numbers, which they used the skillchain system to determine. It's not just listing skillchain damage.
Since it's also stated that if the target's resist value is 50% or lower, then it guarantees a resist, I'd also say that it definitely has an impact on macc as well.
2017-09-27 15:05 #37Relic Weapons
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2017-09-27 15:39 #38Ridill
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Since you both have made similar post I'll just do 1 response. Here's the thing we know they are related but no where in this entire thing does it attempt to say how they are related and what that difference means and even ignoring conversion rates which could easily exist it could mean many things and who knows what the baseline is though 100% seems logical. Does it mean this wind has 50 less meva than a neutral element? Given most resistance base things use macc/meva equation this seems likely but wont translate straight into resist percentages. Does it work like resist traits and is separate? Super unlikely as it'd mean never landing shit regardless of macc/meva. Does it have 50% less meva to that element than one at 100%? Or does it just convert some unseen elemental resistance to meva at a 50% rate? Good luck testing either but holy fuck the difference that would make would likely be crazy.
As far as the guaranteed "resist" remember it also says 1/16 which doesn't even exist unless it's new to so 99% sure they mean sdt instead but they didn't have a term for it like we do. Be pretty easy to test so maybe can do that tonight
2017-09-27 15:47 #39Ridill
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This is actually in the OP. Though now seeing you do it it's funny they used that example since it has light already maxed so it isn't actually an example of both resistances going down. Should also note it says further multi step skillchains don't stack. Also apparently the arrows didn't copy over so fixing that
As far as Pixie idk if it specifically was known but it's generally accepted pretty much all magical multipliers outside of mdb/mab work on it. If you think backwards it kind of makes sense since the best way (and I think the original way when it was originally done) to determine what element a skillchain is without this chart would something like obis/elemental staffs
2017-09-27 17:10 #40Old Merits
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Here's the link to the cleaned/no-notes version. There are just as many useful notes (extra abilities, gimmicks, NM strats, etc) as there are flavor/useless ones. Gonna take me a while to clean up the useful notes, so don't expect it soon. ^^;;;
I know it was in the OP, but it was somewhat hard to read with no delimiters between percents. I was just trying to clarify a bit more in case anyone else was doing constant double-takes besides me. I think they used bats to specifically point out how the priorities work. Since light starts off maxed, it can't go any higher, and the 3step changes the priority from wind to fire, so it makes a solid example.
Specifically, I've never heard that any gear outside of "Skillchain Bonus+" actually affected skillchain damage, so it's definitely news to me that Pixie+1 can pump up Dark based sc damage. We'll have to find a target that is weakest to dark damage in order to test. EDIT: OR... just use Compression on anything that has dark 100%+ baseline.