Time for FFXI "Classic"?

[Draylo]

So why do you even play then if you feel its so bad and not even worth the sub price? A little hypocritical if you ask me. It is obviously fun in some aspect or you wouldn't be bothering. It isn't mobile game terriority lol, most of the rewards youre talking about aren't that important. The AH and unity chat thing only gives silver vouchers where are for a lottery BCNM lol.

[D44kpunk]

So why do you even play then if you feel its so bad and not even worth the sub price? A little hypocritical if you ask me. It is obviously fun in some aspect or you wouldn't be bothering. It isn't mobile game terriority lol, most of the rewards youre talking about aren't that important. The AH and unity chat thing only gives silver vouchers where are for a lottery BCNM lol.

Just for posterity, does the lottery BCNM give some of the rarest/best equipment in the game?

It's ok, you can tell the class. Explain how FFXI has basically become pay to win by having more mules/characters to do their daily logins.

[Gredival]

All the top players on Gilgamesh multiboxed. It really wasnt anything special. I dont think Carb took too kindly to it though, cause after the merge, a lot of people seemed to think multiboxers were inherently shit players.

I mean... you don't multi-box on anything that qualifies for big game hunting. Multi-boxing was for people stuff solo. By default, not HNMLS players.

[Draylo]

By that logic, FFXI was always pay to win. You could have 6 characters, each doing ENM (something I did in the past, but with two) and get a ton of haguns and sell them. This game always rewarded having more characters, it only exploded from Abyssea onward because SE placed a ton of things like that where more chars = more profits. ANY mmo is like that, even in FFXIV you can benefit from having more than one character. I don't get what your point is that it somehow makes FFXI bad.

I mean... you don't multi-box on anything that qualifies for big game hunting. Multi-boxing was for people stuff solo. By default, not HNMLS players.

Uh, wrong? I mean, bots existed back in 75 days that helped heal etc. I remember very vividly dual boxing sky for pops and sea etc. HNM LS used multi-box characters set up with bots to claim. Everything benefitted from it and a lot of people did it. Although most did it in secret because multi-boxing was looked down upon out of jealousy.

[D44kpunk]

By that logic, FFXI was always pay to win. You could have 6 characters, each doing ENM (something I did in the past, but with two) and get a ton of haguns and sell them. This game always rewarded having more characters, it only exploded from Abyssea onward because SE placed a ton of things like that where more chars = more profits. ANY mmo is like that, even in FFXIV you can benefit from having more than one character. I don't get what your point is that it somehow makes FFXI bad.



Uh, wrong? I mean, bots existed back in 75 days that helped heal etc. I remember very vividly dual boxing sky for pops and sea etc. HNM LS used multi-box characters set up with bots to claim. Everything benefitted from it and a lot of people did it. Although most did it in secret because multi-boxing was looked down upon out of jealousy.

That still requires doing something with the characters you paid for.

Getting ENM access, clearing the ENM.

I think your hatred has blinded you if you don't see the difference here in just paying $1 more a month and logging in to get insane advantages.

[Draylo]

Well to use those mules for the silver vouches, you would have to get them to level 99 and do all the effort it takes to get them there. That would take some time with missions etc so it is not effortless.

I don't agree with the hand-outs in form of login campaigns or the goblin box etc, I always hated those. However, to say that FFXI is like a mobile game seems silly because there were always benefits to having more than one character.

[Inactive]

I mean... you don't multi-box on anything that qualifies for big game hunting. Multi-boxing was for people stuff solo. By default, not HNMLS players.

Half our LS, and many in other LS's multiboxed all HNM content. Folks always had at least 1-2 multiboxed RDM/WHM/BRD at any given event, it wasn't that rare to have people passing accounts around when folks weren't logged in to make sure we filled out all our groups. Maybe we were in the minority, but it seemed like most LS's did something similar

[NynJa]

I mean... you don't multi-box on anything that qualifies for big game hunting. Multi-boxing was for people stuff solo. By default, not HNMLS players.

What garbage is this? lol You think people werent multiboxing faf or tiamat? Cmon lol

Stunbots easilly
Curebots were feasable
A bard was feasable to multibox, especially if they were in the stun party. Just ballad/march over and over.

You could multibox a DD job too.

[Gredival]

I mean we had people with alternate accounts. No one ever dual played characters at events, HNM or otherwise, besides maybe a Bard soul voice rotation

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[Draylo]

You keep using your personal experiences as the absolute truth. Multiple people are telling you that LS's had sold drops and that they also have multi-boxers. I don't think you remember ye olde 75 days as well as you should.

[D44kpunk]

You keep using your personal experiences as the absolute truth. Multiple people are telling you that LS's had sold drops and that they also have multi-boxers. I don't think you remember ye olde 75 days as well as you should.

You're doing... the exact... same...

You're talking about different eras though, people didn't start dual boxing much until late into the 75 era. A decent amount of people played on PS2/xbox, and a further amount of people didn't use windower or have a PC capable of dual boxing. Gearswap and react didn't play the game for you, even if you were decent at the game playing 2 critical roles was challenging at times. Bots weren't nearly as mature as they are now.

Would people dual box the 75 era now if a classic server was made? Yes, they would. But you don't get benefits for simply having a mule like you do in this current era.

[Inactive]

I think that's why these debates quickly become pointless, because people can only speak from their own perspective or what they perceived to be true of those around them.

Some people dual boxed everything, others had 40 people in their LS. Some people camped and loved kings, others hated it. Some people praise lv75 as the golden age, others Abyssea/VW, and some enjoy the game now. Everyones so emotionally charged and attached to their view we can't even have a civil back and forth without name calling and raging lol

[Draylo]

The only one name calling and raging is D44kpunk, everyone else is being civil and debating like sane people.

[Gredival]

Oh I do remember something we multi-boxed for frequently. Odin feathers so that we could have consistent weekly Odins using feather mules.

You keep using your personal experiences as the absolute truth. Multiple people are telling you that LS's had sold drops and that they also have multi-boxers. I don't think you remember ye olde 75 days as well as you should.

I'm not using them as absolute truth. I'm using my personal experience, across three servers and three HNMLS, to show that practices you considered uniform and ubiquitous were not so. And again, selling Black Belt items is not the same as selling the actual treasured drops from Kings (Adaberk, Ridill, Dramatica, and to a lesser extent N. Legs and N. Head).

Hell, I merc'd BB items from KS99s in a non-HNMLS.

[Inactive]

You basically just said 'I'm not using my experience as absolute truth, but my limited experience makes my truth more true than yours'

What am I missing here

[Gredival]

I'm contesting the fact that "HNM items were sold all the time" with my experience that it was extremely uncommon for them to be sold on three separate servers I was on.

That doesn't mean it didn't happen, it just means that it was uncommon in at least three servers (Asura, Quetzacoatl, and Sylph).

What am I missing here?

Also, worst case scenario, if the gear was sold... doesn't that defeat the argument that HNMLS made getting certain drops impossible? If you could buy them, then it was just a matter of farming the gil to pay your mercs. Which is no different from any of the other endless grindfest snore content you say makes 99 great. (Note this is would be a negative for me about 75 but takes out a negative for you all against 75)

[Kanriel]

I'm contesting the fact that "HNM items were sold all the time" with my experience that it was extremely uncommon for them to be sold on three separate servers I was on.

That doesn't mean it didn't happen, it just means that it was uncommon in at least three servers (Asura, Quetzacoatl, and Sylph).

What am I missing here?

Also, worst case scenario, if the gear was sold... doesn't that defeat the argument that HNMLS made getting certain drops impossible? If you could buy them, then it was just a matter of farming the gil to pay your mercs. Which is no different from any of the other endless grindfest snore content you say makes 99 great. (Note this is would be a negative for me about 75 but takes out a negative for you all against 75)

The main for why I prefer 99 to 75 is because I can go out and actually get to utilize my character and fight something if I so choose. 75 is about standing around and waiting for something to even happen. I get to actually play the game and enjoy the progression of my character these days.

[Gredival]

And then my argument is that, again, everything in FFXI (or any MMO) gets put on farm status with good enough allies and gear once the strategy is worked out. PW and AV were the only content that was not an auto-grind snooze fest.

Given that, World Spawns were exciting in a way that instances (Salvage, Dynamis, Limbus) and pop item farming (Sky, Sea) were not. Because it was competitive and there was at least SOME thrill in the claiming portion and in the progression of your Linkshell.

In addition to my argument that artificial server-locked zero-sum rarity is good. And that progression, at least at the highest levels, should not be a given for every player in virtue of simply playing and paying a sub fee.

[NynJa]

Given that, World Spawns were exciting in a way that instances (Salvage, Dynamis, Limbus) and pop item farming (Sky, Sea) were not. Because it was competitive and there was at least SOME thrill in the claiming portion and in the progression of your Linkshell.

You've never been to an Ullikummi camp and it shows.

[Gredival]

I'm an Asura OG. We had the original gilsellers in Sky thanks to Dblock. Before HNMLSes could cockblock me on Hecatomb Cap/Subligar, they were blocking me on Mitts and Greaves (and everyone else on Haidate). That's where my overcome all obstacles mentality came from. I didn't let gilsellers block me from Sky gear, wasn't going to let "bots" stop me from getting King gear.

During a 13hr camp, one of them said "If we dont kil the Ullimi we havent rice to eat" to us to try make us leave.