Unji + Unsho =

[Lockecole]

Lockecole: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think Raja's gives anywhere near 11 TP a swing, I don't even think it's 10.5. And even if it did, it would still take 10 attack rounds to reach 100TP. You can't WS on 99%.

Its AT LEAST 10.5, on so many occasions Ive gotten 11TP, and Im almost positive its everyother set of swings you get 11TP (granted this was with Sunji/Fudo, maybe less delay is less TP). And its pointless to say that you can't WS at 99%. Dont count from 0, count from the amount of TP you get after a Jin, which is on average 12 (maybe more?). 8 rounds of attacks = 88TP, 88 +12 = 100. It has the potential to get you 100% TP an extra set of attacks quicker...and if anything it gives you more TP when you do eventually WS. More TP = higher % to crit. Really you can't go wrong.

[Rasengan]

I beat you to it.

[Lockecole]

I beat you to it.

Serves me right for being so long-winded. Lemme test this real quick on some mobs outside of Tavnazian Safehold.

OK! I'm back.

Well I did some tests with 18% Haste in gear, Senji/Unji and Senji/Fudo. Basically both give the same exact TP so Unji wins out in that it breaks the TP floor even more.

Well Store TP +5 means exactly that. A 5% increase in TP. I tested how much TP it takes to get the first increase above 5 per swing and it is the 4th swing. Basically every 4 swings you get an extra TP.

I tested this by unequipping my katanas on and off until I had a double attack proc on the first set of swings. When all 3 would connect even /w Rajas Ring I still only got 15TP. So you can conclude from that, that you get LESS then 5.33 (repeating of course) from each swing. I then just swung normally 2 times, then another two times, which resulted in..you guessed it, 21TP. So taking from this, essentially each swing is somewhere between 5.32 and 5.25 TP per swing. I think we can assume its EXACTLY 5.25.

It takes 20 swings to get 100 TP without Rajas Ring. You never, ever get more then 5TP per swing as long as I tested with Senji/Unji. It takes 19 swings to get 100 TP with Rajas Ring. (5% increase.) Taking into consideration that you probably would have a 95% hit%, it essentially does let you Jin one set of hits quicker starting from 0 TP. But...people dont start from 0 TP, they start from w/e TP they get returned from :Jin.
So let's test that.

12TP return from Jin. Next set of swings result in 23 TP back. Including those it takes 17 swings to hit 102 TP. If you have a 15TP return Jin...youd be able to use your TP at 16 swings...essentially one set of swings sooner then without Rajas Ring if you had a really high return Jin.

12TP. 10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10,10. You'd need 9 set of attacks, or 18 swings in order to hit 102 TP....again 1 more swing then with Rajas. So essentially, playing into the fact that you'd have 95% accuracy, it indeed would let you :Jin one set of attacks quicker.

I hope any of that made sense.

[kisada]

one thing i would like to try is dual HQ snipers and hope torque (if that's the katana one), but until i have all 3, or feel like trying something else, i'd rather just stick to sushi.

I'm sorry but I can't see under any circumstance replacing Rajas Ring. The amount of DoT it adds and TP (lets a NIN break the 5TP cap by giving between 10.5-11 [I think I recall 12 also? maybe that was WAR] TP per set of attacks) will counterbalance the 7 acc of a Snipers anyday.

well, my point was that if you could have 90% accuracy with dual HQ snipers, the damage increase you'd gain with meat would be much more substantial than anythign rajas ring would have to offer. i.e. if you're eating meat you'd need as much acc as possible, even if you had to give up the rajas.

rajas stats would be a very weak substitution to the 100+ attack bonus(guesstimate of coeurl) from meat and the 7 accuracy you'd get from that particular combination. you gotta remember, i'm making a speculation on situations in which you'd be able to eat meat and maintain a high accuracy rate on exp monsters.

[Miruka]

Ninjas swing in sets of two, so if you count the minimum # of attack rounds to reach 100%TP or higher is still the same whether or not you wear a Raja's. It's also impossible to get a 15 return Jin, as even with a Raja's you'll only get a 14 return Jin when you double attack with both hands within the WS and don't miss anything. 5+1(DA)+5+1(DA)+1+1.

That said Jin is pretty wiffy (completely missed a DC with Gorget once, whooosh LAWLS) so Raja's does probably give a faster Jin every now and then. I had no idea it was +% TP as well for Store TP, thanks for the memomemo. =p

Kisada: Attack bonus for Ninjas with Bison or Hedgehog hovers around 75(non-berserked) to 90.

[Lockecole]

Ninjas swing in sets of two, so if you count the minimum # of attack rounds to reach 100%TP or higher is still the same whether or not you wear a Raja's. It's also impossible to get a 15 return Jin, as even with a Raja's you'll only get a 14 return Jin when you double attack with both hands within the WS and don't miss anything. 5+1(DA)+5+1(DA)+1+1.
That said Jin is pretty wiffy (completely missed a DC with Gorget once, whooosh LAWLS) so Raja's does probably give a faster Jin every now and then. I had no idea it was +% TP as well for Store TP, thanks for the memomemo. =p

Kisada: Attack bonus for Ninjas with Bison or Hedgehog hovers around 75(non-berserked) to 90.

Underlined
Thats assuming you have 100% hit percentage. Not saying its guaranteed but it is possible that the extra TP, incase you missed a swing, would get you to 100% one set of swings quicker.

Bold
Isn't it also possible that you get extra TP for :Jin with Rajas Ring? I noticed alot higher TP Rampages when using Rajas Ring, and I almost am positive Ive seen a 15TP :Jin before.

5.25+1.25(DA)+5.25+1.25(DA)+1.25+1.25 or something to that extent. Im not sure if anyone else can back me up on this, but Im almost positive Ive seen a 15TP :Jin. I play WAR 90% of the time I merit, so don't take my word entirely on all of this, just throwing things up in the air.

[Demetrios]

You probably got hit by something and it was really a 13% Jin

[Ankiseth]

I have gotten at 15% Jin before. In fact, 60%+ of my Jins now give 13 TP return (which sorta pisses me off) because of the 6 Store TP from Rajas and Brutal Earring. It just so happens that one of the hits combined with the Store TP makes the return 13 instead of the usual 12. Add on 2 double attacks and there you have it, a 15 TP return Jin.

Of course I think it has only happened once, but it is possible with the way the Store TP works.

[DrObvious]

Ninjas swing in sets of two, so if you count the minimum # of attack rounds to reach 100%TP or higher is still the same whether or not you wear a Raja's.

Since double attack may proc on only one hand, that's not true. Any possible combination of double attacks which would end up at 19 attacks in n-1 attack rounds instead of n attack rounds would get 100 tp sooner.

[NynJa]

Ninjas swing in sets of two, so if you count the minimum # of attack rounds to reach 100%TP or higher is still the same whether or not you wear a Raja's.

Since double attack may proc on only one hand, that's not true. Any possible combination of double attacks which would end up at 19 attacks in n-1 attack rounds instead of n attack rounds would get 100 tp sooner.

ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I'm not a nin, but I've seen plenty of 4-hit attack rounds

[DrObvious]

Ninjas swing in sets of two, so if you count the minimum # of attack rounds to reach 100%TP or higher is still the same whether or not you wear a Raja's.

Since double attack may proc on only one hand, that's not true. Any possible combination of double attacks which would end up at 19 attacks in n-1 attack rounds instead of n attack rounds would get 100 tp sooner.

ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

I'm not a nin, but I've seen plenty of 4-hit attack rounds

Where did I say that you can't get double attacks on both hands? I was replying to the comment that "ninjas swing in sets of two" when you can have a set of 3 swings.

edit:

If I was saying what you thought I said it would have read: Since double attack only proc[s] on only one hand, that's not true.

[Lyramion]

I have gotten at 15% Jin before. In fact, 60%+ of my Jins now give 13 TP return (which sorta pisses me off) because of the 6 Store TP from Rajas and Brutal Earring. It just so happens that one of the hits combined with the Store TP makes the return 13 instead of the usual 12. Add on 2 double attacks and there you have it, a 15 TP return Jin.

Of course I think it has only happened once, but it is possible with the way the Store TP works.

Or maybe you got 13 TP and the enemy snuck a hit in on you for 2 TP?

[Koyangi]

I'm sorry, I've never seen a jin give 15 back, I own both of those items as well.

[Ankiseth]

I did say it was rare, and I have gotten it whenever an enemy as not hit me, and I am certain of this because I did go omgwtf and say it on my LS.

[Raineer]

and I am certain of this because I did go omgwtf and say it on my LS.

you win

[Kwechi]

It feels like with crit weapons it only affects the actual katana and not both. So with senj main hand you get 6% crit hit on 3 hits instead of 3 hits with only 3% crit.

This would make sense considering the way Enhancing sword works. The enspell damage+ is only for the ensword, not the other hand during dual wield.

For the record, I sold the pos long ago.

[Awoir]

It feels like with crit weapons it only affects the actual katana and not both. So with senj main hand you get 6% crit hit on 3 hits instead of 3 hits with only 3% crit.

This would make sense considering the way Enhancing sword works. The enspell damage+ is only for the ensword, not the other hand during dual wield.

For the record, I sold the pos long ago.

Buzzard tuck works the same way, coulda tested that for 1/100 the price

[Sefier]

:O

http://img223.imageshack.us/img223/2797/kunocard1lg.png

[Kwechi]

It feels like with crit weapons it only affects the actual katana and not both. So with senj main hand you get 6% crit hit on 3 hits instead of 3 hits with only 3% crit.

This would make sense considering the way Enhancing sword works. The enspell damage+ is only for the ensword, not the other hand during dual wield.

For the record, I sold the pos long ago.

Buzzard tuck works the same way, coulda tested that for 1/100 the price

It was a drop actually, and instead of keeping it and paying the other 5 their split, I sold it and paid everyone after coming to the conclusion that martial is in fact better.