Weapon skills where Double Attack can proc.

[Plow]

1) First 2 hits count as full TP.

Tell that to my scythe ><

Or maybe it does on dual wield/hth but not single attack weapons?

[weeee]

well i feel really stupid now.
I will have to redo my tests with faith bank to see if they can proc on WS.

I been using asuran as a test on my girlfriend character never noticing any DA proc`s. Ill go try it with raging fists :s

Fun Note:
Techinically you can get 24+ TP return from thf btw, but its kinda cheating, and depends if you count the off hand as part of your ws if you /nin.
(9 from DE + 5 Offhand->14+10(offhand due to the triple proc)>24) this shows up 0->24. But like I said, some people dont count offhand as part of the WS.

I have never seen my thf get over 24 though. So yes the 16 tp makes sense. since your getting the tp from ws itself without offhand maxing to 2 total hits. which is kind of stupid meaning, we can only get a DA twice on a thf or TA once?

never realised this until this thread. got me thinking.

[Maxxthepenguin]

1) First 2 hits count as full TP.

Tell that to my scythe ><

Or maybe it does on dual wield/hth but not single attack weapons?

Yes, its how many normal hits in a normal 'combat round.' If we somehow get triple wield it will return as 3 hits.

Ohe thing you guys fail to mention is that it seems, to me at least, like double attack additional hits don't do 'ws hit' damage but instead additional damage like a normal swing (there is a big difference.) I noticed this with /war spinning slash (was for a merit pt where I needed the DoT and TP gain of /war but the chaining of SS. Dont mess with me, it was the right choice.)

[Slott]

Stilgar wrote:
No WS can go above 8 hits.

Hmm, maybe that's why we thieves never see more than 16 TP return on Dancing Edge.

Edit: To clarify, I mean THF/NIN's with 5 TP daggers. Normal Dancing Edge gives 14 TP (6 hits because of dual wield). Dancing Edge with 1 Triple Attack proc gives 16 TP (8 hits).

wrong, I've hit 18% tp at least 10 times(probably alot more), and I even got 20% tp return once, was 2500 damage dancing edge from the front on some EM sea mob (no sa or ta) and no, not an open mouth hpemde.

However getting 18% or 20% is really rare, and no I did not get hit for that 2% more tp.

[Maxxthepenguin]

Stilgar wrote:
No WS can go above 8 hits.

Hmm, maybe that's why we thieves never see more than 16 TP return on Dancing Edge.

Edit: To clarify, I mean THF/NIN's with 5 TP daggers. Normal Dancing Edge gives 14 TP (6 hits because of dual wield). Dancing Edge with 1 Triple Attack proc gives 16 TP (8 hits).

wrong, I've hit 18% tp at least 6 times, and I even got 20% tp return once, was 2500 damage dancing edge from the front on some EM sea mob (no sa or ta) and no, not an open mouth hpemde.

However getting 18% or 20% is really rare, and no I did not get hit for that 2% more tp.

Possibly Triple Attack breaks this, but not double attack.

[Not Kuno]

Spirit Taker can DA. 8)

[Slott]

sneak attack > spirit taker is the fucking win for smn. Can keep fenrir out, pact and never put him away when farming lol

[Slott]

Possibly Triple Attack breaks this, but not double attack.

This is possible. Ive only seen tp returns of 15, 16, 18, and 20 (15 once i got my brutal earring) - never 17 or 19

[Okgo!]

well i feel really stupid now.
I will have to redo my tests with faith bank to see if they can proc on WS.

I been using asuran as a test on my girlfriend character never noticing any DA proc`s. Ill go try it with raging fists :s

Fun Note:
Techinically you can get 24+ TP return from thf btw, but its kinda cheating, and depends if you count the off hand as part of your ws if you /nin.
(9 from DE + 5 Offhand->14+10(offhand due to the triple proc)>24) this shows up 0->24. But like I said, some people dont count offhand as part of the WS.

I have never seen my thf get over 24 though. So yes the 16 tp makes sense. since your getting the tp from ws itself without offhand maxing to 2 total hits. which is kind of stupid meaning, we can only get a DA twice on a thf or TA once?

never realised this until this thread. got me thinking.

No. Chances are you just had another attack round after you WS'd and got 14 back on the WS + 2 normal hits(10). = 24 TP.

Stilgar wrote:
No WS can go above 8 hits.

Hmm, maybe that's why we thieves never see more than 16 TP return on Dancing Edge.

Edit: To clarify, I mean THF/NIN's with 5 TP daggers. Normal Dancing Edge gives 14 TP (6 hits because of dual wield). Dancing Edge with 1 Triple Attack proc gives 16 TP (8 hits).

wrong, I've hit 18% tp at least 10 times(probably alot more), and I even got 20% tp return once, was 2500 damage dancing edge from the front on some EM sea mob (no sa or ta) and no, not an open mouth hpemde.

However getting 18% or 20% is really rare, and no I did not get hit for that 2% more tp.

No, again. Most likely you got a triple attack proc on the WS and then got hit by some kind of double attack from the mob. 16 + 2 = 18, and 16 + 2 +2 = 20. Hm, which daggers were you using though?

Max TP return a thf/nin will get is 16tp from WS with a triple attack proc. I got my brutal earring a month or two back and have noticed quite a few 15tp returns(double attack proc), and of course many 14tp returns(normal).

There's been a few times playing around with my M.Kris, I'll end up with 40+tp seemingly right after the WS, I know that is no where near possible return, I just got lucky with a main hand triple, and a M.Kris normal attack (usually 2-3) right after DE. It all just happens so fast because of haste/march/gear etc.

Now that I think about it though, maybe using two harpe type daggers(no clue why anyone would, but I've seen it) + brutal earring and raja's ring, your tp per hit might get raised, and your overall ws return upped.

I'm gonna have to go play with this a little while and see, but I kinda doubt it. Obviously the delay isn't worth the pitiful extra tp return on ws, if this is what's happening.

So, to sum it up.

Thf/nin.

Normal = 14%
Double Attack = 15%
Triple Attack = 16%

Thf/war.

Normal = 9%
Double Attack = 10%
Triple Attack = 11%

[Not Kuno]

sneak attack > spirit taker is the fucking win for smn. Can keep fenrir out, pact and never put him away when farming lol

I do that too sometimes, but I use war sub occasionally because berserk/warcry/DA spirit takers pwn ass, and you dont have to wait for the 1min sneak attack.

[Slott]

Slott wrote:
Quote:
Stilgar wrote:
No WS can go above 8 hits.

Hmm, maybe that's why we thieves never see more than 16 TP return on Dancing Edge.

Edit: To clarify, I mean THF/NIN's with 5 TP daggers. Normal Dancing Edge gives 14 TP (6 hits because of dual wield). Dancing Edge with 1 Triple Attack proc gives 16 TP (8 hits).


wrong, I've hit 18% tp at least 10 times(probably alot more), and I even got 20% tp return once, was 2500 damage dancing edge from the front on some EM sea mob (no sa or ta) and no, not an open mouth hpemde.

However getting 18% or 20% is really rare, and no I did not get hit for that 2% more tp.


No, again. Most likely you got a triple attack proc on the WS and then got hit by some kind of double attack from the mob. 16 + 2 = 18, and 16 + 2 +2 = 20. Hm, which daggers were you using though?

Max TP return a thf/nin will get is 16tp from WS with a triple attack proc. I got my brutal earring a month or two back and have noticed quite a few 15tp returns(double attack proc), and of course many 14tp returns(normal).

There's been a few times playing around with my M.Kris, I'll end up with 40+tp seemingly right after the WS, I know that is no where near possible return, I just got lucky with a main hand triple, and a M.Kris normal attack (usually 2-3) right after DE. It all just happens so fast because of haste/march/gear etc.

Now that I think about it though, maybe using two harpe type daggers(no clue why anyone would, but I've seen it) + brutal earring and raja's ring, your tp per hit might get raised, and your overall ws return upped.

I'm gonna have to go play with this a little while and see, but I kinda doubt it. Obviously the delay isn't worth the pitiful extra tp return on ws, if this is what's happening.

So, to sum it up.

Thf/nin.

Normal = 14%
Double Attack = 15%
Triple Attack = 16%

Thf/war.

Normal = 9%
Double Attack = 10%
Triple Attack = 11%

I never got hit. I get 18% tp returns often. You can see it from the massive damage itproduces compared to a normal 14 or 16% ws. And yes, I've jumped out of dancing edge w/ 45% tp before, but you can tell because you can see hey 6 damage hits just went off under my ws. At 18% or 20% neither happened, and I only got 20% once. The damage was huge, how else could you explain it? 2500 on a standalone dancing edge?

and 18% can definitely happened, its happened enough times with the high enough damage to back it up. No i don't have screenshots at this time but next time it happens ill ss it.

edit: that quote came out fucked up but gets its point out. -,-

damage goes up significantly compared to a 16% hit so it's not like im just seeing the tp number going up alone.

[Okgo!]

Which daggers then?

I've never seen anything like that and have been 75Thf for close to 2 years, you say you've seen it at least 10 times? Maybe it's just ungodly rare, and you've been really lucky with it.

Otherwise it sounds like a hpmede opened it's mouth right as you DE'd, then it hit you twice.(I know you said it wasn't this, but that's what it looks like to me)

edit-I'm not flaming, I'm genuinely curious.

[weeee]

No. Chances are you just had another attack round after you WS'd and got 14 back on the WS + 2 normal hits(10). = 24 TP

as far as I am concerned the offhand hit on ws can triple giving you extra 10tp and is there when the ws is done. hence 0->24 popping up instead of 0->14->24. I might be wrong.

[Krandor]

At last check offhand hits can't Double Attack or Triple Attack.

Alot of times you can basically attack right after you WS and you won't even see the number change from 12>22 (using Jin as an example, since i see this all the time) because it happens so fast. Between when I hit my WS macro and the Animation goes off I will end up getting 2 hits in, even though those hits register as after the WS in terms of TP growth (also you won't see these hits animate because your character is locked into the WS animation).

[Maxxthepenguin]

At last check offhand hits can't Double Attack or Triple Attack.

Where the fuck did you get that information, I've seen loads of WAR/NINs attack twice at once

[Okgo!]

At last check offhand hits can't Double Attack or Triple Attack.

Where the fuck did you get that information, I've seen loads of WAR/NINs attack twice at once

The thread is on double(triple) attack procs on WS's, pretty fucking obvious he meant it can't double(triple) on offhand WS hit.

[aurik]

Uh, 14TP jins have a double attack on both main and offhand.

[Nagamaki]

You can have DA and TA kick in on the same WS as THF/WAR with Brutal. Not positive about it working on DE (mainly use THF in Limbus for SC and placebo TH), but on Shark Bite it works quite well.

Its not super common, but with TA merits and Brutal its nor horribly rare either.

For HTH you can get 2 DAs as /WAR with Brutal also, I've seen it on RF DK and FH, probably works on everything but Asuran like everything else. Sig pic is a 13% (11+1+1) FH on MNK/WAR with coeurl/serk/focus/1 boost.

[Vinen]

you wouldn't.

sorry no, just no. Double attack gives you a lot more added damage than one hit missing costs you. I'm pretty sure it's a well noted fact that DA was removed from asuran, mabye one of out pre-RoZ players can chime in.

lawl Asuran was added post NA release... and since NA release came after RoZ release lawl

[Krandor]

Uh, 14TP jins have a double attack on both main and offhand.

I guess I'll be getting an angry tell from you later on today.