Decriminalizing or legalizing marijuana, what do you think?

[Shaede]

Cut the bullshit.

"Its health benefits are bla bla bla bla"

"Studies have shown bla bla bla"

"Social ramifications bla bla bla"

YOU JUST WANT TO GET HIGH, FOR CHRISSAKES.

The world won't end if pot is legalized, but it won't really get any better, either.

Actually, I never have or never will use pot. But thanks for the assumption. Maybe this reflects the generalizations you're also coming to in this issue?

[Brendam]

Drugs are bad for you, go away!


fucking pot heads i swear

qft

Honestly, whats the point of smoking? None. There is no reason to smoke unless its for medical reasons. Its stupid, waste of money and just makes you dumber than you already are. Grow up, get a job, pay bills, get a family and stop living in mommys basement getting high because youre too depressed to go out side.

Diffrent; honestly I believe the government should but a HUUUGE tax on cigs and alcohol. It may get people to quit, and if it doesnt? More money to get us out of the hole $ wise. I can just sit back and laugh while people pay outrageous prices for silly things such as these.

Horrible argument. Maybe you dont see anything in smoking... but maybe I do, your tryin to impose your views on others who just dont give a shit to listen to someone with a fucking horrible argument.

I can't believe how poorly worded and how obviously little that response was thought out. Stop smoking, moron.

Um, since when was it that the length of a response is more important then the actual words in it? Maybe I dont care for long drawn out answers, as long as what I mean gets across.

[vudoodoodoo]

Selling pot in stores = tax money for the government. No more drug dealers running around making tons of money tax free.
They already do the same thing w/ cigarettes and alcohol.

[Ashen]

Comparing a video game to a chemical addiction is a joke. Go talk to a few meth addicts in rehab and see how fast you get punched.

We're talking about pot, not meth. Pot has no physically/chemically addictive properties, it's only "psychologically addictive" (AKA ITS FUN. Seriously, anything that makes you happy or releases endorphins is "psychologically addictive"). Plus methadone IS legal. It's used in the treatment for heroin addicts.

And you guys need to get a definition on addiction. Addiction doesn't just mean "wanting something really badly," it means your body now has grown a necessity for the chemical. Alcohol is a good example of an addictive drug because people in the later stage of alcoholism experience things like hallucinations, delirium tremens, and such if they haven't had any alcohol.

[Paralyzed]

It can mean both.

ad·dic·tion ( P ) Pronunciation Key (-dkshn)
n.

Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance: a drug used in the treatment of heroin addiction.
An instance of this: a person with multiple chemical addictions.

The condition of being habitually or compulsively occupied with or or involved in something.
An instance of this: had an addiction for fast cars.

While the aftereffects of quitting FFXI or any other game when you're addicted aren't as bad as quitting heroin or some other illegal substance, it still doesn't make it not an addiction.

Obviously addiction to the internet and games can lead to death as well. I mean how many stories have we heard about Asians who die at one of the Internet parlors because they were so addicted they couldn't even sleep?

[kareface]

We're talking about pot, not meth. Pot has no physically/chemically addictive properties, it's only "psychologically addictive" (AKA ITS FUN. Seriously, anything that makes you happy or releases endorphins is "psychologically addictive"). Plus methadone IS legal. It's used in the treatment for heroin addicts.

It is not as addictive as other drugs, but what you just said is a common misconception.

For years, proponents were convinced that marijuana had no addictive properties mainly because there were no scientific evidence refuting their claim.

Many important functions of the brain, which dictate our behavior, involve dopamine. It is known that highly addictive drugs such as cocaine and heroin interfere with this dopamine and alter the individual. Hence, the abuse potentials of drugs are measured on the extent to which they interfere with dopamine regulation (i.e. production, release, or re-uptake). Dopamine is believed to be a neurotransmitter associated with the brain reward system, which is responsible for pleasure sensations. An integral part of this system is the mesolimbic pathway in which the nucleus accumbens of the limbic system produce dopamine.

The proponents of marijuana believed that cannabinoids did not act on the mesolimbic pathway. They believed that cannabinoids did not act on the dopaminergic synapses. Today we know that this is not the case. Experiments have shown that delta-9-tetrahydrocannabinol (delta-9-THC), the major active chemical in cannabis (cannabidiol and cannabinol are also prominent ingredients of cannabis plant), does increase the extracellular concentrations of dopamine in the "shell" [the nucleus accumbens consists of a "shell" and a "core" which is distinct from one another anatomically and histochemically (Pontier et al. 1995)] of nucleus accumbens (Tanda et al. 1997; Diana et al. 1998). Tanda et al. found that delta-9-THC utilized the same pathway as that utilized by opioids, such as heroin which utilizes the opioid receptors. It was found that heroin and delta-9-THC utilized the same opioid receptor, mu-1, which eventually causes the increase in concentration of dopamine in the nucleus accumbens. Diana et al. also found similar results concerning the dopamine concentration increase in response to delta-9-THC. The administration of this chemical along with a synthetic cannabinoid agonist (WIN 55212,2) produced a dose-related increase in the firing rate in dopaminergic neurons. From such experiments, the claim that marijuana has no effect on dopamine concentration can be refuted.

From current knowledge, one may assume that marijuana does have some addictive qualities but are limited in its potencies. Hence they should not be classified with some of the most addictive drugs of today. With the information acquired, one may infer that cannabinoids act upon dopamine by an indirect route. Cannabinoid neurons interact with the opioid neurons, which, in turn, stimulate the release of dopamine by another indirect connection to dopaminergic neurons. Advances in the characterization of cannabinoid receptors have revealed that there are cannabinoid receptors in the ventromedial striatum and basal ganglia, which are associated in the dopamine production, but no cannabinoid receptors were found in the dopaminergic neurons (Axelrod et al. 1998). Therefore, among the most controversial addictive drugs, cocaine and amphetamine, which are dopaminergic stimulant, have direct access to the increase of dopamine. Opioids, such as heroin, utilize a more indirect route through the mu-1 receptor. And cannabinoids are the least direct in their action (Tanda et al. 1997). This may be a reason why the addictive properties of cannabinoids are much more limited than cocaine, for example. Though delta-9-THC has been proven to have the neurochemical functions characteristic of an addictive substance, one must realize that marijuana is not a "hard" drug and should not be categorized with such drugs

I took this from a recent study done at Berkeley University. In the study they did note that not all tests done pointed to chemical dependence. So being addicted to weed can literary be on a case by case basis. None the less there is potential for addiction.

[thestalkmore]

Drugs are bad for you, go away!


fucking pot heads i swear

qft

Honestly, whats the point of smoking? None. There is no reason to smoke unless its for medical reasons. Its stupid, waste of money and just makes you dumber than you already are. Grow up, get a job, pay bills, get a family and stop living in mommys basement getting high because youre too depressed to go out side.

Diffrent; honestly I believe the government should but a HUUUGE tax on cigs and alcohol. It may get people to quit, and if it doesnt? More money to get us out of the hole $ wise. I can just sit back and laugh while people pay outrageous prices for silly things such as these.

Horrible argument. Maybe you dont see anything in smoking... but maybe I do, your tryin to impose your views on others who just dont give a shit to listen to someone with a fucking horrible argument.

I can't believe how poorly worded and how obviously little that response was thought out. Stop smoking, moron.

Um, since when was it that the length of a response is more important then the actual words in it? Maybe I dont care for long drawn out answers, as long as what I mean gets across.

Where did I say that the length of your response was insufficient? Moron.

[Okan]

I was wondering where you said that myself... It's probably the weed the guy has been smoking.

[Ksandra]

I guess the biggest difference between smoking cigarettes and doing pot, is that though smoking cigarettes is bad for person's health, it does not impede their better judgement. I keep thinking of this Darwin award, about a man and a woman who smoked pot while staying at a hotel. They thought it would be a great idea to sleep under the stars that night...ontop of the hotel roof. When the man woke up in the morning he found out his girlfriend had fallen and died (they didn't realize that the roof of the hotel was REALLY slanted).

I guess it depends on how much governement involvement people feel they want to have. Let's face it in that humans are a stupid race, and we do a lot of dumb things. Is it up to the governement to try and portect others from stupid people, and even protect people from themselves? Or should we leave it up to our own choices?

TBH, I'm surprised that whenever the debate about cigarettes vs. pot comes up, poeple don't talk about alcohol at all. Now don't get me wrong, I love my red wine *swoon*, but if we're to say that pot/cigarettes do severe damage. What about the amount of car accidents that happens every day from drinking and driving? When I think of pot being legalized, even if they say "not allowed to drive" how with the car accident death rate be effected? That thought kinda scares me. Often if you give people a small opening, they rip it right open.


Sorry if I'm a bit incoherent, XD I'm tired but my static wanted to continuing doing CoP stuff, so trying to stay awake lol.

[Paralyzed]

IMO Cigarettes are worse than pot in the sense they kill people who don't even smoke. Same could be said about alcohol though. Why is it that very rarely does the drunk person never die in a crash, but the person/family he hits always do? Lots of irony in that. I guess it depends on the amount taken, but I don't think pot nearly impedes judgement as much as alcohol does. Maybe I'm mistaken?

In all honesty I would rather have cigarettes and alcohol banned instead. It sucks watching your family and friends die slowly from it.

[Anyway]

IMO Cigarettes are worse than pot in the sense they kill people who don't even smoke. Same could be said about alcohol though. Why is it that very rarely does the drunk person never die in a crash, but the person/family he hits always do? Lots of irony in that. I guess it depends on the amount taken, but I don't think pot nearly impedes judgement as much as alcohol does. Maybe I'm mistaken?

In all honesty I would rather have cigarettes and alcohol banned instead. It sucks watching your family and friends die slowly from it.

That really isn't true. It's just you wouldn't hear about a drunk driver getting killed and a family surviving. It's not gonna boost ratings.

[Plow]

here goes... absurdly long post warning...

THC is much worse then the carcinogens in cigarettes.

No... just no... people willing to just out and say things like that are the reason for so many of the problems in the world... Your D.A.R.E. teacher is a big, dumb, liar, sent to scare you away from drugs, k?

Secondly, my dad has this theory that it is not legalized because the government can't figure out a way to tax it and won't make any profit from it.

A lot of us believe the prohibition was brought on by cotton farmers (read: the real builders of modern america), because hemp is flat out a better product. Just... an idea.

As far as taxing it goes, it would be the same as alcohol and tobacco...
You realize they go so far as to force companies to add poisons to rubbing alcohol and ethanol fuels, etc, in order to make it so you can't go to the drug store and buy a gallon of everclear for 2 bucks, right?

First, Mary jane is already legal in a lot of states in small amounts. You can have it in your posession on your personal property, you just can't smoke it in public or travel with it(yeah, i know). It is legal for medicinal purposes and is supplied by the government, and is a lot better than any schwag crap you'll get on the street, i garauntee you.

There are still federal laws against it, and federal organizations do still fuck with people in the places where local laws are more lenient.
There are also several places where it's legal to posess pot, but not to buy it, grow it, or travel with it.

The really funny part is that in even MORE places, the pot itself is tecnically legal to buy and sell, and taxable, but is still not legal to actually posess.(The higher crime for selling in these states is "Possession with intent to distribute", rather than distribution, even if you're actually caught in the act of distribution.) This is actually quite common as many states were beginning to tax it as the prohibition came into effect. (And yes, you can still technically walk into... wherever you'd walk into... with a big bag of pot and get tax stamps that prove you've legally come into possession of it, and supposedly somehow they can still arrest you but can't take your pot lol... the last part there is probably mostly urban legend heh)

I ran a business for 3 years. In that time I had to deal with alot of kids dealing/smoking weed around the store. I'll tell you this, as long as there are assholes that steal, fight and vandalize over that drug I'll personally always shoot down making it legal.

If it was legal those kids would get it at your corner store for 3 bucks a pack and the only people that would have to steal/etc for it are the people that already are for cigarettes, alcohol etc.

I've heard 100 times that all the problems will be fixed if we legalize it. But that is a best case scenario being presented by the people supporting the act. The simple fact is: Responsible people will use it responsibly. Irresponsible people can fuck there life over with it. Expanding the market will only make increase the instances of this truth. People and children especially don't understand how powerful addiction is.

Just out of curiosity, how many beers do you drink per week? Do you consider yourself a "responsible drinker?" How would you feel if alcohol were again prohibited, due to "irresponsible drinkers?"

Honestly, whats the point of smoking? None. There is no reason to smoke unless its for medical reasons. Its stupid, waste of money and just makes you dumber than you already are. Grow up, get a job, pay bills, get a family and stop living in mommys basement getting high because youre too depressed to go out side.

What's the point of cigarettes? What's the point of drinking? What's the point of gaming? What's the point of sports? What's the point of living?

Diffrent; honestly I believe the government should but a HUUUGE tax on cigs and alcohol. It may get people to quit, and if it doesnt? More money to get us out of the hole $ wise. I can just sit back and laugh while people pay outrageous prices for silly things such as these.

Why not do the same to pot? That way we'd be putting stupid amounts of money into helping out with the debt, instead of helping John Dealer get by without a job.

You're not saving money well by getting Cal Ripken Jr.'s 1982 rookie card or adding that car to your train collection.

That's what my parents said when I tried like hell years ago to get them to buy a Mickey Mantle rookie card for $5,000, which has recently sold for 6 figures.

Horrible argument. Maybe you dont see anything in smoking... but maybe I do, your tryin to impose your views on others who just dont give a shit to listen to someone with a fucking horrible argument.

You're entirely right, "What's the point" is an absolutely terrible argument.

Comparing a video game to a chemical addiction is a joke. Go talk to a few meth addicts in rehab and see how fast you get punched.

Comparing pot to meth is a joke. Go tell Bob Sagget you're addicted to pot.

People don't experience physical pain when they quit POT. They don't break out into sweats or fever over not smoking a bowl. You can still ruin your life with drug laws.... They are addictions but in a diffrent category then physical based dependencies. If you look how humans react when they suffer from real drug dependencies, It is no diffrent then a lab animal. They will NOT stop using drugs even when they realise their life is in danger or they run out of the drug itself. I know kids that steal things worth 20$ from stores and resell them for 5$ so they can pay for more meth. I'm sure people have stolen from stores so they can pay off there FFXI bill, and tons of people steal cable.

You can't really compare the 2.

fix'd

Pretty bad, actually. What are the social ramifications of it being illegal? Are they more positive or more negative? I don't think the answers are as simple as black and white or this topic wouldn't have been of such interest for the the quite time it has been.

Exactly, I don't think pot has ruined the life of anyone I know, but I know a number of people who have suffered and changed dramatically because of pot laws. Can't pass your drug test for the probation you got for smoking that joint, if you keep smoking? Hmm, maybe coke will be fun, it's out of your system in plenty of time.

I keep thinking of this Darwin award, about a man and a woman who smoked pot while staying at a hotel. They thought it would be a great idea to sleep under the stars that night...ontop of the hotel roof. When the man woke up in the morning he found out his girlfriend had fallen and died (they didn't realize that the roof of the hotel was REALLY slanted).

Yeah, any my sister's boyfriend's friend knew this guy that stuck a sheet of acid in his pocket and sweated and absorbed it and thought he turned into an orange and is in an asylum and... right.

In all honesty I would rather have cigarettes and alcohol banned instead. It sucks watching your family and friends die slowly from it.

That's a hard statement to hear, because I don't want it banned, but I can totally see and feel where you're coming from. Time for my actual experience yay! (I knew this was gonna be a loooongass post ><

First off I'm 24 years old. I'm a pothead. No ifs, ands, or buts, I smoke a lot of pot. I've tried about everything, and been through some real addictions, but now all I do is smoke pot.

I used to drink a lot, but I was one of those guys that would get all drunk and be like "let's go find us a fight!" So yeah, that, combined with the fact that in the "in between" stages of drunkenness, I just felt like a retard so I'd just get trashed and.. yeah. I decided it was best for me to stay away from alcohol, my sister was an alcoholic at the time, and one of my grandpas had been an alcoholic and made my mom's childhood very rough. I've also been through some pretty seriously tramatic shit not involving alcohol, and altogether it just added up to a pretty serious fear of spending my life "in the bottle."

Anyway, throughout my experience with the "drug culture," I've seen it all. I've known people that did insane amounts of acid and cocaine and you can tell it the moment you see em. I've known people that would rob their own pregnant cousin for money for meth, despite the fact that weeks earlier they were good friends, and had been torn apart by them staying up for weeks on meth while the cousin was trying to create a normal life. When I quit drinking, I actually lost a fair amount of friends because I just wasn't out there, getting trashed and being crazy all the time. I talk to the person who used to be my best friend once every couple months now, because all he wants to do is get retarded drunk, and having a sober person around doesn't fit into the picture. I moved away from the town I was going to college in eventually, and rarely hear from the people up there now.

So much of the drug culture carries an us against them mentality... no doubt heavily contributed to by the drug laws.

But guess what? I have friends that don't smoke pot, lots. I've even known a number of dealers that don't smoke pot. I just don't see the "dividing lines" over pot that there are over other drugs, including alcohol, and to some extent even cigarettes. Sure there's the immature and the uninformed but that's the case with anything.

I think that pot does not have the same kind of effects on non-users as many of the other drugs do. And while some people will be irresponsible with it, many would not, and many will continue to be regardless of the laws.

Some might say, "Well, what about a pothead dad that gets lazy and doesn't wanna take his kid to their soccer game? It's the same as an alcoholic." However, pot does NOT have the same motorsensory effects as alcohol; and if it were legal, the paranoia and feelings of needing to "hide" the fact that you're smoking, would all add up to it not being a big deal-- he could take the kid to the game and sit in the smoking section of the field with a joint.

So yeah. I think pot is really in a class of its own from all other types of drugs, and should be treated as such. The model of distribution and taxing for cigarettes and alcohol is a good place to start, but just that: a place to start.

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. As long as one is not interfering with the other, I should be allowed it, I have the constitutional right to it. And I promise you this bowl I'm smoking isn't dangerous to your life or your liberty.

[thestalkmore]

here goes... absurdly long post warning...

THC is much worse then the carcinogens in cigarettes.

No... just no... people willing to just out and say things like that are the reason for so many of the problems in the world... Your D.A.R.E. teacher is a big, dumb, liar, sent to scare you away from drugs, k?



[quote:22981]Secondly, my dad has this theory that it is not legalized because the government can't figure out a way to tax it and won't make any profit from it.

A lot of us believe the prohibition was brought on by cotton farmers (read: the real builders of modern america), because hemp is flat out a better product. Just... an idea.

As far as taxing it goes, it would be the same as alcohol and tobacco...
You realize they go so far as to force companies to add poisons to rubbing alcohol and ethanol fuels, etc, in order to make it so you can't go to the drug store and buy a gallon of everclear for 2 bucks, right?

First, Mary jane is already legal in a lot of states in small amounts. You can have it in your posession on your personal property, you just can't smoke it in public or travel with it(yeah, i know). It is legal for medicinal purposes and is supplied by the government, and is a lot better than any schwag crap you'll get on the street, i garauntee you.

There are still federal laws against it, and federal organizations do still fuck with people in the places where local laws are more lenient.
There are also several places where it's legal to posess pot, but not to buy it, grow it, or travel with it.

The really funny part is that in even MORE places, the pot itself is tecnically legal to buy and sell, and taxable, but is still not legal to actually posess.(The higher crime for selling in these states is "Possession with intent to distribute", rather than distribution, even if you're actually caught in the act of distribution.) This is actually quite common as many states were beginning to tax it as the prohibition came into effect. (And yes, you can still technically walk into... wherever you'd walk into... with a big bag of pot and get tax stamps that prove you've legally come into possession of it, and supposedly somehow they can still arrest you but can't take your pot lol... the last part there is probably mostly urban legend heh)

I ran a business for 3 years. In that time I had to deal with alot of kids dealing/smoking weed around the store. I'll tell you this, as long as there are assholes that steal, fight and vandalize over that drug I'll personally always shoot down making it legal.

If it was legal those kids would get it at your corner store for 3 bucks a pack and the only people that would have to steal/etc for it are the people that already are for cigarettes, alcohol etc.

I've heard 100 times that all the problems will be fixed if we legalize it. But that is a best case scenario being presented by the people supporting the act. The simple fact is: Responsible people will use it responsibly. Irresponsible people can fuck there life over with it. Expanding the market will only make increase the instances of this truth. People and children especially don't understand how powerful addiction is.

Just out of curiosity, how many beers do you drink per week? Do you consider yourself a "responsible drinker?" How would you feel if alcohol were again prohibited, due to "irresponsible drinkers?"

Honestly, whats the point of smoking? None. There is no reason to smoke unless its for medical reasons. Its stupid, waste of money and just makes you dumber than you already are. Grow up, get a job, pay bills, get a family and stop living in mommys basement getting high because youre too depressed to go out side.

What's the point of cigarettes? What's the point of drinking? What's the point of gaming? What's the point of sports? What's the point of living?

Diffrent; honestly I believe the government should but a HUUUGE tax on cigs and alcohol. It may get people to quit, and if it doesnt? More money to get us out of the hole $ wise. I can just sit back and laugh while people pay outrageous prices for silly things such as these.

Why not do the same to pot? That way we'd be putting stupid amounts of money into helping out with the debt, instead of helping John Dealer get by without a job.

You're not saving money well by getting Cal Ripken Jr.'s 1982 rookie card or adding that car to your train collection.

That's what my parents said when I tried like hell years ago to get them to buy a Mickey Mantle rookie card for $5,000, which has recently sold for 6 figures.

Horrible argument. Maybe you dont see anything in smoking... but maybe I do, your tryin to impose your views on others who just dont give a shit to listen to someone with a fucking horrible argument.

You're entirely right, "What's the point" is an absolutely terrible argument.

Comparing a video game to a chemical addiction is a joke. Go talk to a few meth addicts in rehab and see how fast you get punched.

Comparing pot to meth is a joke. Go tell Bob Sagget you're addicted to pot.

People don't experience physical pain when they quit POT. They don't break out into sweats or fever over not smoking a bowl. You can still ruin your life with drug laws.... They are addictions but in a diffrent category then physical based dependencies. If you look how humans react when they suffer from real drug dependencies, It is no diffrent then a lab animal. They will NOT stop using drugs even when they realise their life is in danger or they run out of the drug itself. I know kids that steal things worth 20$ from stores and resell them for 5$ so they can pay for more meth. I'm sure people have stolen from stores so they can pay off there FFXI bill, and tons of people steal cable.

You can't really compare the 2.

fix'd

Pretty bad, actually. What are the social ramifications of it being illegal? Are they more positive or more negative? I don't think the answers are as simple as black and white or this topic wouldn't have been of such interest for the the quite time it has been.

Exactly, I don't think pot has ruined the life of anyone I know, but I know a number of people who have suffered and changed dramatically because of pot laws. Can't pass your drug test for the probation you got for smoking that joint, if you keep smoking? Hmm, maybe coke will be fun, it's out of your system in plenty of time.

I keep thinking of this Darwin award, about a man and a woman who smoked pot while staying at a hotel. They thought it would be a great idea to sleep under the stars that night...ontop of the hotel roof. When the man woke up in the morning he found out his girlfriend had fallen and died (they didn't realize that the roof of the hotel was REALLY slanted).

Yeah, any my sister's boyfriend's friend knew this guy that stuck a sheet of acid in his pocket and sweated and absorbed it and thought he turned into an orange and is in an asylum and... right.

In all honesty I would rather have cigarettes and alcohol banned instead. It sucks watching your family and friends die slowly from it.

That's a hard statement to hear, because I don't want it banned, but I can totally see and feel where you're coming from. Time for my actual experience yay! (I knew this was gonna be a loooongass post ><

First off I'm 24 years old. I'm a pothead. No ifs, ands, or buts, I smoke a lot of pot. I've tried about everything, and been through some real addictions, but now all I do is smoke pot.

I used to drink a lot, but I was one of those guys that would get all drunk and be like "let's go find us a fight!" So yeah, that, combined with the fact that in the "in between" stages of drunkenness, I just felt like a retard so I'd just get trashed and.. yeah. I decided it was best for me to stay away from alcohol, my sister was an alcoholic at the time, and one of my grandpas had been an alcoholic and made my mom's childhood very rough. I've also been through some pretty seriously tramatic shit not involving alcohol, and altogether it just added up to a pretty serious fear of spending my life "in the bottle."

Anyway, throughout my experience with the "drug culture," I've seen it all. I've known people that did insane amounts of acid and cocaine and you can tell it the moment you see em. I've known people that would rob their own pregnant cousin for money for meth, despite the fact that weeks earlier they were good friends, and had been torn apart by them staying up for weeks on meth while the cousin was trying to create a normal life. When I quit drinking, I actually lost a fair amount of friends because I just wasn't out there, getting trashed and being crazy all the time. I talk to the person who used to be my best friend once every couple months now, because all he wants to do is get retarded drunk, and having a sober person around doesn't fit into the picture. I moved away from the town I was going to college in eventually, and rarely hear from the people up there now.

So much of the drug culture carries an us against them mentality... no doubt heavily contributed to by the drug laws.

But guess what? I have friends that don't smoke pot, lots. I've even known a number of dealers that don't smoke pot. I just don't see the "dividing lines" over pot that there are over other drugs, including alcohol, and to some extent even cigarettes. Sure there's the immature and the uninformed but that's the case with anything.

I think that pot does not have the same kind of effects on non-users as many of the other drugs do. And while some people will be irresponsible with it, many would not, and many will continue to be regardless of the laws.

Some might say, "Well, what about a pothead dad that gets lazy and doesn't wanna take his kid to their soccer game? It's the same as an alcoholic." However, pot does NOT have the same motorsensory effects as alcohol; and if it were legal, the paranoia and feelings of needing to "hide" the fact that you're smoking, would all add up to it not being a big deal-- he could take the kid to the game and sit in the smoking section of the field with a joint.

So yeah. I think pot is really in a class of its own from all other types of drugs, and should be treated as such. The model of distribution and taxing for cigarettes and alcohol is a good place to start, but just that: a place to start.

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. As long as one is not interfering with the other, I should be allowed it, I have the constitutional right to it. And I promise you this bowl I'm smoking isn't dangerous to your life or your liberty.[/quote:22981]

This is what I'm getting from that post:

http://www.mccullagh.org/db9/950-22/homeless-my-ass.jpg

[Plow]

This is what I'm getting from that post:

lol good response, but did you have to quote the whoooole thing?

[Paralyzed]

That really isn't true. It's just you wouldn't hear about a drunk driver getting killed and a family surviving. It's not gonna boost ratings.

That's probably true. I know of maybe one or two cases around here where the drunk driver lived but the people in the opposite car didn't. Generally though, people drunk around here either run into a tree or flip their car/truck since it's a rural place.

[Shaede]

I agree with many of you points, but I have some comments too:

You realize they go so far as to force companies to add poisons to rubbing alcohol and ethanol fuels, etc, in order to make it so you can't go to the drug store and buy a gallon of everclear for 2 bucks, right?

If you honestly believe this, then I can give you a good deal on some yummy wood alcohol.

Exactly, I don't think pot has ruined the life of anyone I know, but I know a number of people who have suffered and changed dramatically because of pot laws. Can't pass your drug test for the probation you got for smoking that joint, if you keep smoking? Hmm, maybe coke will be fun, it's out of your system in plenty of time.

Pot has ruined lives. But, alcohol has ruined many as well. Even perfectly legal medical drugs have ruined lives. The world isn't so black and white as to say that just because something has ruined ones life that it's a terrible thing. In fact, many of the terrible things in life are actually some of the most wonderful things in life (including life itself). I do think, on the whole, that pot is relatively more harmless then programs such as zero tolerance or the oh so American "three strikes and you're out" philosophy they use in law. Hey, it worked in baseball, it must be good, right?

Yeah, any my sister's boyfriend's friend knew this guy that stuck a sheet of acid in his pocket and sweated and absorbed it and thought he turned into an orange and is in an asylum and... right.

The main reason any substance is illegal is usually for our own protection from ourselves or companies that would use the drugs to make us addicted to their product, like so many at the turn of the century when cocaine was a common ingredient in many products. Unfortunatly we have to start to question whether we're actually protecting ourselves or trying to impose a value system on a group of people that function perfectly well the way they do.

Life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. As long as one is not interfering with the other, I should be allowed it, I have the constitutional right to it. And I promise you this bowl I'm smoking isn't dangerous to your life or your liberty.

Unlike drugs like PCP, pot doesn't make you very violent or crazy. As such, I see no reason it should be paired beside such devastating drugs. At the same time, I don't want to live in a world filled with secondhand smoke (tobacco or otherwise). Thus, a compromise must be made between the two so that they each have the freedom to live how they choose without getting in each other's way. As much as I would like to see steps taken towards this (and in other areas of our culture outside drugs), I doubt we'll see many changes in our lifetimes. Our generation is just too lazy and apathetic about politics as it is.

[kareface]

[quote:533e9] People don't experience physical pain when they quit POT. They don't break out into sweats or fever over not smoking a bowl. You can still ruin your life with drug laws.... They are addictions but in a diffrent category then physical based dependencies. If you look how humans react when they suffer from real drug dependencies, It is no diffrent then a lab animal. They will NOT stop using drugs even when they realise their life is in danger or they run out of the drug itself. I know kids that steal things worth 20$ from stores and resell them for 5$ so they can pay for more meth. I'm sure people have stolen from stores so they can pay off there FFXI bill, and tons of people steal cable.

fix'd [/quote:533e9]

1) There are still withdrawal with heavy pot use.

2) If you mean ruining your life with drug laws in the sence that you get caught with drugs and are sent to jail, i have no sympathy.

3) If you think the kids stealing from my store and other stores are meth addicts your in denial. I'll even go as far to say more kids steal money for weed then meth overall.

No... just no... people willing to just out and say things like that are the reason for so many of the problems in the world... Your D.A.R.E. teacher is a big, dumb, liar, sent to scare you away from drugs, k?

I agree with you. But your point is so baseless and moronic I want to change my stance... Don't say something like that with out proof. I could say that pot make people pee gold, but that doesn't make it true.

If it was legal those kids would get it at your corner store for 3 bucks a pack and the only people that would have to steal/etc for it are the people that already are for cigarettes, alcohol etc.

I assume that it wouldn't be legal untill at least 18 year of age. Then your point had been made void, because we would still be in the same situation.

Just out of curiosity, how many beers do you drink per week? Do you consider yourself a "responsible drinker?" How would you feel if alcohol were again prohibited, due to "irresponsible drinkers?"

I don't drink anymore. To be honest, I think that stricter regulation on the purchase and sales needs to be implamented. So maybe preaching to the wrong person?

Exactly, I don't think pot has ruined the life of anyone I know, but I know a number of people who have suffered and changed dramatically because of pot laws. Can't pass your drug test for the probation you got for smoking that joint, if you keep smoking? Hmm, maybe coke will be fun, it's out of your system in plenty of time.

This comment really only hurts your position. If you have probation then you shouldn't be using drugs. You complain about the consequences of breaking the law as if you expected to not be held accountable. I have no sympathy.

Some might say, "Well, what about a pothead dad that gets lazy and doesn't wanna take his kid to their soccer game? It's the same as an alcoholic." However, pot does NOT have the same motorsensory effects as alcohol; and if it were legal, the paranoia and feelings of needing to "hide" the fact that you're smoking, would all add up to it not being a big deal-- he could take the kid to the game and sit in the smoking section of the field with a joint.

Its not the need to hide it that makes people lazy...

Critics also cite studies in which chronic use of marijuana lead to "antimotivational syndrome"(WWW2). This syndrome has been characterized by apathy, lethargy, lack of focus, decreased concentration, and decrease ambition. There also have been studies that suggest cannabinoids implication with fertility and endocrine functions. Cannabinoids have been shown to decrease the plasma levels of leutenizing hormone and increase the level of ACTH in female rats (Cadena et al.).

That would be a side effect of the drug.

[Plow]

1) There are still withdrawal with heavy pot use.

No, there's simply no physical addiction to pot.

2) If you mean ruining your life with drug laws in the sence that you get caught with drugs and are sent to jail, i have no sympathy.

This comment really only hurts your position. If you have probation then you shouldn't be using drugs. You complain about the consequences of breaking the law as if you expected to not be held accountable. I have no sympathy.

If the laws didn't say the person had to go to jail for it, it wouldn't ruin their life. If you don't think anyone should ever go against a law they don't believe in, and have no sympathy for those that do, perhaps you've not heard of a person named Rosa Parks?

I agree with you. But your point is so baseless and moronic I want to change my stance... Don't say something like that with out proof. I could say that pot make people pee gold, but that doesn't make it true.

It's called common knowledge.

3) If you think the kids stealing from my store and other stores are meth addicts your in denial. I'll even go as far to say more kids steal money for weed then meth overall.

Exactly the kind of thing I'd expect to hear from someone trying to get around common knowledge. I'VE SEEN IT in person, crackheads and methheads steal CONSTANTLY to keep up with their addictions. People just don't steal for pot, it's not that kind of an addiction. (And it's not that freaking expensive) The entire culture of meth is based around organized crime, same with cocaine, and crack well... /sigh...

I assume that it wouldn't be legal untill at least 18 year of age. Then your point had been made void, because we would still be in the same situation.

Because assumptions make the world go round.

I don't drink anymore. To be honest, I think that stricter regulation on the purchase and sales needs to be implamented. So maybe preaching to the wrong person?

Ok fine. Say someone found an unopened beer from when you did drink, and you went to jail and had to serve probation for it. How would you feel about that?

Its not the need to hide it that makes people lazy...

Critics also cite studies in which chronic use of marijuana lead to "antimotivational syndrome"(WWW2). This syndrome has been characterized by apathy, lethargy, lack of focus, decreased concentration, and decrease ambition.

And you, from experience, believe you fully understand the reason for this? Ever think maybe it's cuz we wanna get high while we do stuff, so we choose to do stuff where we can?

[Okan]

No, there's simply no physical addiction to pot.

Proof where?
There is addiction to pot. It might not be as strong as a cigarette, but there is addiction. Say there isn't all you want, but there is.

Edit:
There's an addiction to nearly *everything*.

[Klever]

I cant believe some of you pussies here who actually care so much about the harmless things people do to themselves. There are people telling these idiots they dont smoke and they still use the same argument.

Morons like thestalkmore are like a 2 page book when it comes to this argument. Your basically backed against the wall so your only arguement is using the same thing over and over again... seriously pathetic. If you would formulate a decent argument maybe you'll stop looking like so an unbelievabley nieve moron. People like you have probably never had a thought in your mind that was implanted by your parents or teachers.