blau dolch or stylet (main hand)

[Rocl]

NVM PREMATURE LOCK IM DUMB ; ;

I lied.

He's referring to the main handed weapon, so you want the dagger that pumps out the most damage on your Weapon skill which would be hands down the Perseus Harpe.

Blau would make a better off handed dagger if you had a perseus harpe.

Don't you agree?

But Blau Dolch is better mainhand option than Stylet, which was the original question he asked.

[yrpaine]

I've used both blau and stylet. Sylet is a great offhand, it's not very good at all mainhand. WS dmg is best for DE with blau, and best for sharkbite with martial knife in all tests that I did. Dualwielding blau and stylet is damn fun though.

[Shuemue]

Stylet has hidden effect of TH+1.

Please don't kill me, that's just what a guy said on Asura when trying to sell one for obscene amounts of gil

[Michaera]

I've used both blau and stylet. Sylet is a great offhand, it's not very good at all mainhand. WS dmg is best for DE with blau, and best for sharkbite with martial knife in all tests that I did. Dualwielding blau and stylet is damn fun though.

Was wondering about this.. Martial Knife is best for Shark Bite, that we know, but in a real situation where you're using Shark Bite, do you find you do more DoT using the Martial Knife for what you get extra on WS? DRG has a similar problem with Impulse Drive. When forced to use it, Martial Lance will put out better numbers, but the weapon really sucks otherwise. :/ For DRG, it's hardly worth using Martial, generally.

[Soma]

I've both tried P.Harpe and Blau mainhand. Both are good, but I ended up liking P.Harpe mainhand more and decided to keep Blau to offhand it. It's difficulty to tell which is better as they are both great daggers. It just comes down to your play style preference.

[vagus]

I don't have a P.Harpe myself (0/30), but depending on your gear, Blau Dolch will most likely be #1 main hand for XP.

The attack bonus from Blau Dolch is just too nice to pass up. I suggest sirocco kukri as an offhand pair with Blau dolch. A very nice dagger due to its low delay and 100% latent effect.

[yrpaine]

I've used both blau and stylet. Sylet is a great offhand, it's not very good at all mainhand. WS dmg is best for DE with blau, and best for sharkbite with martial knife in all tests that I did. Dualwielding blau and stylet is damn fun though.

Was wondering about this.. Martial Knife is best for Shark Bite, that we know, but in a real situation where you're using Shark Bite, do you find you do more DoT using the Martial Knife for what you get extra on WS? DRG has a similar problem with Impulse Drive. When forced to use it, Martial Lance will put out better numbers, but the weapon really sucks otherwise. :/ For DRG, it's hardly worth using Martial, generally.

90% of the time when thf is told to use sharkbite for SC (guessing hnm mainly) their dot won't do so well no matter which weapon they use. They're main function is to SC for blm's to burst, and get hate on the tank. you'll get more hate on the tank with martial knife.

[Mysterio]

I've used both blau and stylet. Sylet is a great offhand, it's not very good at all mainhand. WS dmg is best for DE with blau, and best for sharkbite with martial knife in all tests that I did. Dualwielding blau and stylet is damn fun though.

Was wondering about this.. Martial Knife is best for Shark Bite, that we know, but in a real situation where you're using Shark Bite, do you find you do more DoT using the Martial Knife for what you get extra on WS? DRG has a similar problem with Impulse Drive. When forced to use it, Martial Lance will put out better numbers, but the weapon really sucks otherwise. :/ For DRG, it's hardly worth using Martial, generally.

90% of the time when thf is told to use sharkbite for SC (guessing hnm mainly) their dot won't do so well no matter which weapon they use. They're main function is to SC for blm's to burst, and get hate on the tank. you'll get more hate on the tank with martial knife.

thats a really good point, so it would seem its mostly situational.

[Soma]

Blau Dolch will most likely be #1 main hand for XP

It's good, but P.Harpe isn't any inferior. I made a quick collection of few Dancing Edge shots that I could find in my screenshot folder. This is with P.Harpe mainhand without stacking my WS with Sneak Attack of Trick Attack.

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h2...ancingEdge.jpg

I'm not saying P.Harpe > Blau. It's really hard to justify and there's no real way to test this other than by assuming low delay > high delay or higher base dmg > lower base dmg. But I certainly don't think P.Harpe is any inferior to Blau.

[Eaglestrike]

We shall now bring the debate to a 3rd forum. I thought base damage didn't effect WS dmg much!? lawl

I was originally going to post to let Shuemue know he's lucky I'm not on Asura or else I'd hunt him whenever he's in ballista for making that comment. Whyyyyyyyyyy on BG, I'm going to have to deal with that shit on Alla and KI >.> <.< lol

If I had P.Harpe and Blau, I'd just offhand Blau. You still get all the bonus'. My setup is P.Harpe+1 (Batardeau) / Blau, works quite nicely.

[Soma]

My shots were shown to demonstrate how P.Harpe isn't inferior to Blau, not better. The 4 base dmg difference between P.Harpe and Blau isn't gonna affect WS dmg any significantly. If I mainhanded Blau, I'd still be putting up close to the numbers that I posted. It'll be -slightly- lower since I'll be using a weaker dagger mainhand and a weaker dagger offhand to replace Blau.

I just personally lean more towards P.Harpe more since I have access to Blau offhand and I feel more comfortable with P.Harpe/Blau combo.

[Shuemue]

I was originally going to post to let Shuemue know he's lucky I'm not on Asura or else I'd hunt him whenever he's in ballista for making that comment. Whyyyyyyyyyy on BG, I'm going to have to deal with that shit on Alla and KI >.> <.< lol

Read the tiny text!

[shat]

90% of the time when thf is told to use sharkbite for SC (guessing hnm mainly) their dot won't do so well no matter which weapon they use. They're main function is to SC for blm's to burst, and get hate on the tank. you'll get more hate on the tank with martial knife.

i disagree with the use of a martial knife if all you're caring about is making a SC for the BLMs. blau will TP faster for quite a few reasons and WS will barely hit lower, if lower at all.

[Eaglestrike]

My shots were shown to demonstrate how P.Harpe isn't inferior to Blau, not better. The 4 base dmg difference between P.Harpe and Blau isn't gonna affect WS dmg any significantly. If I mainhanded Blau, I'd still be putting up close to the numbers that I posted. It'll be -slightly- lower since I'll be using a weaker dagger mainhand and a weaker dagger offhand to replace Blau.

I just personally lean more towards P.Harpe more since I have access to Blau offhand and I feel more comfortable with P.Harpe/Blau combo.

How does showing WS shots prove anything about overall DoT? Of course in most situations you get the best of both worlds but I don't see how showing situations where delay means nothing shows the DoT power of a P.Harpe, which is what you want in a merit pt.

I was originally going to post to let Shuemue know he's lucky I'm not on Asura or else I'd hunt him whenever he's in ballista for making that comment. Whyyyyyyyyyy on BG, I'm going to have to deal with that shit on Alla and KI >.> <.< lol

Read the tiny text!

Retards don't read tiny text and I know plenty of retards will now think what you posted is true!

[Skyylya]

90% of the time when thf is told to use sharkbite for SC (guessing hnm mainly) their dot won't do so well no matter which weapon they use. They're main function is to SC for blm's to burst, and get hate on the tank. you'll get more hate on the tank with martial knife.

i disagree with the use of a martial knife if all you're caring about is making a SC for the BLMs. blau will TP faster for quite a few reasons and WS will barely hit lower, if lower at all.

In that case i highly doubt speed will be an issue, as thief i tp a hell of a lot faster than a war or drk in most situations.

[Soma]

How does showing WS shots prove anything about overall DoT? Of course in most situations you get the best of both worlds but I don't see how showing situations where delay means nothing shows the DoT power of a P.Harpe, which is what you want in a merit pt.

I said I use P.Harpe/Blau.. it should be self-explanatory. And DoT largely depends on your gear, not just your weapons. Honestly, I don't know how to illustrate the DoT comparison between P.Harpe and Blau as this is a matter of delay and M.Avg. Need to look at both of those criteria to justify which is better, but parses don't show one of them. Even if it does, it's a minor difference between the two regardless of which is better.

My SS's purpose was just to show what P.Harpe can do for people that haven't seen P.Harpe's capability. Everyone knows what Blau can do, but not everyone has seen P.Harpe's numbers. Even today, people post their Mandau performance to show what Mandau is like simply because it's so rare. It gives an insight to people that has never seen Mandau performance what Mandau is capable of doing. Same goes with all rare weapons that are worth mentioning.

My intent was to simply open the discussion in an UNbiased way since people seem to think Blau > P.Harpe.

[archibaldcrane]

Argh, you guys are frustrating.

Blau Dolch is a better dagger than P. Harpe. That doesn't mean that you'll always main-hand Blau, but it's still a better dagger. Blau has a better "DPS" if all you look at is straight damage/delay (with latent on, which it will be almost all the time) A 33/178 dagger will do more melee damage over time (barely) than a 37/210 dagger. Add the latent atk+acc onto that and it's just better.

However, as any dual-wielder knows, the higher DMG weapon goes in the main hand. That doesn't make the main-hand weapon better overall, it just means it has higher DMG. If you want to compare P. Harpe to Blau, think of it like this:

Would you rather go P. Harpe/S. Kukri or Blau/S. Kukri?

The only thing that can make P. Harpe a "better" mainhand than Blau is that you can't have two Blaus.

[Soma]

Then why don't people just try synthing Jambiya over and over again until they finally HQ one instead of camping months of Xolotl for P.Harpe? Jambiya +1's DPS is only 0.05 less than P.Harpe. Why do people even bother trying for P.Harpe if it's only 0.05 dmg/sec sacrifice?

The difference in DPS between Blau and P.Harpe, according to the formulas, are only 0.5. On paper, it sounds 'ok', but in real xp situations, it's meaningless. I've had experience with both daggers and that small of a difference is really meaningless.

You have to have experience with the weapon to see this. It's similar to people that acquire a relic weapon, after hearing all things about it, saying "wow.. I've heard so many things about this weapon, but now that I actually use one, it's alot better than I thought it would be". P.Harpe won't make you do that, but my point is, if you actually have experience with the weapon, you'd think otherwise.

[yrpaine]

Argh, you guys are frustrating.


Would you rather go P. Harpe/S. Kukri or Blau/S. Kukri?

hands down, blau+s.kukri (main use would be soloing and merriting) because in your dps calculation you neglected the accuracy and attack which would be added to both weapons when using blau. adding the +attack and +acc to s.kukri makes the combo super.

For hnm I'd still pick martial knife mainhand (obviously for those who don't have relic) offhand would be the discussion if you think stylet ( +4dex +2agi and +1 enmity) would create more hate than blau ( +16 att) on ws when tricking ws to tank. The answer to what's better would probably be more dependant on your other gear's setup, if you have high att and not as much stats you'd probably want the +4dex and +1 enmity, if you have lots of stats and not a lot of attack, you'd probaly want the +16 attack to get a less resisted ws.

[Vedder]

This is good info, but meh... I have a somewhat related question.

If you don't have a Sirocco, what is a better Dagger combo?

Harpe/Blau or Blau/Miser+1 ?

My goal is P.Harpe/Blau or Blau/SK... but in the meantime... hmmm.