[OFFICIAL] Hillary Clinton running for 2008 President!

[Jimmayus]

As long as you're going to base your dislike of a candidate on controversial issues that they may or may not have been apart of, why would you ever, in all decency, skip over the issues surrounding every president ever.

It's generally irrelevant to bring up Whitewater, because it's filed under one of those 'conspiracy' tabs, just like how people supposedly steal elections every 4 years.

I don't care if you think the deaths are 'convenient', the point is it was never proven; I'd like you to watch a documentary called Hunting the President. Of course, documentaries are usually controversial (hi2u communist weasel Michael Moore), but it provides another perspective on the situations you so enjoyed bringing up.

The idea that you would base your vote on a trial which you simply believed was forced by the Clintons makes your ideology suspect purely on the grounds that you can logically argue against the evidence presented, as well as for it.

The fact is, regardless of your opinion of things that may or may not have happened, you have to view a candidate from how they have represented you in the past, how they're projected to represent you, and their competence in performing the job.

As far as I know, Hillary has almost always cosigned bills with a member of the Republican party, including his craziness Tom DeLay, which strikes me as odd given how often people seem to call her tilted all the way left.

By the way, enforcing video game statutes is a right-leaning attitude towards government, but those who talked about it knew that from the start.

Too much of what people bring to the table to bash Hillary is either completely wrong or personal opinion based on preconception that you got from god knows where.

She has campaigned for universal health care (in the 90's, but the idea that a 1st lady could even get the ball rolling on something like that was nigh unheard of). She has accomplished many minor goals, but senators can't really accomplish major goals in a political climate like the one today. She is on several committees and chairs some, and makes at least a marked attempt to seek out and work with members from the other side of the aisle.

Where did the hormonal bitch thing come from anyway? That's what really baffles me.

All that being said, I don't necessarily support her in terms of my views on specific issues, but her ability to lead is a pretty stupid thing to question, especially when espousing Barak Obama in her stead, considering he has basically nothing to his name except a book deal. Fascinating book by the way, but he needs to make up his fucking mind on how to solve problems (read the book).

By the way TsingTao, to list her being female as a point of suspicion makes you arguement seem more like tripe than it possibly is. Next time, leave gender politics out of this, it's pretty apparent they are capable of the same leadership we are.

Edit: rough drafts and spelling escape me

[Plow]

Where did the hormonal bitch thing come from anyway? That's what really baffles me.

Woman that's not a doormat = psycho pms bitch.

Welcome to America.

This is why a woman won't be president for a long time.

The fact that someone supporting Obama had to end his post with "unless he steals a few thousand bikes" is why the same is true for a black person.

[Kenai]

Where did the hormonal bitch thing come from anyway? That's what really baffles me.

Woman that's not a doormat = psycho pms bitch.

Welcome to America.

This is why a woman won't be president for a long time.

The fact that someone supporting Obama had to end his post with "unless he steals a few thousand bikes" is why the same is true for a black person.

Quoted for truth. Not to bash on you, Suntzu, but as far as the U.S. has come along in the last century, there's still a lot of remnants of bigotry and ignorance to still clean up. Most people like to think that the U.S. has gotten more open-minded than that, considering the country we are and the people who make it up, but...

Hilary and Obama have a better chance than I've seen in my lifetime, I just don't know...I don't want to vote for them JUST because they are female/black/whatever, of course, but saying that people will vote for them just because of that is pretty insulting too. They are good canidates if you compare them to everyone else in the running, and I would like to say I was around to see that part of history when it happened.

[Damen]

There's rumors about Obama was raised Muslim...his father was definitely muslim, and even though he's supposedly Christian....that's one strike in too many Americans minds that he'll have no way in hell at winning the election.

Then again,...Swarchenegger's dad was a nazi.

[Jimmayus]

Machines don't have fathers

[TsingTao]

Bash away Kenai. Seriously though, I don't feel bashed...it's a political discussion. It's just one of those charged topics. One I usually avoid on a forum where you can't actually have a real discussion (100 words every couple hours isn't really enough) but fun nonetheless.

I agree that we still have a long way to go. I do think, though, that the political climate is finally at a point where such a 'radical' notion as a female or black President will be acceptable to the majority of the populus. The last 8 (or for me 16) years have left a rather unpleasant taste in a lot of people's mouths when it comes to US politics. I don't think something as mundane as old fashioned bigotry or or chauvenism will be enough to keep a "non-traditional" candidate out of The Office this time around.

Hillary has baggage from her husband's Presidency. Barack is rather young, politically at least. I don't think that will be enough to stop either of them from winning though. I's just a question of who gets the nomination. I truly don't think the Democrats willl go with a third choice.

Jim, you do raise a good point at the end of your post. I shouldn't have said that as it does trivialize my point. I don't have any problem with a woman President...merely this particular one being President.

Plow...you rather missed the joke. And I said hundred. No one would have room for a few thousand bikes, that's just crazy.

[Damen]

I don't have any problem with a woman President...merely this particular one being President.

Round 2 GO.

I agree with you about it being HER of all people, but as pointed out eariler I couldn't really come up with a reason why other than it's her baggage from her husbands presidency. And which politician doesn't have their own baggage anyways?

[Carbon]

I don't think America is ready for a female president, however, I think America needs a female president.

[Sho]

There's rumors about Obama was raised Muslim...his father was definitely muslim, and even though he's supposedly Christian....that's one strike in too many Americans minds that he'll have no way in hell at winning the election.

Then again,...Swarchenegger's dad was a nazi.

I'd still vote to elect Obama over some of this filth.

I don't have any problem with a woman President...merely this particular one being President.

Round 2 GO.

I agree with you about it being HER of all people, but as pointed out eariler I couldn't really come up with a reason why other than it's her baggage from her husbands presidency. And which politician doesn't have their own baggage anyways?

Obama is considered "fresh" Also things to point at Clinton was with her 1992 and 1993 attempts at Health Care changes that got thrown out by Congress.

[Kyreth]

Wait... there are more conservative whiney radio people then rush O.O.

He always symbolized the pinacle of stupidity in my book.

Gawd, yes. I live in the DC area, Radio AM 630 starts the morning off with a moderate (who's worth listening to, actually), drops into Rush-mode for the mid-day, and by the evening has a neo-con that makes Rush seem polite by comparison.

Apparently, that level of insanity isn't as popular but apparently there's an audience eating it up.

[Artful Dodger]

so i was reading, and this made me laugh

http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/01/ ... linton.ap/

[Raineer]

I don't think America is ready for a female president, however, I think America needs a female president.

No the America public needs to stop being a bunch of pussies. They only elect that which reflects them.

[Plow]

Plow...you rather missed the joke. And I said hundred. No one would have room for a few thousand bikes, that's just crazy.

No, I didn't miss the joke at all.

The fact that you would make the joke, and you're a supporter says it all.

Do you not realize that the reason everyone jokes about black people and women and shit is because the racism and sexism is really there? No matter how small, it's there. And you're a supporter. The other side is apparently bigger than you have any idea.

Don't forget that old people vote more than anyone else.

[Devek]

Plow...you rather missed the joke. And I said hundred. No one would have room for a few thousand bikes, that's just crazy.

No, I didn't miss the joke at all.

The fact that you would make the joke, and you're a supporter says it all.

Do you not realize that the reason everyone jokes about black people and women and shit is because the racism and sexism is really there? No matter how small, it's there. And you're a supporter. The other side is apparently bigger than you have any idea.

Don't forget that old people vote more than anyone else.

During an event here for Senate candidate Nancy Farmer, Clinton introduced a quote from Gandhi by saying, "He ran a gas station down in St. Louis."

Lol, Hilary just made the same type of joke so she is a supporter of racism huh?

(No, thats ignorant. Jokes that make fun of racial stereotypes do just that.. make fun of racial sterotypes.)

[Damen]

Two black guys and a girl walk into a bar..........

[Daahan]

I'm just afraid of her stare of death.

That look in her eyes can pierce Fort Knox.

[Plow]

Lol, Hilary just made the same type of joke so she is a supporter of racism huh?

(No, thats ignorant. Jokes that make fun of racial stereotypes do just that.. make fun of racial sterotypes.)

Explain to me what's racist about joking that Ghandi was an (average) American please.

[Demosthenes11]

I don't have any problem with a woman President...merely this particular one being President.

Round 2 GO.

I agree with you about it being HER of all people, but as pointed out eariler I couldn't really come up with a reason why other than it's her baggage from her husbands presidency. And which politician doesn't have their own baggage anyways?

Whats wrong with her? O I don't know...

1) Her constantly shifting view on the Iraq war
2) Her love of foreign political donations and other bad fundraising activities
3) Used 9/11 to win federal grants for her cooperate campaign donors
4) Controls all information surrounding her
5) Desire for collectivism and government control

Other than those and the fact she is a fucking loon, she would make a great president!

[Devek]

Lol, Hilary just made the same type of joke so she is a supporter of racism huh?

(No, thats ignorant. Jokes that make fun of racial stereotypes do just that.. make fun of racial sterotypes.)

Explain to me what's racist about joking that Ghandi was an (average) American please.

http://img153.imageshack.us/img153/1927/ghandi3ui.jpg

Ghandi was indian(like from the country India, not native american). If you don't know that a long held stereotype of indians is that they all work in convenience stores(see Simpsons "I'm gonna party like it's on sell for $19.99!") or as cab drivers (see Independence Day "He took a cab!") you are so far out of touch with reality it is insane or have completely lost your objectivity.

It is just like saying MLK picked cotton down at the plantation.

[TsingTao]

Plow...you rather missed the joke. And I said hundred. No one would have room for a few thousand bikes, that's just crazy.

No, I didn't miss the joke at all.

The fact that you would make the joke, and you're a supporter says it all.

Do you not realize that the reason everyone jokes about black people and women and shit is because the racism and sexism is really there? No matter how small, it's there. And you're a supporter. The other side is apparently bigger than you have any idea.

Don't forget that old people vote more than anyone else.

Holy hell...welcome to the trouble with modern American society. Sometimes a joke is just a joke. Quite often people should lighten the fuck up about it too. The whole cleansing of everything we say or do to ensure political correctness is rather tiring. I joke about white people and the Irish as well, sue me.

The fact that a BG-centric bike joke (hello there Ryko) that's been done to death should, at worst, be cause for a groan because you've seen it here 100 times before. Not to raise the "You're a Racist" placards.

Explain to me what's racist about joking that Ghandi was an (average) American please.

PC Translation: All Indians run Quicke Marts.