Citadel Buster

[Ramuhnub]

So yeah my LS killed Ultima tonight and we got crap drops ~_~... On top of that our tanks were saying they changed something with Citadel Buster? Usually tank it with 1 Aegis PLD/NIN and two RDM/NINs. All always survive it unless they forget to swap in MDT gear or what not... But today it dropped one clean... pretty sure he had untouched SS up aswell... Our PLD had Shadow Ring proc on one, the next he took 1232? Says he usually takes about half that, I always have damage filters~ Just wondering if anyone else has seen this.

** Edit RDMs took 1297 and 1370, the PLD only had Shell IV for the 1232.

[Robert]

Weather boost proc, just unlucky I guess

[Seditedi]

Did a Dissipation get off at 19%? Maybe they got hit before Shell was reapplied..
Weather proc can't account for 600 damage anyway..

[RKenshin]

Same thing happened to me recently. I normally take like 700-900 or so, but I took a good 1200-1400 (forgot) for the first time in a really long time just a week or two ago.

But, yeah, I don't think anything changed. It was most likely just a double weather proc, which would easily add a good 200-400+ damage. Even more if it was lightsday and it was a 3x.

[Seditedi]

Well assuming weather did proc and it was lightsday then that would add a .25 bonus to the damage of Citadel Buster right? Someone normally taking 600 damage would take 750 instead roughly. Honestly sounds like a weather/day bonus proc without having Shell up.

[Ramuhnub]

Pretty sure it was Windsday, they all had atleast Shell IV.

[RKenshin]

Well assuming weather did proc and it was lightsday then that would add a .25 bonus to the damage of Citadel Buster right? Someone normally taking 600 damage would take 750 instead roughly. Honestly sounds like a weather/day bonus proc without having Shell up.

I'm not exactly sure how it works, but isn't the day bonus applied to the base damage? Before the magic reduction of the target is taken into effect? At least this would make much more sense as far as what kind of difference I've seen in damage across different people... If it was applied after everything it'd barely be noticeable at all.

But yeah, in which case I've seen people take a max of like 2000-2200+ without any buffs. Assuming that was around where the base damage of the spell usually is, it would mean with capped reduction at 50% you'd be taking 1000-1100. With 20% added to the base damage, it's bumped up to 2400-2640 damage, resulting in the same person taking 1200-1320 damage.

So, it's a potential difference of 200-250ish damage if the base was around 2000-2200. If you count stoneskin and maybe another 10% "reduction" from MDB and such, it's still almost a 200 damage difference.

If the base damage was in fact higher and the tanks weren't capped on damage reduction, the difference would only be bigger. 2300 base with 40% reduction would be 1.3k damage after going through a 350 damage stoneskin.

Also, isn't it a 10% bonus for each weather/day effect? Noticed you referred to it as a 25% bonus.

[Suiram]

Well assuming weather did proc and it was lightsday then that would add a .25 bonus to the damage of Citadel Buster right? Someone normally taking 600 damage would take 750 instead roughly. Honestly sounds like a weather/day bonus proc without having Shell up.

I'm not exactly sure how it works, but isn't the day bonus applied to the base damage? Before the magic reduction of the target is taken into effect? At least this would make much more sense as far as what kind of difference I've seen in damage across different people... If it was applied after everything it'd barely be noticeable at all.

But yeah, in which case I've seen people take a max of like 2000-2200+ without any buffs. Assuming that was around where the base damage of the spell usually is, it would mean with capped reduction at 50% you'd be taking 1000-1100. With 20% added to the base damage, it's bumped up to 2400-2640 damage, resulting in the same person taking 1200-1320 damage.

So, it's a potential difference of 200-250ish damage if the base was around 2000-2200. If you count stoneskin and maybe another 10% "reduction" from MDB and such, it's still almost a 200 damage difference.

If the base damage was in fact higher and the tanks weren't capped on damage reduction, the difference would only be bigger. 2300 base with 40% reduction would be 1.3k damage after going through a 350 damage stoneskin.

Also, isn't it a 10% bonus for each weather/day effect? Noticed you referred to it as a 25% bonus.

Base damage typically means the damage figured first, a function of the Stats of the player or monster using the spell/WS, the spell/WS used, and often the stats of the target. But you are correct in that day/weather is a multiplier figured prior to, and independently of any damage mitigation terms. Day/Weather bonus ranges from 10% (day only or single weather only) to 35% (day + double weather), and 25% is the max bonus from double weather and no day. You probably actually see a somewhat wider range that accounts for this condition, maybe 1900~2400 which would be the same base damage with and without double weather.

As for Citidel Buster's actual base damage, VZX mentioned to me the other day that they had info on that on Studio Gobli, but I haven't poked around there enough myself to know where to find what he was talking about. Maybe he'll see this.

[RKenshin]

Ah, I see. Thanks.

In which case though, that could definitely be a good 200-400ish difference between no bonus and a double weather bonus. Mostly depending on how well geared the tank is, of course. As well as whatever the true base damage of it would be.

[Suiram]

Ah, I see. Thanks.

In which case though, that could definitely be a good 200-400ish difference between no bonus and a double weather bonus. Mostly depending on how well geared the tank is, of course. As well as whatever the true base damage of it would be.

Well, I'd look at it a different way...

Same thing happened to me recently. I normally take like 700-900 or so, but I took a good 1200-1400 (forgot) for the first time in a really long time just a week or two ago.

If the damage you take when day/weather doesn't proc is 700, then you'd take 945 in triple conditions if they all procced, so taking 1200-1400 is abnormal as the OP suggested. Either shell got dispelled like someone suggested or they changed him. Day/Weather procs often enough (single conditions about 1/3 of the time, I'm not sure if it's exponential to get 2 or 3 when possible), so it isn't something you would go a long time without seeing.

[Seditedi]

Oh yeah, I actually did mean 35% bonus don't know why I said 25% up in my previous post, sorry about that.

[Suiram]

I think I wasn't very clear in my last post. I meant that rather than thinking of it as a range of 700~900ish damage (after MDB/shell) that could be made larger by day/weather (up to 950~1200), it is likely instead 700ish damage without any day/weather proc that is occasionally up to 900ish when it does, which leaves the mystery from the OP and and Rukenshin's 1200-1400 damage still unsolved.

[Seditedi]

Had to be a Dissipation at 19% or something.
One of my first Ultimas a very long time ago we missed a stun at 19% and pretty sure a WHM forgot to reapply it for CB.
I could be wrong, but this may have happened at least in the OPs case.

[Ramuhnub]

We only hit one Dissipation stun ~_~... and that was the one at 19%, after the others Shell was reapplied. The PLD had Aegis -25% MDT, Shell IV(not sure of the -MDT on that) and then +12 MDB in gear... Not sure on the RDMs, pretty sure they wear some -MDT for buster just uncertain of how much~

**Edit Got 39% also, missed 59% and 79%

[Seditedi]

Yea I don't know Shell IV is about -20% MDT if I'm remembering correctly.
-45% MDT and 12 MDB shouldn't get hit for that high imo though.

[VZX]

Proto-Ultima: Lv 85
CB: Light damage, 6.00x multiplier, 4.00 (or 400, whichever version you prefer) MAB

Normal damage (without any damage reduction/buff/weather enhancement etc)
Damage = (85+2)*6.00*(4.00/1.00) = 2088

Me with 1/2 resist , last second saline coat (MDB+50) and MDB trait (+10)
652 = ((85+2)*6.00*(4.00/(1.00+0.50+0.10))*1/2
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v4...rotoCBvsSC.jpg

[Suiram]

I knew you'd come through.

So that makes it easy for a tank to predict the exact damage they'd take (well the set of 5 possible damages depending on day/weather) from Citidel Buster before they even enter Temenos. Unless they are using some variable MDB buffs like Magus's Roll or Saline Coat.

[VZX]

Yep. At least you can calculate the "worst case" damage taken from CB.

I remember Kaeko mentioned about Voidstorm on tank (Accession-> Voidstorm, is this possible?) to completely remove the occasional damage boost from double light weather.

[Suiram]

I found the page you were talking about, where you got that from. The Bahamut stuff is interesting too. From what I'm reading you can figure it like a tier III BLM spell with 115 INT and MAB+12 for V = 940, 1316, and 1880 depending on the flare.

[Ramuhnub]

Thanks for the replies, so from what I gather the damage they took was normal for the 2088 base damage + weather procs?