Jailer of Love Question/ Basic Mechanics Question

[Apessius]

So my ls leader confirmed my suspicion that we were going to be using the strategy of having a rdm tanking JoL by telling me that I'd be doing it. My question is (if anyone is still reading this thread)-- How much MDB should I buff up on? As much as possible, I'd assume, but what would you all recommend?

Currently I'm at +7 MDB
Lamia Mantle +1 (4)
Mahant Sandles (2)
Lamia Kaman (1)

And no, I don't have Duelist's Gloves (+2MDB)-- we haven't seen any rdm drop in dyna for months.

Also, Basic question: for a mob like JoL, what is more preferrable-
MDB +2 or Magic dmg taken -5%?
Unfettered Ring vs. Merman's Ring?

[Thorny]

Shit is situational. If your tank party whm has fully meritted shellra 5 as they should, aim for 25-26% magic damage taken off gear then use additional space to add MDB. The cap on magic damage taken- is 50%, and shellra 5 is a tiny bit below 25% so you will not get the full % reduction from 26th % of magic damage-. I use the following for magic dmg- set:

Ranged: Lamian Kaman(+1 would be better, but bleh) (1/2 MDB)
Head: Coral Visor +1(2%) if no full shellra 5, chapeau otherwise for tanking
Ears: Merman's Earring x2(4%)
Body: Coral Scale Mail(3%)
Hands: Duelist's Gloves(2 MDB)
Rings: Merman's x2(8%)
Back: Resentment Cape(5%)
Legs: Coral Cuisses +1(3%)
Feet: Coral Greaves +1(2%)
Total: 25%(27% if no capped shellra 5), 3 MDB(4 if i had a HQ kaman)

A completely ideal setup would use coral visor+1 for head, replace coral mail with dalmatica, use lieutenant's sash on waist, and have a HQ kaman. That ideal setup would give you capped magic dmg-% and 8 MDB to go with your job trait.

Edit: I already answered this in some other thread, but mob damage calculation is as follows:
[Mob's base MAB* - 1/100 your MDB] x (100 - magic dmg taken) = effective damage multiplier
Unless a mob somehow has negative magic attack bonus, 1 magic damage taken- will always beat 1 magic defense bonus until you have capped magic damage taken.

*1.32 for blm mobs, 1.0 if they have none, endgame mobs may vary

[Suiram]

The suggestions are right, even though the justification isn't exactly correct. MAB is divided by MDB, not subtracted, which also means that the mob's MAB is irrelevant (no difference between a 1000 damage move with 2.00 mob MAB and a 2000 damage move with 1.00 MAB for tanking purposes).

But yeah, in terms of damage mitigation damage taken >> MDB up to the cap, as has been said many times in the past.

[Apessius]

Thank you for the explanations~ I'll be adjusting accordingly.

::Grumble:: Resentment Cape camping is going to be for the loss w/out ToD::Grumble::

[Vigilia]

In case of JoL though, you don't really need to go all out on magic defense/damage taken -% on RDM. Ultima or other enemies where the magic attack can one-shot you yeah, but not for JoL. For one thing you do want some +enmity in your gearslots, especially depending on your co-tank. Even if it's just to macro in for the moments when hate is not on you and the beginning of the fight. This is of course assuming your LS has two tanks on JoL. If you're co-tanking with a PLD/RDM or PLD/NIN, they need to go easy on +enmity gear and you need to wear some. It's stupidly easy for PLD to pile up enmity these days but it makes co-tanking with them an utter nightmare, especially if they're being retarded about hate or their gear. So know your co-tanks and what to expect. I've always stuck with at least Mermaid's ring, Resentment Cape, Harmonia's Torque and Chainsaw+1 for enmity, sometimes Warwolf belt too. Have some haste/fastcast gear as well, even if it's just to macro in for utsusemis. Getting :ichi up in AF1 hat+AF2 body makes Ninjas cry like we all know.

Secondly you should have utsusemi, stoneskin and bar-spell/shellraV on at all times anyway so in the end the only spells that will hit you for damage are the -ga3s. Watch JoL, every time you see the 2hr animation (the dust cloud) he'll change his element and will from that point on cast that element's spells only. As soon as you see the first spell of the element go off, put on the appropriate bar-spell. Remember that he casts enfeebles also- if you see silencega go off get baraera up etc. When you're tanking JoL the -ga3s are the only damage you take (unless your summons puller sucks and you get sharks to rape your face) so getting hit a little and being able to toss out Cure IVs for hate is always a bonus. I don't have massive amounts of Jailer tanking experience on RDM but managed so far with Lamian Kaman, Resentment cape and AF2 hands without ever being nowhere near dying from magic attacks. JoL's -ga3s hit for about 250 through stoneskin and it nukes so slowly you'll always have stoneskin up. It's probably the easiest "end game" mob I ever tanked, even Genbu is scarier.

[Thorny]

When you're tanking JoL the -ga3s are the only damage you take (unless your summons puller sucks and you get sharks to rape your face) so getting hit a little and being able to toss out Cure IVs for hate is always a bonus. I don't have massive amounts of Jailer tanking experience on RDM but managed so far with Lamian Kaman, Resentment cape and AF2 hands without ever being nowhere near dying from magic attacks. JoL's -ga3s hit for about 250 through stoneskin and it nukes so slowly you'll always have stoneskin up.

While this will work, macroing some hp+ gear and cure 3ing yourself is far more efficient than deliberately taking more damage. You can do it whenever you want, and it's very easy to get +210 hp on rdm. Bomb queen ring, bloodbead ring, ogre jerkin, ogre trousers, hp+20 assault chain, = 215 at the cost of only 10 mp compared to magic reduction set mentioned earlier(while max mp doesn't usually make a difference, I hate using cassie/intruder because i'll inevitably macro them on at full mp and lose 90). Add eris' earrings or harmonias torque(and a hp earring), warwolf belt, some other enm gear in unused slots to the macro and you're good to go. Just macro it all on, cure 3 yourself, macro back to standing gear. The only remotely difficult item to get in that set is bloodbead ring, and you can make up for it easily with cassie or intruder earring if it's not worth the effort to you. If you REALLY need to use cure 4, macro on some zenith to lower your max, then back to hp+ gear, then back to standing gear afterwards since it's very impractical(and sometimes impossible) to carry around 400ish extra hp in gear above standing set.

[Apessius]

Follow up... And I have to say, thanks for all of the great input! I have taken it to heart and
camped 5 days straight and I'm happy to say finally 1/3 Resentment cape..

Crimson feet/legs or coral feet/legs?
Its a question of 20resistance vs. what? 5% mdr?

I'm thinking the mdr.. although crimson stuff is that awesome.

[Thorny]

20 resistance won't do jack shit without a resist build, unless you plan on swapping barspells whenever it switches modes and carrying a few full resist builds stick with the coral.

[Apessius]

20 resistance won't do jack shit without a resist build, unless you plan on swapping barspells whenever it switches modes and carrying a few full resist builds stick with the coral.

yeah, point taken, although I'd like to know what 20 resist translates to in terms of -%magic dmg (yet another basic question about game mechanics)

[Dammerung]

20 resistance won't do jack shit without a resist build, unless you plan on swapping barspells whenever it switches modes and carrying a few full resist builds stick with the coral.

yeah, point taken, although I'd like to know what 20 resist translates to in terms of -%magic dmg (yet another basic question about game mechanics)

It doesn't. Resist is your chance to resist the spell damage or effect, it has nothing to do with the total unmodified damage. Resist is worthless unless you stack it so that your chance of resist is very high (and very unpractical on JoL because you won't have enough inventory room to carry enough for every element). -%mdmg and mdb are always in effect.

[Thorny]

Basically what he said, I'm not sure how resistable JOLs spells are, but if anything you could carry resist builds for when he's in ice or thunder mode and switch to mdef for the others ... really not worth the effort though, a good mdmg- set will have you covered for everything. Partial resists go 1/2 1/4 1/8 and full resist is 1/16 iirc, but if you don't get up at least past 200 your chances of even partially resisting anything on an endgame mob are pretty low and you'll just take the same damage you would without the gear. If you're enough of a micromanager and you have the gear/space, and they're moderately resistable, ice and thunder would be best bets to have builds for since they have the highest base damage spells(speaking solely for JOL), but really don't bother.

[Therin]

I've seen people have to explain the resist thing more than anything else in this game.

[Apessius]

So I took everyone's advice and it was going really really well.
And then this happened:

http://www.bluegartr.com/forum/viewt...p?f=25&t=32779