Pandemonium, Morgan Webb Causes Vomiting. Media Blitz Ensues

[Damane]

I strongly doubt at this point they ever intend for either of them to be defeated.

which is sad, because they destroy with this some of FFXI's endgame experience, especially since AV and PW hold good loot. Its like going to a disco/party that sells only nonalcoholic drinks.

[Max™]

One of these days, someone will give my crazy idea a shot, not me... gotta get set for new semester soon, but maybe it will happen.

Just use that energy spend kiting everything and killing lamps one at a time, and kite everything, but kill PW.

See what happens.

[Viviton]

Chances are there are ways to wins these fights without spending 18 hours to do so. The fact a Linkshell spent 18 hours is not neccassarily SE's fault, perhaps the strategy was all wrong. Hell, Kirin could take 18 hours if it wanted too, but the reason it doesn't is because we know how to kill it properly, i'm sure people struggled with it's Regen over the years. I remember when Kirins were like 4hours long, throwing BLM and Tanks at it...

The Kirin example isn't brilliant because he's weak to us now we've figured out it's 'zergable' and SE have given us access to gear we would have dreamed about 3 years ago, but the principal still stands. I don't know much on PW, but i'm 99% sure SE would not make it so the ONLY way to kill it is to fight it for longer than 18 hours. They've done stupid things before, but that really is an intentional danger to people's physical well being...

There has to be a gimick, somewhere...If someone chooses to do these fights for pure exploration and investigation, then that's fine, because like AV, we have no idea how to kill these 2 megabosses yet. But to turn around and say, to SE, that they're to blame for you spending 18 hours on a NM that no-one has really researched is pretty ridiculous. Players have control over this game. If you're addicted, you're addicted, that has no correlation to SE.

I think this is a lousy excuse to attack SE. I'm not sure about you, but i find it incredible that people have figured out 90% of the formulas, strategies and theories behind this game, yet not one person knows how to kill AV properly, even with a video for reference (As lame as the video is). I enjoy reading people's ideas on how to kill AV, and peoples' imagination and desire to uncover how to kill him. If SE was to tell us all tomorrow a step by step guide on how to kill AV, i think it would result in a loss, not a gain, for FFXI.

ViVi~

[LinktheDeme]

which is sad, because they destroy with this some of FFXI's endgame experience, especially since AV and PW hold good loot. Its like going to a disco/party that sells only nonalcoholic drinks.

Or like going to a rave party and having them say no more ecstasy here ;o

[Guitarman]

Chances are there are ways to wins these fights without spending 18 hours to do so. The fact a Linkshell spent 18 hours is not neccassarily SE's fault, perhaps the strategy was all wrong. Hell, Kirin could take 18 hours if it wanted too, but the reason it doesn't is because we know how to kill it properly, i'm sure people struggled with it's Regen over the years. I remember when Kirins were like 4hours long, throwing BLM and Tanks at it...

The Kirin example isn't brilliant because he's weak to us now we've figured out it's 'zergable' and SE have given us access to gear we would have dreamed about 3 years ago, but the principal still stands. I don't know much on PW, but i'm 99% sure SE would not make it so the ONLY way to kill it is to fight it for longer than 18 hours. They've done stupid things before, but that really is an intentional danger to people's physical well being...

There has to be a gimick, somewhere...If someone chooses to do these fights for pure exploration and investigation, then that's fine, because like AV, we have no idea how to kill these 2 megabosses yet. But to turn around and say, to SE, that they're to blame for you spending 18 hours on a NM that no-one has really researched is pretty ridiculous. Players have control over this game. If you're addicted, you're addicted, that has no correlation to SE.

I think this is a lousy excuse to attack SE. I'm not sure about you, but i find it incredible that people have figured out 90% of the formulas, strategies and theories behind this game, yet not one person knows how to kill AV properly, even with a video for reference (As lame as the video is). I enjoy reading people's ideas on how to kill AV, and peoples' imagination and desire to uncover how to kill him. If SE was to tell us all tomorrow a step by step guide on how to kill AV, i think it would result in a loss, not a gain, for FFXI.

ViVi~

Run. Now. Sundi specifically stated, that AV is AT LEAST 8-10, UP TO 18 hours to kill. THIS IS HOW IT WAS INTENDED TO BE. So yes, SE IS to blame for this dumbshit idea. We do not have control over this as you say.

[Viviton]

No, 8-10 is intended. 18+ Hours is your choice.

One day, AV will be done in under 10 hours, for someone to try something for 18hours + is your call. If SE told you how to kill AV, yet you still took 18 hours to do it, that has nothing to do with SE. The fact SE hasn't told anyone how to tackle PW/AV doesn't make it ok to attack SE because you had the patience (Or no life) to sit there for 18 hours of your day and do this.

When someone figures the strategy out, i'm almost certain these fights wont touch the 8 hour mark. If i'm wrong, so be it, but untill someone figures out the strategy and takes AV down smoothly, i still believe SE NEVER intended for a bunch of people to fight an NM for 18 hours straight, use your common sense in this issue.

Even if they did, you must ask yourself, is it fucking worth it?

No, it's not. So stop whining and either get on with it, or don't.

[Deeke]

With regards to the '18-hour AV battle', since news of it has obviously spread.

For those that haven't read the actual passages in which this was mentioned, here are the AV-relevant comments from FFXIclopedia's Ganiman in his post-Summit forum thread so that you can form your own opinions upon it within the only applicable context:

At dinner I briefly spoke with Sundi and Mocchi about Absolute Virtue. Mocchi plays FFXI a lot, and so I asked if his linkshell has ever attempted or beaten Absolute Virtue. He said that they gave trying up a long time ago. Sundi and Mocchi assured me the key to defeated AV was definitely in the video. Sundi also mentioned that AV is about an 18 hour battle - not including the time it takes to kill Jailer of Love. He said if you get really lucky with the order in which AV uses it's abilities you may get it down to a 9 or 10 hour battle. This explains why so many people can use their 2 hour multiple times in the course of the battle as shown in the video they created. Knowing the estimated length of a complete AV battle, it may be worth going back and re-analyzing the video for clues.

And in a subsequent post, Ganiman mentioned this:

Don't know if I mentioned this or if was said elsewhere... Sundi and Mocchi also told me that they are adjusting the pop on AV so that it will pop more enough than it does now. That is the only planned AV adjustment.

So to Vivi and your "No, 8-10 is intended. 18+ Hours is your choice." -- I am really uncertain upon what basis you're able to say this with so much authority.

EDIT: Tomato Ketchup

[Guitarman]

Thank you, Deeke. Exactly the article i was looking for.

i still believe SE NEVER intended for a bunch of people to fight an NM for 18 hours straight, use your common sense in this issue.

Obviously, you have none. If it comes straight from the head honcho himself, it was meant to be this way. Does it make sense? Fuck no. But you can't argue against what someone who knows firsthand and works at SE tells you.

[Kimiko]

Seriously, SE has gone too far this time. Forcing fights like this down our collective throats, first AV and now PW... this is going to obscene ends. Honestly it's time for the endgame community as a whole to put an end to this epic level bullshit.

[Grieverao]

As much of an accomplishment it may be or seem to some people. I spend the most of my logged-in time AFK at work or with family.

AV and PW? count me out.

A Ninurta's Sash isn't worth my health.

[Tempyst]

Seriously, SE has gone too far this time. Forcing fights like this down our collective throats

you don't have to fight them

[Maxxthepenguin]

Seriously, SE has gone too far this time. Forcing fights like this down our collective throats, first AV and now PW... this is going to obscene ends. Honestly it's time for the endgame community as a whole to put an end to this epic level bullshit.

Hey, you're the one with connections to somebody with real power in the gaming magazine world. Get the milkman on BG's side, that would be an epic victory.

[Maxxthepenguin]

http://kotaku.com/5036371/final-fant...-hours-to-beat

Kotaku'd

[Xno Kappa]

Wow this situation is getting serious lol. It'd be hilarious if there's an emergency patch announced soon.

[Koeta]

Would be pretty Epic if they patched AV and PW after word gets out about the stupidly long "HNM" fights in this game.

but doubt they will ever fix AV.

[Tekki]

I'm severely disappointed, yet not surprised that this AV/PW situation has gotten to this point. It'll be bad if SE waits until the overly negative bad parts of their game hit mainstream articles before they actually do something about it.

[Viviton]

I'm not an adamant follower of every ffxi article written and don't neccassarily care what is said in these interviews. But obviously i was wrong in my analysis that SE aren't stupid enough to make an 18 hour fight, because they obviously have.

So, either SE are really retarded, or Sundi's hiding the gimmick more cleverly then we first anticipated...

[kayn]

Thanks for posting this article outside of the PW thread. I'd have missed it otherwise. And to those debating the fight, please keep those posts in the PW thread. That's what it's for.

[Grieverao]

18 game hours maybe?

I doubt even the hardcore JP playerbase can stand 18 hours on the same fight.
Heck most ppl can't hack 3 hours in Dynamis without at least one 1-5min afk.

Tbh I think there's a very subtle message somewhere regarding killing these 2 quicker. And noone has picked up on it yet.

[Khrno]

It has been posted on GAF too.