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  1. #1
    Old Merits
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    Hello Square....

    I am a fan of bringing problems to SE´s attention that are still common and destroying the fun and fairness of the game. Last thing was helping with Pandemonium Warden, AV and ???-respawn but.....

    The Fan Festival T-Shirt is a great idea. But a T-Shirt has a front and a back: P. Ideas for the back or possible arguments for an Interview or questions at the Fan Festival can go in this Thread. If no Interview is happening I will once again try to bring this to SE´s attention but with a different view. I am constantly talking to Linkshells on my server not involved in using third party tools and hardcore camping and we all feel there has to be done something now. Not just because of third party tools and hardcore camping, but the fact that demand is a lot higher then the supply.

    The problems that are still taking the fun and fairness away from the game. Of course there are still other problems like many events should be instanced as they are causing problems between people. (Current Nyzul Island spam, Dynamis Jack, Limbus) Anyway as some might have guessed I want to go one more time for HNMs in FFXI.

    Now to the problem
    Camping 2003 and 2005-2008
    The past 2003
    • In the beginning of Final Fantasy XI the design to fight HNMs was perfect.
    • Demand and ability to fight such monsters was low.
    • Most people had not more then 2 jobs at 75.
    • Hardcore* camping was not necessary.
    • Cheating to claim was no big problem.
    • The monsters were a challenge.
    • Not many Linkshells camped.
    • Some NMs were unclaimed for minutes or hours.
    • Some fights took up to some hours.
    • Linkshells needed 18 or more people to kill HNMs.
    • Demand was medium; supply was low of Items
    *Camping every day, or for hours in an area doing absolutely nothing.


    The Present 2008
    • The design of none instanced HNMs is no longer working well. (Well it does for those that can play all day long or/and use cheats to claim)
    • Mass recruiting to be able to camp as much as possible and many HNMs as possible.
    • Many people have many jobs to 75.
    • People have second accounts with many jobs to 75, wanting gear for those also.
    • Hardcore camping is a must. (Camping till HNMs pop with holding parties)
    • Cheating (use of 3rd party tools) is a big problem.
    • HNMs are being farmed for the whole purpose to sell the drops and abusing the ability to claim with 3rd party programmes.
    • The monsters are less challenging (especially to those fighting them 50 times per year).
    • Many Linkshells are camping every day, even more Linkshells gave up camping due to cheating and monopolisation.
    • All HNMs under high demand get claimed within seconds.
    • Most fights take minutes or under 1 hour.
    • Most people can kill HNMs with 9 people in less than 30 minutes.
    • Demand is very high; supply remains low of Items

    Looking at a few HNMs
    Examples of HNMs under high demand due to their sellable drops or good gear:
    • Tiamat
    --drops (Herald Gaiters) get sold after most kills—
    • Cerberus
    --Algol + Cerberus Hide and Claw--
    --Linkshells are selling Algol for 4.000.000Gil+--
    • Khimaira
    --Hauteclaire, Seveneyes--
    • 3 Kings*
    --Linkshells on some servers even camp hardcore for Adamantoise, Dragon´s Aery is being cheated like crazy—fair playing Linkshells don’t even go there--
    • Dark Ixion
    ---This design is a good step, but again we encounter the same Linkshells killing Dark Ixion over and over, because they have the people with enough time to search all areas for the NM being up or not---
    --Ixion Cloak/Ixion Cape/Hermes Sandals are being monopolised--One JP Linkshell on Bahamut has gotten over 40 drops of all and don’t need them.
    *3 Kings are the NMs in Valley of Sorrows, Behemoth’s Dominion and Dragon’s Aery.

    Problems
    A. Most drops are not going to the people fighting those monsters, they are getting sold for crazy high prices, and maybe a reason some people have to RMT? Because they are not able to afford those Items otherwise?

    B. People have to stand around for some NMs(Cerberus, Tiamat, ECT) up to 24 hours or sometimes longer doing nothing to be able to fight a monster and even worse not claiming it at the end! We say: “No”. The respawn times for those monsters are too long. Linkshell A and B that are able to camp 12-24+ hours those NMs force other Linkshell C and D to do the same if Linkshell C and D want to have a chance in fighting those monsters too.

    C. Again we encounter time being wasted by having to camp up to 3 hours the mentioned 3 Kings*. Here is a graphic from the Interview at Games Convention 2007.
    http://freenet-homepage.de/DiamantLS.../bg3kings2.JPG
    *3 Kings are the NMs in Valley of Sorrows, Behemoth´s Dominion and Dragon´s Aery.

    D. Challenge of the fights. Especially the 3 Kings are too easy these days for the Linkshells that fight those NMs over and over. Here is a graphic from the Games Convention 2007.
    http://freenet-homepage.de/DiamantLS...rewardsjpg.JPG

    E. People are levelling constantly jobs to 75. People even have second or third account with jobs with 2 or more jobs at 75. This results in a never ending circle of wanting to gear up those accounts too.

    Previous Interviews
    2006 Interview: http://bluegartr.com/forum/showthrea...ight=Interview
    2007 Interview: http://bluegartr.com/forum/showthrea...ight=Interview
    2008 Q&A: http://bluegartr.com/forum/showthrea...ight=Interview

    Especially the Interview from 2006 was looking good, that changes will be done. (Question 2 in the 2nd part), but now 2.5 years later we are still sitting here looking at the same problem.

    Communication with Square Enix:
    3+ years of asking for a change has resulted in nothing. Latest answer of Square Enix was, if people continue to complain about something, then they will once again look into it and think about a change.

    Aware of the problem
    We think Square Enix is not aware of the real problem. The problem is the use of 3rd party tools, the monopolization, the selling of rare/ex Items, the time involved to camping. As for the time having to spend these days : You can’t do anything but stare at a screen is the reason many costumers of Final Fantasy 11 stopped playing the game and moved on to other games.

    Possible solutions
    Dear Square Enix, we are no longer in the year 2003. Please make this game enjoyable for everyone the same. Fighting HNMs in this game is one of the best things to do. Right now this is restricted to Linkshells (people) that have the time to play every day many hours or are able to cheat the claim of HNMs.

    Solution Ideas
    A. Additional instanced fights?
    B. A similar new system like Zeni?
    C. Adjust the claim system?
    D. Change respawn times?
    E. Other solution?

    Solution Part I
    Moving drops under high demand to somewhere else or additionally to somewhere else?
    • Cerberus
    -----A. Remove Cerberus Hide and Claw from Cerberus, make it only drop Algol-----
    -----B. Move Algol to an instanced Cerberus fight (existing ZNM fight?)-----
    • Khimaira
    -----Move the drops to an instanced Khimaira fight (existing ZNM fight?)-----
    • Tiamat
    -----Move Herald Gaiters to a new BC – Make Tiamat drop new rare/ex Gaiters-----
    • 3 Kings+Dark Ixion
    -----See other solutions-----

    Respawn Timer
    Why do those respawn times have to be so long? Herald Gaiters, Algol, Seveneyes, Hauteclaire are not such strong Items like Ridill, Defending ring or Adaman Hauberk.
    With raising demand, the supply should raise also.

    Solutions Part II
    ZNM
    The introduction of ZNMs was great. Awesome idea, awesome concept. Everyone has the same chance to get those Items. There are strong Items included and everyone is able to farm them. (I am not going to start with Pandemonium Warden here )

    We want more systems like ZNM (Tier 4), ENMs, Instanced Fights (Bahamut V2, Ouryu, KS99). This is the right way to keep the playerbase interested and everything fair. This is the right way to keep your costumers as long as possible.

    Why not make similar systems for every Expansion pack? (Wing of the Goddess and Chains of Promathia)

    A. New ZNM System
    Alpha System: Similar ZNM System with other ways to obtain Alpha Points but at the end you are able to engage in Tier 4 Versions of the 3 Kings or other new Versions of NMs in old (Chains of Promathia) or new (Wings of the Goddess) Expansion areas.

    You will be teleported to areas looking like the original ones, giving people the same feeling to fight those NMs.

    B. New ENM, BCNM, Seal System
    Introduction of new Seals, those Seals can be used to fight clones of Dark Ixion, Odin ect such as Shadow Ixion, Frodo (Odin), Lady Tiamat and so on.

    Or make new instanced areas like ENM, BCNM to fight NMs.

    Conclusion
    Conclusion
    Dear Square Enix, please reconsider changing old content or implementing new ways to conquer existing problems. Ignoring the problem and the fact that only hardcore camping Linkshells and cheating people are having a high chance to fight most of those NMs is not a solution. You will not solve this problem with banning 20 people every 1 month. That is less then 1 person per server. At the same time 20 new accounts to cheat are created. We want to play and not stare at out screen. We want SE to reconsider this problem of 3rd party cheating and Items being under such high demand.

    A good way was to move drops from some HNMs under high demand to the Instanced Fight against Odin. But who is able to fight Odin regularly every few weeks? Estimated 90% of the Linkshells that camp those NMs regularly, those that got the experience and gear.

    If there is nothing done about the people farming those rare/ex Items and selling them or cheating to get claims, then additional ways to obtain those Items are needed.

    Please don’t just look and laugh about our concerns and graphics. You told us you will look into this problem in previous Interviews.
    http://freenet-homepage.de/DiamantLS/GC2007/Theend.JPG

    It is your step now Square Enix…

  2. #2
    Old Merits
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    Not wanted to send to Square Enix but comments from myself (Bercus) to you guys...

    T-Shirt or “Interview”
    Something that expresses we want something to be done about cheating claims, long respawn times and time wasted to camp.

    Of course this can be solved even better with an Interview from BG or a Premium site at the Fan Festival. It has to be a person that is able to express these concerns and problems.

    Time to bring back those graphics:
    http://freenet-homepage.de/DiamantLS...rewardsjpg.JPG
    http://freenet-homepage.de/DiamantLS.../bg3kings2.JPG

    Before I forget…
    Comments from smart people: “start camping if you want such Items” or pay the prices. Not every Linkshell is able to camp for days. Linkshells saying this are probably getting enough claims or are don’t care about camping. Still every Linkshell should have a chance to fight those NMs or have a chance on the drops without having to camp against 3rd party users or for hours of hours. This game is maybe at 60%+ of its life. 2-3 more years and we will have a lot less players. Yes blabla not every Linkshells is cheating. Maybe, maybe not. I am sure we all agree everyone would be happy to fight all those HNMs and not just some stupid clones like in KS99.

  3. #3
    Relic Horn
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    Old issue is old - Lets talk about Alexandrites and Offhand Relic Nerf

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lyramion View Post
    Old issue is old - Lets talk about Alexandrites and Offhand Relic Nerf
    Yes those issues are old, however they are still problems. How can you expect SE to fix new issues if they blindside issues that have existed for years.

  5. #5
    Banned.

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    Get them to tell us how AV is killed, make 4 sins 100% drop, add 2 king abjs, one 100% and one with the same chance there is now for a second, Ridill/Dring/7eyes/hauteclaire with the current drop rate, put a fucking bow on it, endgame is fixed

  6. #6
    The Mizzle Fizzle of Nikkei's Haremizzle

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    LOL @ Sundi and his cronies laughing at the illustration, thats really messed up. QQ

    That begs the question, does he "know" what funny is?

    I am glad that someone is at least consistent about trying to get SE's attention, so thanks for that Bercus. I agree with Hanyoko 100%, they are old indeed but here we are years later still having the SAME debate and STILL trying to get a valid response in regards to this issue instead of the standard cookie cutter "I don't know" or "we will look into this further" responses we have been force fed for seemingly forever.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert Mk. 4 View Post
    Get them to tell us how AV is killed, make 4 sins 100% drop, add 2 king abjs, one 100% and one with the same chance there is now for a second, Ridill/Dring/7eyes/hauteclaire with the current drop rate, put a fucking bow on it, endgame is fixed
    Yeah endgame would be completely fixed with this. Not like sea would be overcrowded or something like that then. Totally not, yeah this would completely fix endgame. Damn why did we not think about this. If your not serious about posting stuff, please don´t post anything at all.

    PS: I will delete all stupid posts.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mizango View Post
    LOL @ Sundi and his cronies laughing at the illustration, thats really messed up. QQ

    That begs the question, does he "know" what funny is?

    I am glad that someone is at least consistent about trying to get SE's attention, so thanks for that Bercus. I agree with Hanyoko 100%, they are old indeed but here we are years later still having the SAME debate and STILL trying to get a valid response in regards to this issue instead of the standard cookie cutter "I don't know" or "we will look into this further" responses we have been force fed for seemingly forever.
    Well they were not really laughing about the graphics, but they make us feel like they do, because nothing has been done in 3 years and they SAID they will do something 2006. I think this picture was the part I said I should start working for them--No it actually wouldn´t be good. Anyway yes what I posted is old, very old, too old. Old enough to get finally fixed, just like Outposts, finally Level Sync, Auto Sort (it is ok for those not using Windower), Windowed Mode, Increased Dynamis drop rates and more. Sure Alexandrites is also a "problem". It is way too much Alexandrites needed to upgrade Nyzul Relics. But if previous stuff had to wait years, Alexandrites can wait for another Version Update for sure . Not like anyone will fill all requirements within next 3 months or at least not like anyone can´t wait a bit longer. If it remains 30.000 then well... we can still discuss.

  9. #9
    Banned.

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    i'm sure to morph into robert mk. 5 here in the next few hours, so i leave you with this tidbit, ` != '

  10. #10
    New Odin
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    I thought Einherjar was SE's answer to the problem? D:

  11. #11
    Salvage Bans
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    Make T3 Ein drop rare abjs (1 or 2 only) with a high %, not this 1% bullshit. I've personally never seen an Abj drop in Ein at all aside from Odin. I've also never seen Wootz ingots or Star sapphires or all this other stuff they claim is in there.

    I disagree with the difficulty/reward diagram. Khim's difficulty in stars is ok, but the reward is more like a quarter star, if that. The drop rate for Hauteclaire is so low, it's disgusting, we are something like 2/40 on it, and to be frank it is a waste of time to kill/camp with that droprate.

    Faf should be more like 3.5-4 stars, and Nid should be 5. With Nid you are guaranteed 1 of the best abjurations in the game. Faf guarantees nothing good.

  12. #12
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    The graphic can still be remade. Maybe Lordwafik, who I think made this one, can redo one?

  13. #13
    Yoshi P
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    Agreed, Fafnir's reward is way too high now (maybe it used to be 5 stars, but not anymore). Should be MAYBE 3.

    And if we're going by drop rate (as KB suggests) you should pretty much make Khimaira's reward non-existent.

  14. #14
    Sea Torques
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    I dont think that making everything either increase drop rate or make it rare/ex items will work as everyone wants it. Some linkshells base their whole LS around selling drops and not giving to members and their members just buy the drops from the LS at a reduced rate.

    Solutions:

    For me, i truthfully think that SE just needs to add more NMs with more items that people actually want. In the last expansion they added what, 2 HNMs? (Three inside Sandworm aside because you can only claim Sandworm) If they added a lot more HNM's, linkshells (no matter how big they are) will not be able to monopolize them. Add a really amazing drop to every NM so non get ignored. When i use to play Everquest, that game had zones that were just NMs that you needed to complete a quest to get a key to even zone in. If they made something like that where there are just a lot more NM that people want to camp, no one will be able to monopolize.

  15. #15
    Yoshi P
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    I agree. For the next expansion, they should add about 20 zones and have worldspawn HNMs in at least half of them. Each one should be on a 21-24 repop timer and have at least one good drop and 1-2 mediocre sellable drops, preferably more. If this were to happen, you'd always have some HNM, somewhere, up and unclaimed.

  16. #16
    New Odin
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    I agree that SE at this point should just continue the ZNM system and make pop items for similar named monsters that drop what the world spawns drop.

    The world spawns are are all jokes (some tier 3 ZNM pops are harder than world spawns to put things into perspective) and players either never get to fight them or they are botted to hell - its just not worth it for half the HNMs that have at best 1-2 coveted drops and be so pathetically easy to monopolize.

    A Solution:

    Charge high ZNM prices and a 1-3 day restriction on replacement HNM pops that require a special r/ex item off certain monster types for an instanced battle. (Everyone who enters the instanced HNM cannot do that instance again for the 1-3 day timer, like Dynamis)

    *(Sanraku usually just hands out an item for zeni, for these let him make you fetch some ingredient/s to complete the pop item plus your zeni deduction)

    The instance/popped HNMs would make it much easier to make creative battles where SE could make the battles harder and rewarding with room for new items on top of the old. This helps to diffuse demand for the World spawns while at the same time keeping the 'timesink' intact so people dont blow through it.

    Example: King Behemoth - 10-15k Zeni + *insert an item from a WoTG area here, low drop rate* = Spawn item for the 'new' King Behemoth.

    Take King Behemoth spawn item to say.... La Vaule [S] and the battle begins. Buff King Behemoth, give him some Thunder spells or something + signature Meteor and voila you've reinvented kings while leaving whats in place alone.

    Another example: Aspidochelone - 10-15k Zeni + *insert an item off say... Peistes in WoTG at a low drop rate* = Aspidochelone pop item.

    Take pop item to Beadeaux [S] and there goes your buffed up Aspidochelone, complete with Water spells, shell-in-regen goodness and perhaps some new tricks up his sleeve.

    Alternatively you could have players kill the NQ forms (popped Fafnir/Adamantoise/Behemoth) which also cost zeni but dont require a farmed item to pop as a prerequisite to pop the HQ versions. (Using the seal system in place + items Sanraku asks for to create your HQ pop item)

  17. #17
    Fake Numbers
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    If Einherjar was SE's intended solution to kings, I would like to see a possibility of Ridill and Defending Ring dropping in the valhalla/weapon slot. They can keep it the same super low drop rate and even add in Sipar if they want to complete the triangle - don't really care. Would just like to see another way to obtain this stuff that involves playing.

  18. #18
    Yoshi P
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    That's amazing and beautiful.

    Also, to the guy posting above you - that would just make Piestes and other WoTG mobs super contested. Instead, they could charge like 10,000 WoTG-zeni equivalent (since they don't do cross-expansion content, you'd have to make a new NPC in WoTG areas that operates like Sanraku) and an additional 20,000 Allied Notes (to make people do Campaign more!).

  19. #19
    Relic Shield
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    You absolutely have to impress upon them that instanced versions of kings and other HNMs have to drop the same items. We've said we wanted "the experience" of fighting these mobs without dealing with camping conditions before, and they responded with stuff like Nyzul and Einherjar, giving us similar mobs without all of the same loot.

    State it very clearly: Until the day that Ridill and Defending Ring are available from instanced content, the kings system is still broken. Ditto for Hauteclaire and Herald's Gaiters.

  20. #20
    E. Body
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    looks very good and I agree with it on just about all the points, but one HNM missing from the list you forgot sandworm which step in right way like Dark Ixion, but it still gets claimed very quickly, and like Dark Ixion a lot of it's drops get camped to be sold and pretty heavily camped on levi.

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