This is the advanced forums and I'm a shark.
You're an idiot NOM NOM NOM. You dont suddenly make a mage a front line job that continues to do his "backline" duties by giving said mage higher melee skills. In no way, shape, or form.
Actually, I'd rather use Warlock's and Wizard's while nuking, and Healer's and Evoker's while resting. You really, really underestimate the MAcc bonus Warlock's Roll gives. And you're overestimating the difficulty of landing threnody. Put the best 4 blms you have, and the best brd and cor, and let that cor boost them with warlock's. Its not a hard concept, and you have blms with supermp, low resist, high MAB, and superbard. The only skill piece I wear on ouryu is wizard's gloves +1, and my nuking is beautiful.
http://onni.jkl.fi/~lauri/kuvia/not_...hit_again.jpeg
Who let the retard out of his cage again?
So what's the point of those people that are complaining about a RDM and WHM update, you guys will just leave the game? Cause that update is comming. Instead of losing people time with complain, propose usefull things or don't say anything.
And if you have to search the jobs that waited for a very long time now to get an adjustments are: RDM and NIN. Yes someone could say they are one of the strongest jobs in the game that is why, and yes I'm agree since SE said it. But it's false to say they don't need "anything", especially after waiting for so long.Yes someone could say they are one of the strongest jobs in the game that is why, and yes I'm agree since SE said it.and yes I'm agree since SE said it.
It's like the Kuno's SMN thread all over again! What's with people trying to do it all?Yes RDM was meant to be versatile, my point is he can still do his "backline" duties to the front, why he isn't? or because he got too much things to cast, but main reason is... cause his melee abilities are not enough especially on high level monsters such we see in end-game.
The central role of RDM is to enfeeble the mob while enhancing the abilities of the party. It's only capable of performing other roles because the abilities it receives as a supporter allow it to do so. RDM has access to cure spells, but the main reason it plays a healer is because of the enhancements it provides. RDM also has access to nukes, but it doesn't use them as often. Why? Because the enhancements it provides aren't geared towards better nuke DMG. At least that's how I understand the situation.My point is, since that job exist, we mainly saw the backline part of rdm. Seriously for all the people that played other FF versions, the RDM in FFXI right now is not a RDM, or i should say is not a complete RDM, but some kind of a glorified WHM/BLM or BLM/WHM, can we at least agree on that?
RDM doesn't need buffs since it's perfectly capable of finding a place in almost every event in FFXI, whether that be merits or HNMs. Would it be nice for RDM to have buffs? Yes. Is it necessary? No.
Your justification that RDM should be in the frontlines because of the introduction of SCH is ridiculous. I could make a similar assertion and say RDM should stay in the backlines because of the introduction of BLU.
I've got it! WHM's new ability! Each hit the WHM lands lowers damage from the mob by 2%, like Damage Taken -% gear, and stackable!
You are an idiot, because actually most people realised it. RDM need an update because SE need to accentuate the difference between SCH and RDM.
And what you said about rdm healing is completely false, people ask RDM to heal not because of the "enhancements" it provide, but because he got the mp recovery tool to keep healing for a long time, wich are refresh and convert merits. You want healing magic enhanced? it's called SCH, that job use abilities to enhance effect of spells.
For fuck's sake, I don't give a shit what you have to say, but learn to fucking quote properly so it's not a total pain in the ass to read your responses and what you are responding to.
Anyways as a RDM(and yes one who melees often and has a large amount of dedicated melee RDM gear) I will say this:
For starters, Death Blossom is just not as awesome as some of you think it is. I have played a lot with using Death Blossom to attempt to debuff high-end mobs without the use of staves when I would normally need the staves. Guess what? It doesn't work that well, and I end up having to swap to HQ staves anyways after blowing loads of MP on Slow II's that don't want to land without them. And it doesn't come close to Warlock's Roll, I can tell you that from experience as well.
Secondly, there are two large issues that take away from the viability of using RDM in the ways that posters like Ahlah propose(also you are a fucking moron and I have yet to see you not totally shit up any thread you've ever posted on, but thanks for not bringing up AV here at least).
The first one is that a properly geared RDM does not have inventory room for full melee gear. I know this for damn sure. Even with only carrying 2 staves on me, I am unable to fit both my full TP and WS sets along with my normal casting gear using the available inventory slots. It just doesn't happen. If you can fit full TP and WS gear as RDM, your casting gear is gimped and missing some pieces.
The second issue is that even with full melee gear, a RDM who is playing the job the way you should be with keeping up on your debuffing and support duties, gaining TP is not as fast as you make it out to be. I have a very strong TP setup, max Sword merits, and get HQ Sushi, but between the fact that just keeping myself buffed and keeping up with other RDM duties keeps me damn nearly constantly casting and interrupting my swings, and even if you solve the native Accuracy problems of being a RDM, you still are stuck with low attack, because you just can't pile on loads of both. The best gear for each share the same slots, and against a real high-end mob you're going to hit for 0. Often. I know because I've tried, over and over again.
And even all of this is aside from the fact that if for some reason the HNM in question does some sort of devastating move that wipes the frontline, who is supposed to be the main backup job capable of doing something in a pinch to hold the group over until recovery? The RDM.
While I'm stoked that S-E is going to give RDM something for the first time since Refresh that isn't a Gravity nerf, honestly, and this is being said as a melee RDM, I don't want a melee update. Give me a retooling of HNMs' debuff resistance instead, make it so that I can actually land something on a Hydra, or a Khim, or wtfever without needing ES. Let me actually use my specialty, instead of just being best utilized by casting Refresh and Haste.
man no one commented on this a few pages back?BRD to setup proper ES elegy build
wtf does a brd need for setting up an ES elegy build?
you don't need high skill or high chr when you do ES elegy, the ES basically overwrites your skill, and chr has no effect on potency
my 64 brd can land ES elegy on HNMs, the only problem is I don't have Troubadour.
"ES build" for brd, shitcocks
COR and BRD enhances the abilities of the party, RDM just weakens the mob. (Say nothing of Phalanx II) RDM plays healer because it has Refresh and Convert, so it can keep up with healing, and it has access to Cure IV. Give PLD more MP and a backup like a BRD or RDM, and I'm sure they could main heal. (PLD/SCH mebbeh, eh just screw it)The central role of RDM is to enfeeble the mob while enhancing the abilities of the party. It's only capable of performing other roles because the abilities it receives as a supporter allow it to do so. RDM has access to cure spells, but the main reason it plays a healer is because of the enhancements it provides. RDM also has access to nukes, but it doesn't use them as often. Why? Because the enhancements it provides aren't geared towards better nuke DMG. At least that's how I understand the situation.
Because RDM doesn't get an invite to a party with a PLD and WHM til after they've thrown a couple points at group 2.And what you said about rdm healing is completely false, people ask RDM to heal not because of the "enhancements" it provide, but because he got the mp recovery tool to keep healing for a long time, wich are refresh and convert merits. You want healing magic enhanced? it's called SCH, that job use abilities to enhance effect of spells.
Also, an idea, more of an afterthought. Give Sublimation to WHM38, and give SCH a different ability. The MP you save from strategems/arts/conserve mp gets collects in a tank, more like duplicated into a tank, and you use the proper /ja to get that mp. They can call it "House Rules - Free Parking", but with blackjack, and hookers.
You're right RDMs play their support role mostly by enfeebling them mob. He said that RDM is currently nothing but a glorified WHM or BLM. I was saying that RDM isn't just a glorified WHM or BLM, it's a support role. However, if I say that I have to justify why RDM leans towards the healing role more often than the nuking role, which is why I refer to RDM's enhancements. I doubt that RDM would be a stronger healer without the ability to haste/refresh itself. Convert is good for doubling up on MP, but I doubt that alone would make RDM healing as potent as it is now. BLU has access to Cure 3-4 on its own, but it doesn't heal as often as RDM. Why? Enhancements/Enfeebles/Convert. Take away an RDM's ability to enhance/enfeeble and its competitiveness against WHM isn't as threatening.
Why is all this important? Because it shows that RDM's competitiveness against WHM is driven by its core-role as a supporter. Since its core-role is a supporter, it doesn't need melee enhancements as he suggests.
Simply put:
- RDM is a good healer because it has access to Cure IV and its ability to refresh (Which is an enhancement and is apart of its support role)
- RDM is not a good replacement for BLM because its role as a support have no impact on nuking damage.
- RDM is a supporter not a super hybrid
- It performs its role as a support decently
- RDM doesn't need a buff
Before quoting someone, make sure you read the person he quoted. If you read my comment again I never said refresh is "not" an enhancing spell fucking mollusc. The guy said: RDM has access to cure spells, but the main reason it plays a healer is because of the enhancements it provides.
I replied and said, people ask RDM to main heal not because of "enhancements it provide", but because RDM can recover MP pretty easily. it have nothing to do with his healing potency or anything else. Oh yes we can say that RDM healing is decent, I'm agree. But we were talking about the "main reason" that make RDM good on main healing.
En-spells, Phalanx, Stoneskin, bar-spells, and Aquaviel are enhancement spells also; people don't invite RDMs for those spells. People invite them because they can keep up their MP pool. The how doesn't matter.
RDM does need a boost, it has not changed since 2004. (Tier 2 merits do not count, they are all spells that have existed in the DAT files for years now.) All jobs need changes from time to time to keep them from being boring and stale. And right now, RDM is very, very stale and boring.
tank and it becomes fun :D
What I stated did not suggest that people invite RDM for every single enhancement they have. However, because of a few enhancements it can provide (Though Refresh is probably the only needed one), it can play the healer role. I'll go along with what you say and agree that they're invited for their ability to keep up their MP pool. However, how do they achieve this? Through Refresh, which is an enhancing magic.RDM has access to cure spells, but the main reason it plays a healer is because of the enhancements it provides.
Well that's just a difference in our views of "need". To me, RDM doesn't need a boost because it's positively viewed in the EG/HNM/Merit scenario. You suggest it needs an improvement to keep it fresh. If taken from your point of view then I'll agree that RDM and a bunch of other classes need improvement, but I don't share that view.RDM does need a boost, it has not changed since 2004. (Tier 2 merits do not count, they are all spells that have existed in the DAT files for years now.) All jobs need changes from time to time to keep them from being boring and stale. And right now, RDM is very, very stale and boring.
Edit: If RDM needed a tweak, I wouldn't suggest that it be increasing RDM's melee potential as was suggested. I would however, look into increasing RDM's enfeebling list and maybe even boosting their potential.