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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by FailureMidgard View Post
    Huh? Body Slam is as stunnable if not more stunnable because people are scared of it than Fluid Spread. I still say /nin is fine in Ein, but they aren't that different...if someone is using a "stun 100% of them" argument for Fluid Spread, it'll be applied here.
    actually Im more concerned about body slam than slimes. They litterally spam it even with stunners, its easilly 1K aoe dmg, and generally brds/mages are the first to die ( and we hardly bring any BLms on wing 3s). but those drg also do the superstrong curse move that drops your HP 300. I dont sub war anymore in einherjar ( wing 3) due to the possibility to have those mobs, its easy enough to win with NIN most of the time anyway.

  2. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZhiGaruda View Post

    tl;dr My Einherjar shell runs with 36 people, and so we can afford to have all of our members taking tons of damage and generally sucking at this game, and no one really notices because there are 35 other people to back them up.

    Are you seriously going to cite efficiency when you are doing runs with 36 people? Really?
    Wait wait, you're trying to say that not using the maximum amount of people that the zone allows isn't efficient? Reeeeally? Do you not know what efficient means or something? Why would you do something that takes more time and has higher risk with 20 people when you have 36 available?

    To say you have more skill?

    Please. don't kid yourself son.

  3. #43
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    I'm too lazy to read that shit, all I know is you say "/nin is retarded", and you've lost your argument.

    Since this has seemed to fall towards Einherjar, it puts you at a greater disadvantage because the sheer randomness advocates usage of GUARANTEED defensive measures. Third Eye is random, and is more prone to failure (I'm looking at you TP moves). And yes, I dont care what you say, TP moves exist, they get off, they land, they are not 100% stunned for a 30 minute event.

    Show me a 30 minute event where every TP move is magically (by magic I mean your leprechaun world) pre-stunned and I will eat a bloody vagina.

  4. #44
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    First secret. Not every TP move needs to be stunned.

    Second Secret. There are very few mobs in einherjer that should not just drop dead when you breathe on them. Half of those mobs are cut out if you have good mages who aren't afk. The ones that generally live longer like slimes are dealt with accordingly to prevent shit from getting off, because if they get something off regardless of what you sub it slows down damage overall. Yeah, recasting utsusemi slows the process too down go figure.

    Third. If you're fighting shit like slimes and you're simply waiting for fluid spread instead of organizing some kind of /assist stun order, then you're doing it wrong. They don't take forever to kill. Then again, like I said, we run with a full group and have a lot of blm available on top of our full DD alliance. But hell, since DRKs should be fully buffed the whole run, a 3 DRK stun rotation is often more then enough to lock slimes for the majority of the time. At least enough to not make fluid spread a big problem since it's not like they spam.

    Most of the aoe that really sucks in einherjer bypasses utsusemi to begin with. I mean really, mow and fluid spread. Oh, and lolbodyslam. And mow doesn't even really hurt that bad.

    Like I said, maybe a reevaluation of what you're doing as a whole would change your perspective. Because yeah, playing ultra defensively when you don't need to is a far cry from efficient.

  5. #45
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    Those dragons are probably the einerjar mobs with the most HP they easilly last one minute with 15 dd on them. Now what about the lag. I don't think I've ever been to stun the explosions from bombs on BLMs or DRK, simply due to lag. My log says I stuned before, but the move still goes off. stop trying to justify /war. you bring 36, wtf do you care about war sub, ein is super easy with all dd /nin if you have that many.

  6. #46
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    Ah, all of us are doing it wrong because for whatever reason, we don't bring 36 people. Gotcha.

  7. #47

    Quote Originally Posted by jammalamma View Post
    Wait wait, you're trying to say that not using the maximum amount of people that the zone allows isn't efficient? Reeeeally? Do you not know what efficient means or something? Why would you do something that takes more time and has higher risk with 20 people when you have 36 available?

    To say you have more skill?

    Please. don't kid yourself son.
    Efficient means bringing a setup that wins 100% of the time. If you bring an army of SAM/WAR for an omg +10 damage globally, and get shit like dragons, you wipe like a piece of shit.

    Also you better have your best DDs /nin for the boss, they are no joke, but I guess it's ok If you don't pull hate in the first place. Inbefore PLD / chainspell stun and Behemoth.

  8. #48

    Quote Originally Posted by pchan View Post
    Efficient means bringing a setup that wins 100% of the time. If you bring an army of SAM/WAR for an omg +10 damage globally, and get shit like dragons, you wipe like a piece of shit.

    Also you better have your best DDs /nin for the boss, they are no joke, but I guess it's ok If you don't pull hate in the first place. Inbefore PLD / chainspell stun and Behemoth.
    A pchan post I didn't hate, wow.

  9. #49
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    Quote Originally Posted by jammalamma View Post
    First secret. Not every TP move needs to be stunned.
    Please please please someone tell me I'm not crazy when I say this, but you cant try to stun Fluid Spread. You can pre-stun and hope it uses Fluid Spread, but its fucking instantaneous.

  10. #50
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    You wipe.


    Like a piece of shit.

  11. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by pchan View Post
    Efficient means bringing a setup that wins 100% of the time. If you bring an army of SAM/WAR for an omg +10 damage globally, and get shit like dragons, you wipe like a piece of shit.

    Also you better have your best DDs /nin for the boss, they are no joke, but I guess it's ok If you don't pull hate in the first place. Inbefore PLD / chainspell stun and Behemoth.
    Pchan is on a roll tonight, seriously. This Jamma person is either a troll, or Stephano on a different account.

  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Despain View Post
    You wipe.


    Like a piece of shit.
    I saw that and the first thing that popped in my mind was: "How does shit wipe?"

  13. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by jammalamma View Post
    Wait wait, you're trying to say that not using the maximum amount of people that the zone allows isn't efficient? Reeeeally? Do you not know what efficient means or something? Why would you do something that takes more time and has higher risk with 20 people when you have 36 available?

    To say you have more skill?

    Please. don't kid yourself son.
    You are one of those people who bring 64 people to Dynamis cities, aren't you?

    You know you can clear Dyna-city with 12 people who DON'T SUCK? 12 people completely clearing, getting 20 pieces of AF, that is efficiency. Going with 64 and clearing with 2 hours left over, and still 20 pieces of AF, yeah bro, that's super efficient.

    Let me know how efficient you feel in 3 years when you still have a line for PUP hands.

  14. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by pchan View Post
    Efficient means bringing a setup that wins 100% of the time. If you bring an army of SAM/WAR for an omg +10 damage globally, and get shit like dragons, you wipe like a piece of shit.

    Also you better have your best DDs /nin for the boss, they are no joke, but I guess it's ok If you don't pull hate in the first place. Inbefore PLD / chainspell stun and Behemoth.
    Except, you don't wipe to dragons. Taking in 20 people is in no way more efficient than taking in 36 people if you have the people available to do it. If you really think so, then you need to get off the pride thing. It's like saying doing Jorm with 6 is more efficient than doing it with a group of 18. Sure, it can be done, but it is in no way whatsoever more efficient. Taking in anything less then the maximum amount of people when you can bring in the maximum amount of people is plain stupid.

    I pull hate on the bosses usually, unless I get like full dispelled from t1 malboro. I get cured. That's what the mages are there to do. There's no problems. If your mages can't handle doing a single cure 4, then yeah..There's a much bigger problem there than whatever SJ you're using.

    Kind of stupid you're assuming that people are playing at the lowest level on one end and the highest on the next.

    Quit pretending that /NIN prevents WHMs to having to do their job. We don't have MP problems for the DD alliance.

    As for the whole 64 people to city dynamis and clearing it with 12.

    If I took 64 people and could clear the zone in a quarter of the time it took you with 12, and for argument's sake let's say we got the same drops. Which is more efficient? It's a trick question. That means we can go do something else. And next when you say you could do multiple zones, if I could do the same all with 64 people, I'm still winning because then I can have that mass of people do other shit faster than you.

  15. #55
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    Despite all forms of MP refresh there are, MP is still a finite resource. Cure5 spam will eventually deplete a mana pool, and you'll die.

  16. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by jammalamma View Post
    Except, you don't wipe to dragons. Taking in 20 people is in no way more efficient than taking in 36 people if you have the people available to do it. If you really think so, then you need to get off the pride thing. It's like saying doing Jorm with 6 is more efficient than doing it with a group of 18. Sure, it can be done, but it is in no way whatsoever more efficient. Taking in anything less then the maximum amount of people when you can bring in the maximum amount of people is plain stupid.

    I pull hate on the bosses usually, unless I get like full dispelled from t1 malboro. I get cured. That's what the mages are there to do. There's no problems. If your mages can't handle doing a single cure 4, then yeah..There's a much bigger problem there than whatever SJ you're using.

    Kind of stupid you're assuming that people are playing at the lowest level on one end and the highest on the next.

    Quit pretending that /NIN prevents WHMs to having to do their job. We don't have MP problems for the DD alliance.

    As for the whole 64 people to city dynamis and clearing it with 12.

    If I took 64 people and could clear the zone in a quarter of the time it took you with 12, and for argument's sake let's say we got the same drops. Which is more efficient? It's a trick question.
    Again - you are misconstruing efficiency with overkill. THEY ARE DIFFERENT. Bring 36 who all want an EBody, and as such will take 100 Odin's..or bring 18 who all want EBody, and take 50. Both of them have 30 minute time limits, both can full clear tier1-3 and Odin without a hitch or an issue with time limits, one of them will be doing Einherjar until the day they die.

    Efficiency is just that - making everyone hit PEAK EFFICIENCY. 18 people completely maxing out their skill and abilities, damage, defensive capabilities, and still clearing area's that some people (like you, because you suck) need twice the people to do - THAT is efficiency.

  17. #57
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    The mob generally dies before then. But I guess fighting a t3 boss with 3 people would press you to the limit or something.

    How to deal with drops has nothing to do with the efficiency of the run. I mean, we only have like 5 people who want ebody out of the 36 we do einherjer with.

    36 people with max skills and abilities mean we don't miss a window of Nidhogg to claim and knock out that ebody compared to you who took less people to say you took less people but you're not clearing the run in 10-15 minutes. If you don't value time to do other shit, then sure you're fine. I value my time though. And we'd be doing einherjer anyway regardless if 36 or 0 people wanted a certain drop.

  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by jammalamma View Post
    The mob generally dies before then. But I guess fighting a t3 boss with 3 people would press you to the limit or something.
    I am efficient because I kill the mob with a horde of people before it has a chance to kill me. Why don't more people have alliance rotations at Fafnir? It's more efficient to have all the BLMs spam their MP until they die, and just rotate in a new party.

  19. #59
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    Wait, you can bring 36 people to Einherjar?

  20. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Despain View Post
    Wait, you can bring 36 people to Einherjar?
    http://www.savagechickens.com/images...efficiency.jpg

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