For BG fitness fanatics, a question..

[Weiing]

This isn't really relevant to the current topic I don't think, but I was curious as to how sodium works into a daily diet? After about 3 months of nothing but water and an occasional sweet tea, I've started to have a Dr. Pepper with my dinner each night, but it felt like it was starting to encourage me to let up more and more on what I was taking in each day. Because of that I recently switched to Diet Dr. Pepper when I remembered it doesn't taste that awful, but I've noticed the only thing in its nutritional value is about 55~mg of Sodium.

Is this a big deal? I've heard from a few sources not to drink much, if any, of your calories and that diet sodas were a bad idea, but with no real explanation as to why. I couldn't really say what my daily average sodium intake would be, but for the most part my diet is based around Light yogurt, oatmeal, granola and cereal, with my protein usually coming from dinner. This seems carb-heavy, yet low-calorie and I wasn't really sure how that worked out either considering it seems most of the diet and weight-loss discussions here have been based around overall calories.

Now that I write it out, it seems like I'm taking in a lot of sweetener substitutes lol.

Ok let's start with sodium!
It is said that the average daily intake should be around 2,400mg. Sodium is only really a cause for concern because of its correlation with hypertension/high blood pressure. I don't know exactly how or why...but apparently continually excessive sodium intake can make one more vulnerable to high blood pressure. It's very easy to go over 2,400mg. With that said, another reason why people like to control sodium is because too much may make them retain water... this especially upset people when they are trying to lose weight and see they aren't budging on the scale. But it may just because they had too much sodium intake one day and so their body is just retaining more fluid. (This is another reason why daily weighing of yourself isn't a good idea if you freak out about numbers.)

Everything has some sodium in it...processed/frozen foods usually have tons of sodium in order to maintain its flavor (which should be a red flag).

As for eh...drinking your calories. Yeah. It's just that you may be unaware of how much calories are in the thing you are drinking. This makes it really easy to exceed your daily caloric intake. It's the idea that, would you rather eat 400 calories of food that will keep you full for a long time or drink 400 calories of something that will probably not fill you up for a long time and then require you to eat an additional 400 calories? It's not that drinking things is bad, it's just you have to really be accurate in your measurements. 1 cup is really not a lot of fluid.

Artificial sweeteners as a whole is...well, obvious. It's artificial. Nothing really natural about it. Your body has no idea what to do with it, and can do weird things to your body. When I began my weight loss journey and overhauling my health/diet life, I stopped drinking soda to cut calories. I haven't had soda of any kind in about 1.75 years now. Don't miss it one bit. LIke Atreides said, honey is always good, especially raw honey. Agave nectar maybeeeeee. Maple syrup!

And yeah, lots of carbs in your diet. Seems almost contradictory to say high in carbs, low in calories, as those carbs usually are higher in calories. It makes you wonder how they make it so low calories, and if that's natural? I'm of a different diet philosophy as most people on the boards and most people in general... As I tout the whole high fat/high protein/low processed&grain carbs but eat as much veggie carbs you want. People probably think I'm crazy, weird, or almost fanatic about this eating style (they probably also want me to stop talking about it), but it's what I find to be the most effective and logical for me.

It's about calories to an extent. It's more about nutrients and eating healthy than it is about calories, I think. I rather have that 300 calorie cup of plain full fat greek yogurt (+protein powder mix and fruit) than a 70 calorie cup of light yogurt full of additives and other artificial things I have no idea. Then again, I never eat 1 cup of yogurt in a sitting...since it's too much yogurt at once. It's like those 0 calorie "salad dressings" or "peanut butter" from Walden Farms... Food has calories. If a 'food' doesn't have calories, what is it???

edit: and maybe I'm a conspiracy nut but I feel like diet soda is a myth and causes obesity more than regular soda does, but I could be crazy

I believe/agree with you.

[Fistandantilus]

@Odesseiron

I had a really long and well thought out post in response to you, and then my laptop froze up as I was about 3/4 of the way done. Way too lazy to repeat all that again so I'll just give a quick tl:dr

I agree with Weiin, you seem to know your body well and so the caloric intake for you isn't as worrisome as I thought after reading your earlier post. It's also good to hear that you aren't living on Lean Cuisines lol. You seem to have a system that works for you which is awesome. Everyone's bodies are different so knowing how to take care of yours individually is important. Sorry if I came off rude or harsh, I was worried that you were going all out for quick weight loss and weren't aware of the possible adverse effects. Instead your body just seems to be freakishly efficient, which makes me jealous.

Since you only recently started lifting, how much progress have you noticed with muscle building? It seems that you are able to get a lot of energy out of few calories, so that makes me curious if you're also able to build muscle quickly despite possibly lacking in protein intake. I'd be pretty interested in your metabolism numbers :3



Edit - I'd just like to state openly that I'm on the anti-diet soda bandwagon. Almost all soda's are completely unnatural and, just because they are 0 calories doesn't mean there isn't other unhealthy things inside that evil aluminum can. I never really drank diet, I drank regular soda til I was maybe 17 and then stopped once I started focusing on my health more. I really think that was the most important diet change I made, along with eliminating fast food entirely. Interestingly, my Dad who is in extremely good shape for his age (about 50) has been a very heavy Diet Coke drinker since I can remember, 15+ years for sure. I finally got him to quit a few months ago and he said that he feels so much better now that he's overhauled a lot of his diet as a result. Now he really goes out of his way to eat more natural foods instead of nasty frozen foods and other things loaded with artificial flavoring.

[Churchill]

@Drex: There are many forms of exercise that will build muscle and drop fat, and it's honestly heavily impacted by your diet.

@Headspace: I would suggest watching video's or a seminar by an instructor teaching olympic lifts or crossfit type stuff on youtube. I saw someone mentioned that hitting 90* isn't crucial...but that's incorrect. Unless you are injured, or doing a squat specifically intended to not go to 90*, or a one-legged squat where you aren't balanced enough to do it...then you are missing a large portion of the benefit of even doing squats.

The same person mentioned form being messed up quite often for squats...this is true, but many people don't understand the basis for why the form is messed up. If I had to describe it in steps...it would go as follows.

1. Jump up and down a few times and see where your feet land. This is the approximate width you want for doing a squat.

2. Cant your toes away from each other slightly

3. Practice doing squats without weight or with a PVC/Broomstick. Be aware of how your weight is distributed. It should be solely on your heels the entire repetition. ie, you should be able to complete the rep without weight with your toes off the ground, pointed up.

4. Imagine as you lower your torso, you are keeping your back straight, but however are moving your hips backwards or away from the center of your body. Practice doing this, with your weight on your heels (try doing them barefoot) and you should be set up better for success.

There are a few more minor things that would be considered correct, but yeah. Bottom line, if you don't go to 90* in the correct manner, you are missing a large majority of the benefits; benefits being testosterone production, abs engagement, hip flexor engagement, quad engagement. The more muscles you use, the stronger your core will become and the more calories you'll burn.

In general:
Stop cutting calories and learn about calories, lol. I know I am late and zone/paleo have had to have been mentioned, but they are seriously the best ways to "diet".

There are seminars on youtube from people instructing classes on the two, and I'm sure wiki has information as well (as far as alternate sources from their own webpages).

Another good tool is to get your bodyfat measured by a 'bodpod' or similar system which someone just mentioned their school did. It will tell you your mass, water mass, muscle, fat, bone, etc. It will also tell you how many calories a day you burn by doing absolutely nothing but laying down. This is crucial because it's a gauge for what you need to intake for losing or gaining weight.

[Caiyuo]

Ahhh I love this thread. Thanks Atreides and Weiing! It's awesome to have knowledgeable sources to ask about these random questions and clearing up misconceptions; kind of hard to google specific things and sift through like 9 random blog posts.

It is kind of a bummer after thinking I had a nice compromise going, but I'm happier to be informed about all this. I'm kind of leaning towards dropping these artificially sweetened options just because I lost the majority of the weight I wanted before I ever swapped to them and have been idling around the same weight now ever since. I couldn't really figure out why I might've "plateau'd" since I never really understood that concept so I ended up ramping up my daily activity which has mostly just led me to restrain eating too much after the fact.

I'm really going to have to just sift over this and the previous fitness thread and consider some changes; I haven't wanted to start working out again for fear of needing to eat more and bulk up since I'm really happy after dropping the "XI weight" lol, but it would be nice to put on muscle again.

[Mayareira]

I'm kind of leaning towards dropping these artificially sweetened options just because I lost the majority of the weight I wanted before I ever swapped to them and have been idling around the same weight now ever since.

There is always the good old tea option. Green tea is very healthy and tastes wonderful without adding any kind of sugar/sweetner.

[Fistandantilus]

Caiyou, I'm not sure if you are aware of this or not, but hitting plateau's is VERY common when working out. Your body starts to get into a routine and becomes more energy efficient and is able to store more, instead of burning it up from your exercise. This is why a lot of workout programs suggest to switch up your routine often. Don't think that if you hit a plateau you're doing something wrong, it's natural you just need to introduce your body to something it isn't so familiar with. It can be as simple as changing what type of cardio you do, or working the same muscle group with a slightly new exercise.

I'm currently doing p90x and there is specific phases to help combat plateauing, phase2 strengthens your body just as much as phase1, but you do slightly different exercises to keep your body from ever getting comfortable with your routine. It's like someone mentioned earlier about diet, instead of eating 2000 calories per day, it'd be better to do 1800 one day and 2200 the next. You never want your body to get too comfortable with your workout or you will start to see diminishing returns. It's best if your workout always seems difficult, once you get to the point of it being easy is when you should start looking for a way to spice it up.

[Caiyuo]

Thanks for that, I was never really sure about the concept of plateauing just because of how many misconceptions and flat-out wrong things people swear by, so it seemed like another one of those things to me originally. I still take most things on the internet, forums included, with a grain of salt (shh), but I can feel confident in a lot of what I read here. I understood that it occurred in strength training, but never thought about it in weight loss.

I lost all of about 20 pounds over the span of around 3-4 months simply cutting out soda, being more mindful of my diet and taking my dog on a 20 minute walk everyday. I eased up once I was more satisfied with my appearance which is when I started to allow myself some liberties (still walking everyday), but once I wanted to start losing again, I swapped to the artifically sweetened options and haven't had any loss since; I think I mentioned earlier this has been about a month now.

The artificial stuff seems like it just serves to make me lazier about my diet since I'm sure at some point I've said "between this cup of yogurt and coke, I've had zero calories" and ate something I normally wouldn't have.

There is always the good old tea option. Green tea is very healthy and tastes wonderful without adding any kind of sugar/sweetner.

Mhmm! That was one of my pillars originally, making it at home without added sugar. I used to think the Arizona green tea was a smart decision until I realized the fuckton amount of sugar added, waaay too late lol.

[Corrderio]

Mhmm! That was one of my pillars originally, making it at home without added sugar. I used to think the Arizona green tea was a smart decision until I realized the fuckton amount of sugar added, waaay too late lol.

Those Arizona tea things are always filled with a shitload of sugar and other bad crap. I just brew me a pitcher every now and then.

Anyway since this is about fitness... may as well throw a question in myself:

I don't have a lot of arm strength and was curious if anyone could give me some advice on how to build up some muscle there. I know weights are the usual way to go however the problem is my house is small so I have nowhere to put them. So is there any alternatives I can do for some strength training?

[Churchill]

Anyway since this is about fitness... may as well throw a question in myself:

I don't have a lot of arm strength and was curious if anyone could give me some advice on how to build up some muscle there. I know weights are the usual way to go however the problem is my house is small so I have nowhere to put them. So is there any alternatives I can do for some strength training?

Pullups, Deadlifts, Carries, Pushups, Swinging a Sledgehammer, Handstand Pushups

[Fistandantilus]

Thanks for that, I was never really sure about the concept of plateauing just because of how many misconceptions and flat-out wrong things people swear by, so it seemed like another one of those things to me originally. I still take most things on the internet, forums included, with a grain of salt (shh), but I can feel confident in a lot of what I read here. I understood that it occurred in strength training, but never thought about it in weight loss.

That's definitely a good thing, lol. It doesn't really help if you just take other peoples word for everything and do exactly what they say. Better to use advice as a starting point and then learn more about the topic so you can make your own informed decisions. Everyone's body is different so you have to find what works for you.

Corderio: Don't forget triceps :D Chair Dips aren't fun but you can do them about anywhere. You can use your own body weight for a lot of arm exercises actually. Push ups are really good, and there's tons of different variations to make sure you aren't just working the same few muscles.

[archibaldcrane]

edit: and maybe I'm a conspiracy nut but I feel like diet soda is a myth and causes obesity more than regular soda does, but I could be crazy

eh

My best friend drinks like 6-7 cans of diet pepsi a day, and well...
http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-..._7057876_n.jpg
(at his office - all his doing)

equals

Spoiler: show

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-..._6889763_n.jpg

Just one case, but if diet soda causes obesity, um...

[Fistandantilus]

I don't think he's saying that if you drink diet soda you will be obese. I do think it is very probable that it raises your chances though. You're buddy is jacked, he obviously has a very active lifestyle, most people who are drinking 6 cans of soda per day are not nearly that active.

[archibaldcrane]

I don't think he's saying that if you drink diet soda you will be obese. I do think it is very probable that it raises your chances though.

Vs. Water? Sure.

Vs. regular soda? No chance. I mainly think that railing against diet soda is the new thing that fat people do to pretend like the world is conspiring against their halfhearted attempts to lose weight.

[Tomk]

You can get your metabolism tested medically. My school offers these tests for like 20 bux for students. They'll tell you how much you burn in a day, and they also have people there to give you advice about how to go about losing, maintaining, or gaining weight.

There has to be something similar where you are. The test was called "medgem" or something like that. I found out that online calorie calculators were drastically underestimating my calories. They were telling me like 1600 per day for me to lose a pound of week, when it was really closer to 2300 for me to lose a pound a week.

Based on my personal experience with dieting, medgem's numbers were definitely more accurate than the online calculator.

Edit: Also, I can't remember why you said you're losing weight. If it's just for health or looks, then your goal should be a bodyfat percentage, not a weight. Weight is convenient because it's easier to measure accurately, but bodyfat percentage is a better gauge of your health and your looks.

I'll definitely look up that test.

As for the reason for my weight loss, my BMI is 31 and I'm not going to kid myself or you it's fat not muscle. So using weight as a standard right now isn't that big of a deal. When I get closer to my goal I can get more picky.

It's not like I ignore bodyfat. I take my measurements once a week when I weigh myself and record them. I am a little >30% right now.

Side note: I wasn't happy with the spreadsheet i was using to log my calories so I found an app for my blackberry. It's Livestrong and it seems cool so far. It's connected online to like 500,000 foods so a quick search and hit enter and you food is recorded. My only complaint so far is that you need to go online to record custom foods and input a custom calorie goal for the day. On the phone it picks your goal for you using info you put in. I had to chose a sedentary lifestyle to get the calorie amount I wanted.

[richardd]

eh, im a bit paranoid about the subject lol. if i ever drink ANYTHING with sugar, its either the OJ with the omega 3's in it (only if im geting sick really) or the diet green tea with ginseng and honey that you can buy fresh brewed at publix. has no syrup and little sugar compared to the canned ones.

i was extremely obese though lol. after losing about 170 lbs, i cant indulge on soda/whatever crap even once. stuff like that was an addiction to me. thats like giving your friend, who got out of rehab a shot of heroine or something, but food to me is a lot more dangerous just because fatties are way more accepted by society than some random guy sniffing a line of coke at the bathroom. and everyone, everywhere is indulging on it.

but its all a state of mind. im better than that, and mostly everything that i eat, i make at home lol. so after about 1 month, it doesnt even phase me anymore.

which is why.. i dont drink coke at all.. ever. not even diet. no coke and rum, i rather just drink it straight, and deal with the crap from the alky-hawl later. but thats just me. i almost dont remember what Sprite tastes like lol

[Weiing]

In general:
Stop cutting calories and learn about calories, lol. I know I am late and zone/paleo have had to have been mentioned, but they are seriously the best ways to "diet".

There are seminars on youtube from people instructing classes on the two, and I'm sure wiki has information as well (as far as alternate sources from their own webpages).

*Swinging a Sledgehammer*

Just wanted to say woo paleo/primal diet (I've mentioned many times)
But I agree with the whole cutting calorie thing...It's not really necessary. But I was afraid people wouldn't listen anyway, so never really said anything about that.

And I like how you said to swing a sledgehammer! I think you could be my new best friend (Or not...but still!)

[Woozie]

I'll definitely look up that test.

As for the reason for my weight loss, my BMI is 31 and I'm not going to kid myself or you it's fat not muscle. So using weight as a standard right now isn't that big of a deal. When I get closer to my goal I can get more picky.

It's not like I ignore bodyfat. I take my measurements once a week when I weigh myself and record them. I am a little >30% right now.

Side note: I wasn't happy with the spreadsheet i was using to log my calories so I found an app for my blackberry. It's Livestrong and it seems cool so far. It's connected online to like 500,000 foods so a quick search and hit enter and you food is recorded. My only complaint so far is that you need to go online to record custom foods and input a custom calorie goal for the day. On the phone it picks your goal for you using info you put in. I had to chose a sedentary lifestyle to get the calorie amount I wanted.

Are you weighing and measuring your portions? If not, the food calorie calculator could be underestimating your intake. For example, the chicken breasts I buy at the local grocery store are usually close to 6~8 ounces per half, but the serving size is only 4 ounces. So my calorie intake per breast half is higher than what I'd see if I looked up the nutritional data online. Does your blackberry app allow you to input the weight of the food you ate, or does it just ask you what the item was and assume you ate exactly x amount of servings?

Edit: As for the diet soda discussion

Diet soda is tastes horrible, and thus you shouldn't be drinking it anyways. End of discussion. No, it's not a matter of opinion. I'm right and if you disagree you're wrong. Stop being gimp and level your freakin taste buds.

[Atreides]

I agree that no diet plan or dietary changes or advice you get could possibly compare (in terms of long-term benefit) to learning about nutrition yourself. So many people have a hugely unrealistic idea of what 1 "portion" should be that they end up overeating simply because they don't know any better. Knowledge/education is really the most powerful tool there is.

Buying a small food scale and a set of measuring cups will go a long way in helping you learn about portions and more precisely controlling what you take in, but there's a lot you can figure out just from experience.

Easiest way to measure 4oz of chicken breast is to measure out a portion roughly the size of a deck of cards, or the size of the palm of your hand without fingers. 1 cup of veggies is about the size of your clenched fist. When I first started out I took 1 each of the cups/bowls I used the most, poured in 1 cup of water, and marked a line on each one to leave out as an example of roughly where 1 cup of whatever I put in them would reach to. There's a bunch of tricks like that you can use really.

[Churchill]

Just wanted to say woo paleo/primal diet (I've mentioned many times)
But I agree with the whole cutting calorie thing...It's not really necessary. But I was afraid people wouldn't listen anyway, so never really said anything about that.

And I like how you said to swing a sledgehammer! I think you could be my new best friend (Or not...but still!)

I switch betweeen zone/zone-paleo, but yeah. Not doing a strict zone right now, but still shoot for 2400-2800 calories a day, which puts me at anywhere from even to -500 deficit.

I think I'm going to start strict zone soon though, so that'll end up being around 2200-2400 a day so the deficit is always there. I just got back from overseas so I am waiting on powders and such in the mail.

[Woozie]

When I first started out I took 1 each of the cups/bowls I used the most, poured in 1 cup of water, and marked a line on each one to leave out as an example of roughly where 1 cup of whatever I put in them would reach to. There's a bunch of tricks like that you can use really.

I did something similar. When I first started weighing my portions, I found out that I ate almost 5 servings of cereal for breakfast (I thought I was only eating two). I ended up measuring out the foods I eat commonly to the desired portions and getting used to how the appropriate portions look. Of course, when I'm at home, I still weight everything when I'm watching calories. But by getting used to how the portions look, it helped me with portion control when I went out or to a friends house to eat and didn't have a scale/measuring cups available.