Tanaka Keynote at GDC China

[Sign]

While Tanaka says that the company was aware that the system, which has players hire NPCs to sell their goods, would create an "inconvenience" for players, the team chose this direction to "avoid some of the disadvantages of Final Fantasy XI's system; players can make some profit out of this deal."

I actually laughed out loud reading this. This sums up their decision making process for this game, through and through. We are fully aware that are decisions are going to piss off everyone but too bad, because it will help fix this minor annoyance from the previous game.

[Lucavi]

I'll give them credit for trying to savagely attack the issues in their previous game. They tried to do a number on the AH, RMT, and questing.

[Jerseyprophet]

Slightly off topic, slightly on - but has anyone heard or read anything credible about any possible Linkshell updates? I'm referring to the menu of them, being able to set a /lsmes, etc.? -- If so, a link for the grateful Lazy?

[Hyan]

Yes, should have some updates in both 2010 and March 2011 updates.. if there wasn't anything in the Nov. patch, then probably Dec? (OR THEY LIED TO US!)

http://lodestone.finalfantasyxiv.com...f018ec5fb504d2

[Arximiro]

Do they think that RMT are incapable or buying cheap and reselling for a profit? If anyone, RMT have the time to scour the markets and create a monopoly on things as well as price gouge.

[miokomioko]

I think the average RMT outfit relies heavily on things that are incredibly simple, consistent, and infinitely repeatable. Acting as a day-trader is not that simple, consistent whatsoever, or infinitely profitable. That takes too much thinking/effort than creating a party of characters, running through a handful of simple run-around (/follow) quests, trading the gil/items, and deleting the characters. (rinse+repeat)

[Dakin]

I think the average RMT outfit relies heavily on things that are incredibly simple, consistent, and infinitely repeatable. Acting as a day-trader is not that simple, consistent whatsoever, or infinitely profitable. That takes too much thinking/effort than creating a party of characters, running through a handful of simple run-around (/follow) quests, trading the gil/items, and deleting the characters. (rinse+repeat)

When you know what you're looking for, and can easily find the retainers selling items (RMT selling shards/crystals cause that's all they sell), the process becomes incredibly simple, consistent, and infintely repeatable. We all know which retainers in the wards are RMT, or should.

[fussel]

EDIT: Here is how you do it: Use interact when near the noticeboards located in middle of any ward. Brings up a menu much like yg where you search an item and see every retainer who is selling it(in other wards/rows/etc and maybe even in other cities). And finally allow players to use this search feature to allow them to set an item they don't have to "buying" on themselves or their retainer. Stuff like marking sellers and purchase history seems to already be in the works.

O HAI Eve Market.

I would like it.

[Spira]

i was utterly disappointed by their explanation of market wards as opposed to AH...
the devs at SE should be pretty aware of how the in-game economy takes after real-life...

the "deflation" they speak of in FFXI isn't even a bad thing, especially from the fact that it meant gil wouldn't be entirely worthless. Besides, combined with NPC gilsinks (tax/dynamis/etc), this AH deflation was still unable to counter inflation caused by excessive gil creation through killing beastmen/quests/etc.. and FFXI had already held back on gil creation.

in FFXIV, gil is a lot easier to come by and there aren't quite as many sinks in the game yet so the value of the currency naturally decreases at a rapid rate. buying from fellow players doesn't actually change any of this because gil doesn't leave the system, although a greater number of transactions, together with a tax rate would be able to drain some of the excess gil.

but basically, what tanaka was saying is that they'd rather the economy go back from the AH's semi-strong form market efficiency to one that isn't even efficient...? wth? and that they're actually encouraging arbitrage profit due to lack of information and uniform market?

[Spider-Dan]

Yeah, when the mindset you are taking is, "We need to develop an economic system where the players don't have so much information," your foundation is fundamentally broken.

[Lucavi]

Hey, if denying the masses information so as to allow the select few to turn a profit actually allows them to turn a profit, than it is just, no?

Right?

[Purrrfect]

Hey, if denying the masses information so as to allow the select few to turn a profit actually allows them to turn a profit, than it is just, no?

Right?

Where have I seen this before... lol

[Lucavi]

Heh, you've probably seen it a lot with this company.

[Gwynplaine]

Pretty much the lesson here is that not understanding economics in the virtual world will be as deadening as it is in reality.

[Hyan]

Tanaka actually got one more interview out before getting ditched (conducted by another finnish site) and there he said there will definitely never be an AH.

I wonder what Yoshida has to say about it o= needs moar interviews by famitsu.

[Egon]

Tanaka actually got one more interview out before getting ditched (conducted by another finnish site) and there he said there will definitely never be an AH.

I wonder what Yoshida has to say about it o= needs moar interviews by famitsu.

There will never be an AH, if the game doesn't live long enough to have one.

[bruiser]

There will never be an AH, if the game doesn't live long enough to have one.

Tanaka's gone now. So hopefully this no longer applies.

[miokomioko]

The Market Wards will function just like an AH once they add the features they said they were going to. Item search, teleport-to-retainer, etc. None of this will matter.

[Grey Jorildyn]

It won't function like an AH if it does not put the item directly into your hands. If it tells you where to find it, but you still have to hunt through the sea of bazaars as they load bit by bit, then it's only doing a portion of what an AH does. It will certainly help but it will still be a ridiculous mechanic. Why code half an AH when you can just finish the job right the first time and alleviate a timesink this game clearly does not need (cuz it has plenty more!). It would go a longway to making players happier in the longrun and SE needs all the positive mention they can get at this point. This game is already being deep discounted by online sites due to its unpopularity as is.

[miokomioko]

It won't function like an AH if it does not put the item directly into your hands. If it tells you where to find it, but you still have to hunt through the sea of bazaars as they load bit by bit, then it's only doing a portion of what an AH does. It will certainly help but it will still be a ridiculous mechanic. Why code half an AH when you can just finish the job right the first time and alleviate a timesink this game clearly does not need (cuz it has plenty more!). It would go a longway to making players happier in the longrun and SE needs all the positive mention they can get at this point. This game is already being deep discounted by online sites due to its unpopularity as is.

They said:

a) they are going to implement a search function that allows you to search for exactly what you're looking for within the retainers (probably per-ward).

b) they are going to implement an option to teleport directly to the retainer that holds the item you just searched for.

It would probably go something like:

- enter the Battlecraft Ward
- use search, type in "Bee Sp---" (or choose it through categories and whatnot if you don't want to type) and the search returns all Bee Spathas of all qualities and their prices within the battlecraft ward (or the entire market?)
- you pick the one you want to buy and immediately choose to teleport directly to the retainer holding it
- hit enter and buy it from them

- oh wait, this same retainer is also selling some gladiator armor as well... and a shield... and all the materials I would need to repair my new Bee Spatha and other potential purchases! (THIS IS THE POINT)

It's really not going to be nearly as inconvenient as people think it will be once it's completely functional. "But why not just add an AH?" is so fucking redundant at this point. There's going to be a few things that are going to be set in stone whether you like it or not. Especially when it is (will be) such a minor inconvenience to people once the system has fully matured.


Also, this search function is going to clean up the wards, big time. People will be spending a lot less time rummaging through bazaars because they will search for what they want and leave if it's not there, so assholes who are just selling materials and crystals have no reason to park their retarded shit in the Battlecraft Ward... even less so if the search only searches the current ward.


... so who cares if the system doesn't simply "put the item directly into your hands." That's not the only defining quality of an "AH" in the context we're speaking. It's just not an "auction" anymore. It's a marketplace.