Mass Effect 3

**Meresgi** · 2012-03-21 14:31

Originally Posted by Souj

Serious Question; What are the plot holes? I may have missed them but I don't recall any.
p.s. A race of characters having stupid reasons for doing things is not a plot hole. Hell, maybe they had very good reasons to do what they did but we just weren't informed of it.

I'll agree that it's bullshit that there are barely any differential endings, and how none of your decisions you made in earlier games mattered at all.That's my biggest complaint. If you did something differently with certain characters or races, they would just be replaced by other characters and nothing else at all would change. but that's not what most of the people complaining are complaining about.

I'll spoiler this incase people have been living in a cave

Spoiler: show

1: The destruction of the relays basically kills EVERYTHING around them, I believe it was in the Arrival DLC that by destroying the relay in that system its explosion kills off most of the Batarian race and homeworld (this is gathered from reading). This is because the relays themselves contain so much energy that a detonation basically spells doom to the galaxy it is in.

2: The reapers were supposed to be about stopping the flow of Dark Energy, something alluded to in Mass Effect 1 and 2, but Mass Effect 3 just kind of stops talking about it. The dropped plan for the ending though does address this fact and allows you to make choices on how to deal with the Dark Energy problem (aka, kill reapers and let the universe either fight off Dark Energy or die trying/ Let the reapers continue what they are doing so as not to snuff out every living through and destroy the universe/ etc etc) Mass Effect 3 is a violation of Chekhov's gun.

3:The premise that God Child speaks to you about, the overwhelming need for synthetics to destroy all organics makes no sense and is very convoluted in a lot of sense (insert Xzibit picture here) not to mention that Mass Effect 2 and 3 basically show you that it is indeed possible for synthetic life to coexist with organics and not every cycle is doomed.

4:Concerning the synthesis ending, it goes against everything the series has been based around, which is that through diplomacy and choice, all races can come together to coexist without having to conform to a single standard...instead this ending is basically Shepard saying "fuck everyone, I make the choices, and negating any freewill of the entire universe"

5: Joker fleeing the battle, this is a major one people touch on..especially me as the scene showed the 2 squadmates I had on earth getting out of the ship with him. It's not feasible that he flew down into London, picked up those 2 members then booked it out of the Sol system leaving the fleet to die against the reaper horde.

6: Thannix...missles? In Mass Effect 2 you have a Thannix cannon, which is basically equiv to the reaper laser beam of doooooom, but it was retconned in mass effect 3, not really a plothole but more of a ..."wuh?"

http://social.bioware.com/forum/1/to...dex/10022779/1

That link is what I was talking about, detailing the structure of the ending from a screenwriter perspective.

**Tyrath** · 2012-03-21 14:40

Just a correction to #1 above. Doom for the system its in, not galaxy.

**Karbuncle** · 2012-03-21 14:41

Originally Posted by Souj

You consider those plotholes? They outwardly state in the game How/where/why those things. Unless B is referring to the very end. And even then, things left unexplained are not plot holes.

@Slott
You spend the entire first game trying to stop 1 Reaper. You spend the entire 2nd game trying to stop the "birth" of 1 Reaper. How would it have been better story wise if suddenly youre dropping 20-30 Reapers with just your 2 squadmates and your guns and biotics? Youre mission is never "Kill the Reapers!" It's "Gather up all our resources so we can have a giant army to defeat the Reapers!".
And Cerberus is just as much of a threat as the reapers are in the game. The whole game, Cerberus is shown as a horrible organization with shady ideas and that are willing to sacrifice everyone for the goals of a single person. Hell, your very first mission in the game (which you are forced to go into first) is against Cerberus.

I consider myself a pessimist and I like to complain about a lot of stuff, but most of this stuff is just silly hating. Feels like I'm in the Bleach thread.

I Googled Mass Effect 3 Ending to see what i could find. I found this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4H_A7SeawU4

I think it sums it up quite nicely. I'm on the side of people complaining, The entire series revolves around the choices you make, and the ending to the third game is a giant slap to the face to those choices, as the ending is pretty much the same.

**WahiGuard** · 2012-03-21 14:42

Originally Posted by Meresgi

http://blog.bioware.com/2012/03/21/4108/

Spoiler: show

Most of which were told to review the game as high as they did.

I like how that is said, even though it's not even what most fans are upset about. People are pissed about being told one thing and then seeing that Bioware completely 180'd on a ton of statements and gave us 1 ending with 3 colors.

The analogy was bad to begin with. J.K Rowling wrapped up all the characters we have read through the years stories`. She concluded the subplots too(except why Sirius dies when he went through the veil, which I remember she said she would elaborate on.) Even if '19 years later' was on some serious pre-teen girl fanfiction bullshit I lived with it, because the story main conflict was wrapped up, we knew the characters and universe`s fate. It wasn`t like Harry is killed by Voldermort,meets Dumbledore and is told " okay Harry you have two options stay here in whereverthefuckwhiteroom and merge and destroy all magic so Voldermort can`t hurt people, or go back out there destroy Hogwarts and all magic and Voldermort and yourself" The end...

Literature and video games in ME case are two different art forms. Books we are told the story and fate. In Mass Effect we MADE the story up as to how we destroyed Saren and the Geth, how to beat the Reapers. Our past decisions mattered, who would work for us who could trust not trust us.. For someone from the company to make such a fundamental error in comparison is upsetting..

I defended the ending because from the first dream Shepard had I was like, 'oh shit the Reapers are trying to indoctrinate him/her" and I could see the ending as Shepard fighting Indoctrination. I also accepted it because I thought no way in hell the people who made a perfect game all the way to the last 10 minutes drop the ball this badly..

And why does every single response from Bioware have to include all the glowing reviews and perfect scores? Like that means anything.. Oh 75 sites gave you a perfect score? guess I`m wrong and they`re right..Except plastered all over their site are promotions for ME3 or KoA.

Just...I want to believe this was all planned and there is more to this..

**Souj** · 2012-03-21 14:54

Instead of making multiple points, responding to those (because I would be here fooooorevaaaaaaar) I'll just say; For most of the points you are confusing Plot Holes with terrible, terrible writing. The only one that is definitely a plot hole is the Joker things as

Spoiler: show

I'll also add that terrible, terrible writing is often far worse than plot holes.

**Lonely** · 2012-03-21 15:07

Oh god the FFXIII-2 N7 armor costume is real, y u so vague bluegartr? I thought it was a shoop.

**Rhyis.** · 2012-03-21 15:13

Originally Posted by Qalbert

Claymore Shotgun
- Damage increased from [152.8-191.0] to [167.8-206.0]

**Pendulum** · 2012-03-21 15:17

Originally Posted by Rhyis.

Guess i know what i'm trying to unlock tonight.

**Rhyis.** · 2012-03-21 15:26

Let's all two shot some bronze Atlas' together.

**rezn0r** · 2012-03-21 15:28

Originally Posted by Tarage

I'm not convinced. What Muzyka said basically says "We aren't changing how the ending happened, but we'll let you see more of it."

That doesn't sit well with me because the ending is fundamentally flawed and should be changed, not 'enhanced'.

i shouldn't even be touching this thread as i haven't even finished 2 yet (just started the series a few weeks back, i love it, but i'm slow) - that said i've been keeping up with all this "controversy" just because i find it interesting, although i don't know ME3's ending yet so i'm pretty much an outsider looking in. the first thing that popped into my head though was that Bioware will probably release an expansion dlc in the same idea as Fallout 3's Broken Steel, that could be their easy way out? if it's as bad as the majority of people are acting like it is, it wouldn't make up for it, but it could be a smoother way to deal with it than just "adding more endings"? i realize right now i'm probably not even making sense, considering i don't know wtf i'm talking about haha. i'll go back to lurking.

**Rhyis.** · 2012-03-21 15:31

The Joker thing is the only total wtf moment of the ending and needs to be explained. Everything else is just opinion.

**Meresgi** · 2012-03-21 15:44

http://social.bioware.com/forum/Mass...0084349-1.html

Big post on the way PR damage control is done and how Bioware is following the outline to the letter almost, including the N7 Goliath weekend.

Edit: Posting this here

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YWIimukNeAE

**Pendulum** · 2012-03-21 16:00

Someone was asking for bad endings the other day. The tv series Rubicon has a pretty terribad final episode. Although in defence, they were still hoping to get a second series whilst writing that.

Also, how far in is meeting tali?

**Tarage** · 2012-03-21 16:09

Originally Posted by Pendulum

Someone was asking for bad endings the other day. The tv series Rubicon has a pretty terribad final episode. Although in defence, they were still hoping to get a second series whilst writing that.

Also, how far in is meeting tali?

Second half of the game.

**Rokku** · 2012-03-21 16:19

Originally Posted by Pendulum

Someone was asking for bad endings the other day. The tv series Rubicon has a pretty terribad final episode. Although in defence, they were still hoping to get a second series whilst writing that.

Also, how far in is meeting tali?

After you wrap up everything on Palaven and Tuchanka you can recruit her.

**Tarage** · 2012-03-21 16:44

Originally Posted by Rokku

After you wrap up everything on Palaven and Tuchanka you can recruit her.

Not... quite... you still have to deal with something on the Citadel.

**Meresgi** · 2012-03-21 16:46

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DqgRP5_YKu0

This video made me chuckle to myself. It does nothing to stem the vitriol of the community and just irks everyone on. I especially like how he referenced Francis' character as an entitlement bitching fanboy over the DLC. Whereas here is his real opinion on it all.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSfcWr5jxac

**Kerberoz** · 2012-03-21 16:48

The "fleeing" thing bothers me because

Spoiler: show

**vrumpt** · 2012-03-21 17:02

Originally Posted by Meresgi

Big post on the way PR damage control is done and how Bioware is following the outline to the letter almost, including the N7 Goliath weekend.

I firmly stand against the mentioned post, and i discourage anybody from reading it. It basically boils down to 1 guy who knows how to talk basically indoctrinating everybody else into thinking that every little thought, breathe and word by Bioware is nothing but a massive PR stunt. Events like the N7 Goliath weekend take weeks to prepare for, and were not done in a few days to counter the ending debacle like this guy suggests. Nobody who responds to that thread knows how to think for themselves. Even after today with Ray's blog post people were flat out asking this guy how they should think. Its just fucking disgusting. Stay far far away from the massive list of stupid.

On a different note, I have a new take on the endings that isn't the endings taken literally, or the Indoctrination Theory.

Spoiler: show

**Qalbert** · 2012-03-21 17:07

Thread: Mass Effect 3

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