[IMPORTANT] A New Year and FINAL FANTASY XIV Player's Poll (01/01/2011)

[Spider-Dan]

My point is that AH must be implemented before PS3 release if they are going to implement it at all. Therefore, it should be top priority.

The goal here should not be to retain existing players. The goal should be to make a viable product for PS3 release. It is the only chance SE has to undo all of the high-profile "Worst Game Ever" awards that the PC version has earned.

[Cjskater]

All this game needs is an AH and it's good to go. Guaranteed 10/10. Our children's children will look back to this game as an example for when games were good.

[Kaelan?]

Don't bother giving players any goals to aim towards or anything to actually do. As long as their can buy shit 10 seconds faster, the game will be a sure success guys. Everyone knows reviewers don't care about content

[Charismatic]

At least two people here can't read.

[Cjskater]

At least two people here should learn about time management.

[Charismatic]

Hey, I never said I agreed with the guy. Acting like he said all the game needs is an AH is just plain retarded no matter what your stance is though.

[Kurokikaze]

When I say content I mean new towns, quests and mid to high level dungeons (like Deadmines, SFK, RFK etc in WoW). The reason AH is the worst choice is because the game currently only has crafting as a viable thing to do within the game where you can see results in a reasonable amount of time. That fact amplifies how bad the Market Ward is/was. At the moment, an AH will not immediately fix this game nor will it bring back subscribers.

Ask anyone here if they think the game is fun. Then if they respond yes ask them what they think is fun. Keyword here is fun.

[Kaelan?]

The question was about priorities, i.e.: what would make the most improvement right now. "AH > everything else" is the the only way in which his reply makes sense, if you assume he understood the question.

[Rocl]

Guys, please refrain from posting any cuss words without properly censoring yourself as Spider-Dan here does. There are children who read this forum, you f*gg*ts.

[miokomioko]

I don't care how angry it makes Spider-Dan and how much he wants to make unsolicited announcements of how versed he is in economic theory, an auction house is not at the top of a list of priorities to ensure the game's eventual success.

[Spider-Dan]

An AH is a more significant change than the other items on the list.

You're talking about making small, nuanced changes which will results in the PS3 version being released and reviewed as "they didn't really change much, the economy is still broken, interface is slightly faster though" and, subsequently, a dead game.

Notwithstanding all the idiotic claims about how the current wards are "just as good as an AH" (it's not even close), AH is an significant step that is highly visible to reviewers. So even if the actual impact to players is less than, say, implementing FoV, the impact to perception is much greater.

I'm not sure why the anti-AHers think the game has been free for the last 3 months and all the management team was let go, but it wasn't because there aren't enough Valkurm Emperors to kill. Read the game media reviews of this game, see what the major complaints are, and those are the things that need to be drastically revamped. If completely changing transportation was on the list, I'd be happy to discuss that vs. AH. But, again, it's not.

P.S. mioko, still mad? Awww.

[Lucavi]

It's pretty huge if a player quits because leveling sucks in a way, that you have no desire whatsoever to do it. This is why I voted gameplay/battle improvements. I also chose AH, because as the Mr. above said, content will eventually come. Heck we don't need NMs for the small amount of high level players who were masochists enough to go that far. There are more important things to update than content right now.

I chose the same thing. The game is boring to me, and it has nothing to do with a lack of AH or even a lack of content. Fighting is boring, gathering classes are flat and non-interactive, and crafting is tedious and far too menu-driven. That won't get fixed with some AH patch or some new sidequests. The main quests themselves are laughably easy, because they're always accounting for you possibly being a non-fighting class, and the actual class quests, from what I've experienced, are a joke.

Fix the core systems before adding content that will simply come down to new NMs and more quests where I can watch the NPCs kill the boss, and before some AH change that we all know is coming anyway, seeing as how the new head honcho has played plenty of MMOs with fully functional AH systems.

[Spider-Dan]

When I say content I mean new towns, quests and mid to high level dungeons (like Deadmines, SFK, RFK etc in WoW). The reason AH is the worst choice is because the game currently only has crafting as a viable thing to do within the game where you can see results in a reasonable amount of time. That fact amplifies how bad the Market Ward is/was. At the moment, an AH will not immediately fix this game nor will it bring back subscribers.

I'm stunned that you can make the following two claims simultaneously:

1) crafting is the most viable option in the game right now
2) an AH (i.e. a way to be able to actually do something with the things you craft) is trite and unimportant

How can you argue that the broken economy is a minor detail at the same time you are claiming that crafting is the only thing that works right?

[Elrina]

I have to admit I see where he's coming from though, and was thinking along the same lines (although, admittedly, I haven't been one of the people playing in the hopes of it being better later, since I haven't really been having any fun with it now).

It won't bring back any subs or players, but they aren't charging for it right now anyway, and the people who are still around will likely either be staying regardless or checking back in soon enough anyway. I think he's worried that if they begin their big focus on content, they'll never go back to fixing systems that need fixing (adding a proper Auction House of some kind).

Game seriously needs content right now to be any fun, and to get people back, that's for sure. An AH isn't going to do it (by itself), that's also for sure, where content will help a lot. But it's going to require a lot of content at this point, a handful of quests and one repetitive event isn't really going to do the job either. An AH won't do it by itself, but it sure as hell wouldn't hurt to have, and would likely help, especially since they'll be adding in all the content anyway. That's definite, no matter what, it's on their list. Game can't survive without it. But if they get focused on it now, and take the "market wards are good enough for now" to heart, they may just tweak it a little more and never go back to putting in a proper AH, and the market wards will never match the ease and convenience of an AH. It isn't about 10 seconds, it's about several minutes at the least, usually more, even with the search, and spread that out over every time you need to use it over the length of years.

I haven't done the survey yet, myself, need to hunt down my token and busy with other things right now so I'll probably do it tonight. I'm leaning AH simply to try to help ensure (regardless of the fact that it's asking what we want implemented first, not what we want implemented at all) that they know people still want one, as well as the content which we all want but will be coming regardless. We've got an indefinite free period right now, they won't be changing that till we're ready to pay, so it would be nice if that was gotten out of the way so that it was one less loose string needing to be tied up. The content can still be added after, and it might take a little longer till the game is considered "fun" or whatever, but with the new regime it'll get there, so I think I'd like to see this taken care of and gotten out of the way first.

And yes, I'm speaking from the standpoint of someone who isn't really that interested in playing right now, likely wouldn't play much more if only an AH was added (although I might, a little), but when I get back on because there's content I'm interested in, I would really like that AH to be there waiting, because fuck the market wards even with that shitty search. Fuck wasting my time, even if it's only a few minutes, running around the damn wards when I should be able to handle my business in seconds. Oh, and since the draw here is to pull people back, wouldn't that make sense for others as well? I'm sure they would like having an AH available when they come back as well. If they could come back in two months and have content, or three months and have content and an AH (shitty timeline comparison, you get the idea), if they aren't playing anyway then why not just wait the extra time and have both waiting when they come back? Of course, if they add the AH in anyway it's irrelevant, but as far as I know "content" is the only thing that is truly inevitable, sooner or later.

Adding in content right now seems like another quick-fix, and we've had enough of those. Take care of the things that need taking care of, then add in the content that will make the game fun after you have that stuff in place. This is more about who will be playing in 3-6 months, not about those of you still logging in right now.

[Spider-Dan]

I think it's also important to point out that all the people who are pooh-poohing AH are operating under some sort of crazy, bizarre presumption that an AH will definitely be implemented soon anyway.

Last I checked, we (as a playerbase) still have to convince the development team that their sh*tty market ward concept IS NOT A SOLUTION and MUST BE REPLACED. And the best way to do that is to flood the poll with AH votes.

Do any of you non-AH voters seriously believe that if they get 99% votes for AH, they'll say, "Oh well, rest of the game must be fine, add an AH and PS3 version can go gold"? Of course not. They will have to implement new content anyway, and they almost certainly already have it planned out. AH is still up in the air, and votes now can change that from "well, let's see how far we can go with this market ward thing" to "OK, scrap market wards and start implementing the AH."

I hope you realize that if AH gets an absurdly low number of votes, WE WON'T GET ONE AT ALL. (at least, not in any time frame that would matter)

[Lucavi]

I'm stunned that you can make the following two claims simultaneously:

1) crafting is the most viable option in the game right now
2) an AH (i.e. a way to be able to actually do something with the things you craft) is trite and unimportant

How can you argue that the broken economy is a minor detail at the same time you are claiming that crafting is the only thing that works right?

I'd defend that (if it was my argument) by simply saying that SE isn't going to get a million subs, or even half of that, by continuing this trend of making FFXIV somehow equal Crafting Fantasy XIV and expect people to stick around. Sure, some people like to craft. Perhaps many people like to craft. Everyone, however, likes to fight, and if they don't, then they're probably playing Eve Online or Farmville, both of which do what SE is currently trying to do much better.

Fix this boring-ass fighting engine. Fix the way mobs don't interact with each other. Fix the stupid mob AI where they follow the same stupid patterns, then spam their abilities at 10% health. Fix the fact that they don't move around or try to flank you, given that this game is supposed to incorporate defensive changes at different positions. Fix the fact that mages don't cure one another, and don't run behind their tanks. Fix the BRs. Fix the targeting bugs. Fix the stamina bugs. Fix everything about the combat system to make it enjoyable, and once people are actually joining the game because its actually fun to be a mage or fun to hit things with a stick or fun to hide behind a shield and tank, then you can worry about an AH.

The game is not fun right now. The game will not suddenly become fun if a fully-functioning AH arrives tomorrow. It'll still be Crafting Fantasy XIV, and you'll simply have more crafters at high levels complaining that there's nobody around to buy their shit or to sell their supplies to. SE needs to take a long look at what immediate changes they can make to the game to make it fun for the largest denominator, because everyone knows that if a game is fun, people are more than willing to stick around through glaring flaws. Just look at fucking XI and how long people stuck around between some of the biggest fixes and expansion packs.

Edit: Dan, with this new developer in charge who has already played plenty of MMOs with working AHes, I simply cannot believe in good faith that we won't see an AH implemented in the near future. You can disagree, and we'll simply agree to disagree, but an AH is last on my list right now of things that would/could save this pathetic trash-heap of a game.

[Darus Grey]

I'm stunned that you can make the following two claims simultaneously:

1) crafting is the most viable option in the game right now
2) an AH (i.e. a way to be able to actually do something with the things you craft) is trite and unimportant

How can you argue that the broken economy is a minor detail at the same time you are claiming that crafting is the only thing that works right?

There's no contradiction at all, any smart crafter doesn't want an AH, or is indifferent.

Price normalization and general deflation of value doesn't exactly benefit them...

[Spider-Dan]

Lucavi, we'll have to agree to disagree on exactly how important the AH (read: the economy) is.

First off, the economy is broken. Anyone who believes that ward search fixed it is nuts.
Second, the economy has an obvious and indisputable impact on crafting, but also on grinding; one of the major points of "fun" (such as it is) in an MMO is working towards getting enough money to buy your Sniper's Ring, your Scorpion Harness, your O-Kote, etc. Right now, there's no point in doing any of that, because it's way too hard to consistently find items and you have no f*cking idea of what they might cost when you do find them.
Third, an AH works to mask many of the other dumb design decisions that have been made. Yes, they added a bunch of low-level gear to random NPCs around town, but who knows where they are and what they are selling? It's totally arbitrary and random.

[Lucavi]

That's also true. My millions in the first 2 and a half weeks were entirely dependent on people not knowing an established price, and instead, simply paying mine because they "had to have it NAO!"

Something similar still could have happened, and possibly even faster since more people would have been able to see my products, but I have no regrets about not having an AH. I just want one done right if it is done, and not simply a clone of XI's system.

Dan: Then agree to disagree we shall. We both want a better game, but we prioritize different aspects. Neither is right and neither is wrong. Lets just hope that -something- changes fast. Although I'll say that even through grinding, I never lacked money to afford what I wanted. Nay, I simply didn't buy anything because of the shitty way they account for inventory space - I didn't want to have to make room for 6 accessories that barely raise my stats and fill up my already limited space. I still think you're overestimating the long-term intelligence of the average casual player, though. They want to bash things with sticks and have fun doing so; everything else kinda just evens out in the end, but lets just hope they fix it all in the long run.

This game has such a fucking long way to go.

[Spider-Dan]

There's no contradiction at all, any smart crafter doesn't want an AH, or is indifferent.

Unless you plan to level every craft job or you have a network of crafters to provide you with mats outside of your crafting job, I'll have to disagree.

There's plenty of sh*t that I WOULD make if I could find the mats to do so.