GOP: Raped? Pay for it yourself.

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

There is no such thing as non-forcible rape, except fraud in the factum. Roofee'ing someone is doing it w/o their consent. Consent is not an element of rape, but it operates as an affirmative defense for the victim that they were raped.

Correction: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill...pd?bill=h112-3

[chiyio]

Wtf are you bitching about then.

Incest w/ minor -> govt. aid.
Rape -> govt. aid.
Danger to mother -> govt. aid.

And apparently this currently isn't the case. Or are you just bitching about abortion funding in general?

You need to up your reading comprehension. It *is* currently the case. What they want to do is change the definition of rape so that it covers less circumstances (like the drug induced rape)
They're specifically leaving out non consensual rape.

How are you not seeing this?

* edit @ Correction http://www.opencongress.org/bill/112-h3/text

*edit @ swamp regarding "There is no such thing as non-forcible rape" what do you call it when the victim is unconscious and no force is required?

[ZarakiKujata]

This is like arguing with sarah palin or Michele Bachmann.

Except they are marginally fuckable.

Spoiler: show

EMPHASIS ON MARGINALLY

[Chun Liroy]

Except they are marginally fuckable.

Spoiler: show

EMPHASIS ON MARGINALLY

tracy morgan says sarah palin is good masturbatory material.

[ZarakiKujata]

tracy morgan says sarah palin is good masturbatory material.

Yeah that was pretty funny the way ppl got offended over it.

Would it have been been better if he had said she was bad masturbatory material?

[Demosthenes]

Dahahahaha holy fuck.

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

I also have this from crim law.

Still other courts have eliminated the requirement of force or threat of force altogether
1. Sex is a crime absent affirmative manifestation of consent by words or actions

Maybe that's why they put it in there.

[#686578]

My only problem with the proposal not passing is all of the father/daughter couples using tax dollars as cheap contraceptive.

[Demosthenes]

I can't do this shit. I might have to bow out.

[archibaldcrane]

We just need to compare this clause:

‘SEC. 309. TREATMENT OF ABORTIONS RELATED TO RAPE, INCEST, OR PRESERVING THE LIFE OF THE MOTHER.

‘The limitations established in sections 301, 302, 303, and 304 shall not apply to an abortion--

‘(1) if the pregnancy occurred because the pregnant female was the subject of an act of forcible rape or, if a minor, an act of incest; or


‘(2) in the case where the pregnant female suffers from a physical disorder, physical injury, or physical illness that would, as certified by a physician, place the pregnant female in danger of death unless an abortion is performed, including a life-endangering physical condition caused by or arising from the pregnancy itself.

to the one in the current bill governing Federal funding for abortions. Can someone pull that up?

[Correction]

There is no such thing as non-forcible rape, except fraud in the factum. Roofee'ing someone is doing it w/o their consent. Consent is not an element of rape, but it operates as an affirmative defense for the victim that they were raped.

Correction: http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill...pd?bill=h112-3

So how does it currently work if you are raped, but you fail to get a conviction, and end up pregnant? Can Medicaid right now pay for the abortion, or can a tax-credit be applied to a health plan that covers this kind of abortion?

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

So how does it currently work if you are raped, but you fail to get a conviction, and end up pregnant? Can Medicaid right now pay for the abortion, or can a tax-credit be applied to a health plan that covers this kind of abortion?

If the bill requires a conviction then ya'll have something to bitch about b/c you're not getting a conviction before the baby is born.

[chiyio]

Rape: (according to the Indiana Criminal Code, #35-42-4-1)

Class B Felony -- Knowingly or intentionally having sexual intercourse with a member of the opposite sex when: 1) the other person is compelled by force or the imminent threat of force; 2) the other person is unaware that sexual intercourse is occurring; 3) the other person is so mentally disabled or deficient that consent to intercourse cannot be given.

Class A Felony -- The offense is committed by using or threatening the use of deadly force, committed while armed with a deadly weapon, or results in serious bodily injury to a person other than the defendant.

what now swamp?

*bla, didn't know that's all under "forcible rape"

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

What now what? Roofee'ing someone is rape, no shit.

[Correction]

If the bill requires a conviction then ya'll have something to bitch about b/c you're not getting a conviction before the baby is born.

Whether or not a pregnancy can be terminated via Medicaid or employer insurance seems to hinge entirely on definitions, so it's important to establish them. If rape has a legal definition and we are piling more laws on top of that legal definition, we can't get fuzzy and say 'well if the woman says she was raped without a police report/conviction that's good enough for Medicaid bucks.' It's currently not enough to cry 'rape' to send a rapist to jail, etc. so why wouldn't the health coverage law also require the same?

Adding qualifier words to 'rape' without setting these all-important definitions in stone further muddies the waters, and not in favor of the victims of these crimes who are now saddled with the financial burdens alone.

[archibaldcrane]

What now what? Roofee'ing someone is rape, no shit.

Hey law student, can you dig up the language of the currently enforced rape exception for federal funding? You're better at this stuff than we are.

[Xno Kappa]

Some of the posts in this thread make my brain hurt. Trolling or not.

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

I started looking but couldn't find it, here's why:

The Stupak–Pitts Amendment, an amendment to the Affordable Health Care for America Act, was introduced by Democratic Rep. Bart Stupak of Michigan. It prohibits use of Federal funds "to pay for any abortion or to cover any part of the costs of any health plan that includes coverage of abortion" except in cases of rape, incest or danger to the life of the mother,[5] and was included in the bill as passed by the House of Representatives on November 7, 2009. However, the Senate bill passed by the House on March 21, 2010 did not contain that Hyde Amendment language. As part of an agreement between Rep. Stupak and President Obama to secure Stupak's vote, the President issued an executive order on March 24, 2010 affirming that the Hyde Amendment would extend to the new bill.[6]

It's the last paragraph on the wiki. In other words there is no law banning it now.

I've never had to look up an executive order. I'll give it a shot in a few.

[archibaldcrane]

I've never had to look up an executive order. I'll give it a shot in a few.

Or just find the Hyde Amendment language circa March 20th or whatever.

I think this is it - notice the lack of the word "forcible" and the lack of stipulations for minors only in the condition of incest.

SEC. 508. (a) The limitations established in the preceding section shall not apply to an abortion-- (1) if the pregnancy is the result of an act of rape or incest; or (2) in the case where a woman suffers from a physical disorder, physical injury, or physical illness, including a life-endangering physical condition caused by or arising from the pregnancy itself, that would, as certified by a physician, place the woman in danger of death unless an abortion is performed." (from Public Law 111-8 , H.R. 1105, Division F, Title V, General Provisions, italics added for emphasis.)

Now, do you think it's an accident that they omitted the word forcible from this new bill? Do you think the word forcible should be removed?

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

Obviously, to get rid of ambiguity, but that's not what this thread was mainly about.