The Dark Knight Rises

**Tyrath** · 2012-07-26 23:59

Because it may have been free from blue collar criminals. But the city was full of rich white criminals while the poor were left out to starve. It was still corrupt, even if the mob had been taken out.

**Andalusian girls** · 2012-07-27 00:12

so back to the half-baked 99% ideology (but didn't you just say that was solely to give them false hope?), and you have to infer it at that. all Ghul really says at the reveal is she's finishing what her father began

**Apelila** · 2012-07-27 00:22

There may not have been crime going on but that wasn't their motivation, at least not in this movie.

The motivation was that Gotham, portrayed as a center of the financial world was corrupt. The upper class didn't give one shit about the lower class, let alone 2. I'll agree they inferred the fuck out of this point instead of giving anything very concrete to base it on, but that was my take away from the trials/people getting thrown out of their figurative ivory towers by their servants. They didn't show trails for middle/lower class people, only the 'haves' charged with being 'corrupt' or concepts equally as vague.

I'll have to watch Begins again to see if indeed Ra's wanted to destroy Gotham for being a breeding ground of organized crime, because if that's the case then wow did they have a continuity fuckup.

**Angeleus** · 2012-07-27 00:27

Just saw it tonight, great movie and great ending.

Enuff said!

**Souj** · 2012-07-27 00:29

He never said he was destroying Gotham because organized crime made the city corrupt. He just said it needed to be destroyed because it was corrupt.

**Angeleus** · 2012-07-27 00:46

Besides, Souj and Tyrath on this page did any of you already forgot what exactly happen on batman begins?

**Andalusian girls** · 2012-07-27 00:56

in Begins Ghul states his missions statement without equivocation

Ducard: Only a cynical man would call what these people have "lives," Wayne. Crime. Despair. This was not how man was supposed to live. The League of Shadows has been a check against human corruption for thousands of years. We sacked Rome, loaded trade ships with plague rats. Burned London to the ground. Every time a civilization reaches the pinnacle of its decadence, we return to restore the balance.

also says

Wayne: You've attacked Gotham before?
Ducard: Of course. Over time, our weapons have grown more sophisticated. With Gotham, we tried a new one - economics. But, we underestimated certain of Gotham's citizens. Such as your parents. Gunned down by one of the very people they were trying to help. Create enough hunger and everyone becomes a criminal. Their deaths galvanized the city unto saving itself and Gotham has limped on ever since. We are back to finish the job. And this time, no misguided idealists will stand in the way.

Ducard: You are defending a city so corrupt, we have infiltrated every level of its infrastructure.

so

The League helped engender the crime problem but was thwarted by wealthy philanthropists. By TDKR the crime problem has been eradicated, the corruption problem in terms of infiltration very likely as well (with no mob who is infiltrating the police force the way we saw in Begins and TDK).

The last bastion of decadence they could rail against was the wealthy, the financial elite. But if they truly believed that ideology why eradicate Gotham? After Bane takes over the city they set up a populist people's court, throw the wealthy out of their homes and into the streets, essentially establish a utopia to their proclaimed ideology. But what do they do with this utopia ? Why they try to destroy it and state they only built it to make the city suffer more.

TO NUTSHELL THEIR LOGIC
Gotham is evil and must be destroyed because of crime, corruption, and decadence
Gotham fixes their crime and corruption problems through the virtue of the decadent
Gotham is still evil because of their decadence
We take over Gotham and fix the decadence problem
We destroy decadenceless Gotham because of decadence
also we don't really believe in that decadence shit we were just saying that to fool the peoples before we destroy Gotham

at best you can state the villains just recycled a shittier, more garbled version of what we heard in Batman Begins (all that is inferred from Talia's five second reveal). and there we had the awesome parallel between the League's vigilantism and Batman's.

don't get me wrong i enjoyed the movie, but that was one of its larger failures. isn't as weighty as the first two in its ideas

**Tellahh** · 2012-07-27 02:46

Originally Posted by Tyrath

I may be the only one. But I really liked the monologue as Bane was 'freeing' Gotham. It was kinda cheesy, but I thought it was pretty epic >_> The music might've helped it a lot.

That was the speech in the football stadium right? Except for the weird pans to the audience in the stands, his speech and how he snapped that dude's neck was pretty awesome.

Originally Posted by Souj

I think that's because almost all of Alfred's dialog in this movie consisted of him complaining to Bruce, saying he shouldnt do this or shouldnt do that.

Pretty much, almost a complete downer, especially how he blubbered in front of the tombstones. Like, I know they were trying to be sentimental but I think it was a little too much.

**Rhyis.** · 2012-07-27 03:04

Just watched this tonight. Thought it was good. Only complaint was the sound/voices, not just Bane's. Missed a few lines here and there because the music or some sound effect was too loud while dialogue was going on. Somebody fucked up on the sound check for sure. Fire that motherfucker.

The script itself was enjoyable.

Spoiler: show

**thetruepandagod** · 2012-07-27 03:30

Originally Posted by Rhyis.

I was kind of disappointed when they "LAWL NO"d you into believing Bat's was dead though.

He was supposed to die, studio made nolan change the end.

**Tellahh** · 2012-07-27 03:36

Originally Posted by Rhyis.

Spoiler: show

I can't believe she sold him out like that, it really hit her with the guilt when he started getting fucked up.

Spoiler: show

EDIT:

Originally Posted by thetruepandagod

He was supposed to die, studio made nolan change the end.

Would have much preferred this, a fitting end to be honest.

**Xajii** · 2012-07-27 04:33

Originally Posted by thetruepandagod

He was supposed to die, studio made nolan change the end.

Is there a source for this? Genuinely curious. not trying to be a dick. If I missed it elsewhere in the thread I apologize.

**chazzyphizzle** · 2012-07-27 07:27

if that's the case then fuck that fucking studio, would have been a perfect ending without the italy scene

**Sunrider** · 2012-07-27 07:45

I liked the ending. Alfred finally got what he'd always wanted for Bruce, and the audience saw something that the comics will never give us, which is a happy ending for Bruce Wayne.

**Acturus** · 2012-07-27 07:51

Originally Posted by Sunrider

I liked the ending. Alfred finally got what he'd always wanted for Bruce, and the audience saw something that the comics will never give us, which is a happy ending for Bruce Wayne.

It gave us a happy ending for Alfred. I appreciated that.

**Omniyoji** · 2012-07-27 09:36

If the studio didn't let him kill Batman then maybe they won't let him kill off Superman D:

Also in the other films there was some talk about life after Batman.

**Tyrath** · 2012-07-27 09:36

Originally Posted by Tellahh

That was the speech in the football stadium right? Except for the weird pans to the audience in the stands, his speech and how he snapped that dude's neck was pretty awesome.

No, the one in front of Blackgate prison. They had like a montage of things happening while he narrated it basically to epic music going on. I loved it.

I enjoyed him living though. It's exactly sort of what House did, and I loved the ending in that too.

**ronin sparthos** · 2012-07-27 10:20

Originally Posted by chazzyphizzle

if that's the case then fuck that fucking studio, would have been a perfect ending without the italy scene

Some people are convinced Alfred is hallucinating the final scene as the restaurant scene is the exact same dream he spoke about earlier in the movie.

**Souj** · 2012-07-27 10:28

Then some people are retarded.

**Tyrath** · 2012-07-27 10:30

Some people try to dig way too deep for shit. Nolan gave Bruce a happy ending, get over it. Batman dying would've been terrible given the sad sad moment Alfred had at the grave. I'm glad Alfred got what he wanted.

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