No class in WI as teachers protest union-busting governor

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

Why do you keep focusing on this years budget surplus archi? It's pointless when there's 3.6 billion deficit the next two. That's why Walker is doing this.

[Esvedium]

They pay union dues just like everyone else.

Union dues legally can NOT go to the political campaigns. If republicans are union members in WI and don't want to donate any of their money to supporting Democrats (which they have to know is where their money is going if they do), they can opt out of donating any of their pay to the PAC, which is what unions use for funding political campaigns. Not shockingly, you're wrong once again.

Why do you keep focusing on this years budget surplus archi? It's pointless when there's 3.6 billion deficit the next two. That's why Walker is doing this.

Because he CREATED the defecit by giving huge tax cuts to big businesses, and is now using the defecit to justify union busting as a "budget" issue, which he can't do anymore, because the union members have agreed to his budgetary demands.

[Olo401]

State employees however, don't have the same disadvantages. That's because politicians don't have a profit incentive as businesses do.

They don't?! Contracting the work out non-bid style to their own company or their buddies' company that gave a nice plump campaign donation, that will pay 32-hour part-time workers minimum wage with no benefits isn't a profit incentive?

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

Union dues legally can NOT go to the political campaigns. If republicans are union members in WI and don't want to donate any of their money to supporting Democrats (which they have to know is where their money is going if they do), they can opt out of donating any of their pay to the PAC, which is what unions use for funding political campaigns. Not shockingly, you're wrong once again.

Because he CREATED the defecit by giving huge tax cuts to big businesses, and is now using the defecit to justify union busting as a "budget" issue, which he can't do anymore, because the union members have agreed to his budgetary demands.

Then how do unions give so much money to Dem's?

According to Artchi's math he gave a roughly 200 mill tax break. That doesn't explain the other 3 billion.

[Esvedium]

Then how do unions give so much money to Dem's?

According to Artchi's math he gave a roughly 200 mill tax break. That doesn't explain the other 3 billion.

PAC. Voluntary donation that can be deducted from their payroll. Union dues are not legally allowed to be used for campaign donations. Dues are used to run the unions.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Campaig...union_activity

[Delta_9]

Rhode Island fired their teachers. 2,000 of em. heh.

Pink slipped and no one was fired as of yet. Came out with a statement saying there COULD be layoffs.

That doesn't explain the other 3 billion.

Unfunded liabilities.

Regardless it's deceitful for the governor to claim a deficit after the tax break.

[guartz]

Union dues legally can NOT go to the political campaigns. If republicans are union members in WI and don't want to donate any of their money to supporting Democrats (which they have to know is where their money is going if they do), they can opt out of donating any of their pay to the PAC, which is what unions use for funding political campaigns. Not shockingly, you're wrong once again.

bullshit, advocacy ads and campaign workers come from union dues and skip PAC entirely because they are not direct contributions. bullshit bullshit bullshit

[Olo401]

Rhode Island fired their teachers. 2,000 of em. heh.

Just the city of Providence.. not the entire state heh.

Pink slipped and no one was fired as of yet. Came out with a statement saying there COULD be layoffs.

Well the city school board voted last night to make the layoffs official as of the end of this school year, without any kind of attempt at negotiation as far as I can tell and without any real approval from the new mayor or city council. You can be sure that the city isn't gonna lay off the entire faculty, but there are gonna be some big cuts coming.

[Olo401]

bullshit, advocacy ads and campaign workers come from union dues and skip PAC entirely because they are not direct contributions. bullshit bullshit bullshit

And you're so certain why? I bet Ronnie Raygun and his five-ring worshipping circus told you.

Union dues go to three main things - operations budget for the overall union and local (staff, offices, meeting places) legal defense fund for the local (aka the war chest), and a fund to support members of the local that go on strike and their families. Optional additional support from the members goes to the defense & support funds as well as the political action fund. Donations to a union's PAC are only used for legal defense or political action (donations to candidates, paying to organize mass non-strike marches).

[finitek]

oh man this thread...

And you wonder why people cant come to any consensus. Corrupt politicians give their fat cat corporate friends tax cuts, hey UNIONS are the real problem pay no attention to the man(the gubner) giving away the money the state already had... But yeah those durn public employees damn them. They keep the mess running and teach our kids, what use are they?

[guartz]

And you're so certain why? I bet Ronnie Raygun and his five-ring worshipping circus told you.

Union dues go to three main things - operations budget for the overall union and local (staff, offices, meeting places) legal defense fund for the local (aka the war chest), and a fund to support members of the local that go on strike and their families. Optional additional support from the members goes to the defense & support funds as well as the political action fund. Donations to a union's PAC are only used for legal defense or political action (donations to candidates, paying to organize mass non-strike marches).

and 527 groups, which tallies in millions for democrats in Wisconsin.

[guartz]

Listen, I'm not trying to bash one group or another, believe me when I say I hate both parties and the entire system with a passion. I'm just trying to lift bias goggles you guys seem to wear, and situations like these prove to be a great opportunity to highlight the corrupt scheme otherwise known as politics in America. Both parties are corrupt as fucking hell, and these protesters are just lapdogs of one faction and don't even know it.

So when you vote next, don't be like 'well, at least democrats are less evil' no, they are all evil as fuck, vote 3rd party or don't vote at all, at least you'll have a clear conscience that you didnt give tacit consent for this clusterfuck of a rape scheme.

[Olo401]

and 527 groups, which tallies in millions for democrats in Wisconsin.

Yeah and? 527s/PACs may get donations from the union's PAC or its members (of their own free will), but not from the union using dues money.

Listen, I'm not trying to bash one group or another, believe me when I say I hate both parties and the entire system with a passion. I'm just trying to lift bias goggles you guys seem to wear, and situations like these prove to be a great opportunity to highlight the corrupt scheme otherwise known as politics in America. Both parties are corrupt as fucking hell, and these protesters are just lapdogs of one faction and don't even know it.

There's no bias goggles here. Your facts are just plain wrong - Unions don't use member dues as donations to politicians. And if you really thing the motivations of the protesters are to promote a political agenda rather than to save their collective rights, their jobs, and a century and a half of hard-fought improvements in how ALL workers are treated then you're mental.

[Kuya]

I don't give a fuck about a clear conscience. That's the same as praying. It's pure masturbation.

[Valisk]

No. Police and firefighter unions both supported walker in his election and are now, shockingly, exempt from his union busting.

that just goes to show you, if the union leaders were less biased in the political affiliation this sort of thing could have been avoided. Oh the seeds people sow on your behalf without you having a say in it.

You don't see the hypocrisy in your statement?

[SwampdonkeyPLD]

So union dues can still be funneled to politicians?

[Esvedium]

So union dues can still be funneled to politicians?

/facepalm

No.

[Demosthenes11]

holy fuck swamp/guartz

this is some of the biggest nonsense and garbage I have read on the internet.

*Someone says something*
*You have preconceived feelings on issue*
*You share unrelated, preconceived feelings, ignoring everyone else*
*Facepalms*
*continue blabbing about same thing and weird tangents*

edit: republicans in the WI house passed the bill today in a split second vote, and then walked out of the chambers without saying a word. If I lived in WI right now you bet your ass my ass would be at the capital. Do work archi

[archibaldcrane]

Why do you keep focusing on this years budget surplus archi?

Because the reason he's saying we need an emergency "budget repair bill" right now is because we have a 137M deficit this year.

There is a more significant deficit coming up in the next two years, as you noted, and in a situation like that it's important for state worker unions to be flexible with compensation - say - taking an 8% cut in total compensation, which is pretty dramatic. However, they've agreed to such a cut for the good of the state.

Tell me again why he needs to virtually eliminate collective bargaining? The unions aren't being unreasonable here - they're accepting the entirety of the proposed compensation cut to do their part to help the deficit. I'm pointing out the hypocrisy of slashing tax rates for businesses and then crying that there's a deficit.

You don't have to like unions, or public sector unions specifically - but they accepted furlough days in the past two years to help stabilize the budget, now they're accepting 8% cuts to help the budget - these are not the unions you need to worry about as far as being rigid and unreasonable. My dad was a public schoolteacher and my mom was a nurse. Guess how many times they went on strike their entire lives?

0.

And that's not because Wisconsin is some hippie liberal haven where pro-union compensation issues get railroaded. Since I was born in 1980, we've had a Republican governor for 19 of 31 years. Walker is trying to destroy the unions as a political move, not a financial one. If this isn't abundantly clear once you realize he's pushing to destroy them even after all the monetary concessions have been given, and he's only destroying the unions who didn't support him in his election efforts, I don't know what else to say to you.

[archibaldcrane]

If I lived in WI right now you bet your ass my ass would be at the capital. Do work archi

I'm doing all I can on lolfacebook and whatever, but it's hard and I feel kind of helpless living here in California now.

Unless 3 Republican senators can be convinced to go against the governor, all these protests will be for naught.

edit:
Because it got taken down before:

Start at 2:14.